Alfa Romeo to enter F1 2018? - HAAS

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14th July 2017, 19:42
jgonzalesm6

Alfa Romeo to enter F1 2018? - HAAS

Haas may use Alfa Romeo power in 2018

Alfa Romeo could enter Formula 1 in 2018 as an engine supplier to Haas F1 according to Germany's Auto Bild. This follows a statement from Ferrari's president Sergio Marchionne, who said that the name "should be reiterated as a sports brand and consider the possibility to race in F1." Marchionne also added that this return would be in collaboration with Ferrari.

In the report from Auto Bild, it is suggested that Haas' customer engines from Ferrari would bear the name of Alfa Romeo and that this in turn, could allow the Italian automotive giant to place Antonio Giovinazzi at Haas due to the Italian driver being Ferrari's reserve for 2017.

Haas joined Formula 1 in 2016 and is the newest team on the current grid. Its drivers currently are Romain Grosjean, and Kevin Magnussen, while Giovinazzi is undertaking testing roles for the team which will see him take part in a number of FP1 sessions for the remainder of 2017 - the first of which will be this weekend at the British Grand Prix. With Kevin Magnussen signed at the team in 2018 however, and with it looking probable that Grosjean will continue his relationship with the American outfit, it is hard to imagine that Giovinazzi could join the team next season.

https://www.f1today.net/en/news/f1/2...-power-in-2018
15th July 2017, 13:34
mark p

Ferrari saving LeClerc for themselves? Put him straight in a Ferrari like McLaren put Hamilton straight in. LeClerc v Verstappen will be an epic F1 rivalry within the next few years. Alfa should by the McLaren F1 entry. The owners of McLaren will soon be selling bits off like the roadcars. They will liquidate all McLaren assets now Ron has gone.
15th July 2017, 14:36
jgonzalesm6

Quote:

Originally Posted by mark p

Ferrari saving LeClerc for themselves? Put him straight in a Ferrari like McLaren put Hamilton straight in. LeClerc v Verstappen will be an epic F1 rivalry within the next few years. Alfa should by the McLaren F1 entry. The owners of McLaren will soon be selling bits off like the roadcars. They will liquidate all McLaren assets now Ron has gone.

Quote:

Ferrari saving LeClerc for themselves?

.....yup

Quote:

LeClerc v Verstappen will be an epic F1 rivalry within the next few years.

definitely

Quote:

Alfa should by the McLaren F1 entry

or at least supply them engines either Alfa or Ferrari engines. Also Sauber as well. So Ferrari, Haas, Mclaren, and

Sauber meaning 4 proxy votes which means from a strategic standpoint, can turn the FIA into their favor.

Quote:

The owners of McLaren will soon be selling bits off like the roadcars. They will liquidate all McLaren assets now Ron has gone

...Interesting, did'nt look at it

that way.
15th July 2017, 15:30
kshitijmalkan

Dear mods,

I think we can combine the Sauber Honda, Alfa to F1 topics.

In my opinion they are all really tied into the political situation in F1 at the moment which may lead to Alfa entering into F1.

I don't think Haas is a good option for Alfa, partly due to their strong position. No disrespect to anyone, Alfa is a brand of passion rather than a brand of quality or brand of logic. Just look at their road car line up. They only have a couple of models which are doing decent, while they are turning things around even the new Ghibli is a disappointment.

F1 will offer Alfa good exposure and bring back the heritage value to their products, might turn things around for them. But for the moment Alfa will only be a sister team. Rebranded Ferrari engines can be supplied to smaller teams in a cost effective manner to buy Ferrari proxy votes. Sauber is a ideal candidate. If prices correctly others can follow in years to follow.

McLaren on ther other hand would be a direct competitor on and off the track and no leading manufacturer will want to sell engines to them. Alfa is a good option for them till Honda get their act together. The old Ferrari engines are much better than the Honda OEMs, thus it will be a win-win for all, just less so for McLaren who will want to jump ship at the first hint of a better engine.

Lastly, with regards to upcoming drivers, Sauber can have them with the engines as a part of the team, again a win-win for all. LeClerc is amazing and I do agree get him in a Ferrari ASAP, but I doubt Ferrari will want to gamble with a inexperienced driver at the helm.

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15th July 2017, 15:42
jgonzalesm6

Quote:

Originally Posted by kshitijmalkan

LeClerc is amazing and I do agree get him in a Ferrari ASAP, but I doubt Ferrari will want to gamble with a inexperienced driver at the helm.

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Or in one of Ferrari's B team for the moment. Plus Ferrari would have to supply a technical staff for the Alfa engines should what we have discussed on this thread fall through.
15th July 2017, 17:01
kshitijmalkan

Quote:

Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6

Or in one of Ferrari's B team for the moment. Plus Ferrari would have to supply a technical staff for the Alfa engines should what we have discussed on this thread fall through.

I don't think a B team is a solution which is viable given the uncertainties facing the sport. Red bull have done it as it offered their brand a larger presence and hey have spades of money floating about in their marketing department.

Ferrari have a few crucial issues which need addressing. A B team as you say, I think it's more to do with increased political stature, which has been lost with the flux in regulations over the last decade, all designed conveniently to destroy ferrari position with the setup.

Mercedes have gained with the loss, Ferrari cannot compete financially with Mercedes (if anyone thinks they can, I'm sorry but get a reality check) and need to find another angle into keeping their stronghold. The way to do this is get more proxy votes and keep FIA/Liberty/Mercedes in check.

The other thing Ferrari need is a feeder team, in red bulls case a B Team and a Alfa supplied team can be this solution.

So I totally agree with you, get a Alfa supplied Sauber. provide them with technical support, loan your driver to them as a part of the exchange and increase the strength of your company as a whole.

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15th July 2017, 22:28
Stormy

No way McLaren can be powered by an Italian engine. It's just wrong on so many levels. What Ferrari needs to do is offer Sauber a nice deal. However, that would be hard considering Honda might give them an engine technically for free.

If Ferrari can't supply Sauber with Alfa engines, then if SM wants to bring Alfa into F1, Haas is the only option. Sure, Alfa is not really the most competitive brand, but it's still a famous name with awesome racing history. After all, the engine will still be Ferrari.
16th July 2017, 09:02
kshitijmalkan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormy

No way McLaren can be powered by an Italian engine. It's just wrong on so many levels. What Ferrari needs to do is offer Sauber a nice deal. However, that would be hard considering Honda might give them an engine technically for free.

If Ferrari can't supply Sauber with Alfa engines, then if SM wants to bring Alfa into F1, Haas is the only option. Sure, Alfa is not really the most competitive brand, but it's still a famous name with awesome racing history. After all, the engine will still be Ferrari.

While general sentiments may sway small folk like you and I. Formula 1 with all the money and all it's marketing for counterpart road departments will always be a business where cost effectiveness is closely measured/evaluated.

I am not saying this a McLaren Alfa is the way to go, certainly not as I am not privy to the numbers involved. But with a political cloud of uncertainty with regards to the 2020 rule changes and discussion over it, Ferrari are certainly far behind Mercedes in numbers, offering hem a unique position to sway votes to favour their offerings.

All I say is never say never.... let's be open to creating an environment that is constructive, increasing the presence of Ferrari. There is no use going all Donal Trump and closing the doors on all but a few (there are only a few to start off with).

Instead let's get what we can and keep a strong political stature, no use think of 2018 and 2019 and McLarens chasing us down. Think of 2020 onwards where if we don't have enough proxies now, Formula1 will in effect me Mercedes Formula and Renault/Honda/Ferrari/Audi-WV-Porsche all will be only playing second fiddle. Taking years, championships and millions in extra spending to catch up.

A case study to consider is McLaren Alfa Romeo winning the WCC with a year old engine. If that's the case, it's not all a loss.... Alfa will still be marked in history and will still rake in from the marketing.

PS - McLaren is a chassis builder, no matter how good their race cars/road cars are. As far as I know, their engines have always been produced by third party manufacturer.

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16th July 2017, 09:10
nani_s23

Quote:

Originally Posted by kshitijmalkan

While general sentiments may sway small folk like you and I. Formula 1 with all the money and all it's marketing for counterpart road departments will always be a business where cost effectiveness is closely measured/evaluated.

I am not saying this a McLaren Alfa is the way to go, certainly not as I am not privy to the numbers involved. But with a political cloud of uncertainty with regards to the 2020 rule changes and discussion over it, Ferrari are certainly far behind Mercedes in numbers, offering hem a unique position to sway votes to favour their offerings.

All I say is never say never.... let's be open to creating an environment that is constructive, increasing the presence of Ferrari. There is no use going all Donal Trump and closing the doors on all but a few (there are only a few to start off with).

Instead let's get what we can and keep a strong political stature, no use think of 2018 and 2019 and McLarens chasing us down. Think of 2020 onwards where if we don't have enough proxies now, Formula1 will in effect me Mercedes Formula and Renault/Honda/Ferrari/Audi-WV-Porsche all will be only playing second fiddle. Taking years, championships and millions in extra spending to catch up.

A case study to consider is McLaren Alfa Romeo winning the WCC with a year old engine. If that's the case, it's not all a loss.... Alfa will still be marked in history and will still rake in from the marketing.

PS - McLaren is a chassis builder, no matter how good their race cars/road cars are. As far as I know, their engines have always been produced by third party manufacturer.

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I agree with your point of increase vote power by supplying to teams who r need of cheap engines.
This is what mercs has been doing late. If this continues they will have their say more on 2020 regulation changes
16th July 2017, 09:51
harry harris

Hai Guys... I think Lorenzo Sassi is now heading to Alfa Romeo... who knows :Hmm
16th July 2017, 09:52
Stormy

Quote:

Originally Posted by kshitijmalkan

While general sentiments may sway small folk like you and I. Formula 1 with all the money and all it's marketing for counterpart road departments will always be a business where cost effectiveness is closely measured/evaluated.

I am not saying this a McLaren Alfa is the way to go, certainly not as I am not privy to the numbers involved. But with a political cloud of uncertainty with regards to the 2020 rule changes and discussion over it, Ferrari are certainly far behind Mercedes in numbers, offering hem a unique position to sway votes to favour their offerings.

All I say is never say never.... let's be open to creating an environment that is constructive, increasing the presence of Ferrari. There is no use going all Donal Trump and closing the doors on all but a few (there are only a few to start off with).

Instead let's get what we can and keep a strong political stature, no use think of 2018 and 2019 and McLarens chasing us down. Think of 2020 onwards where if we don't have enough proxies now, Formula1 will in effect me Mercedes Formula and Renault/Honda/Ferrari/Audi-WV-Porsche all will be only playing second fiddle. Taking years, championships and millions in extra spending to catch up.

A case study to consider is McLaren Alfa Romeo winning the WCC with a year old engine. If that's the case, it's not all a loss.... Alfa will still be marked in history and will still rake in from the marketing.

PS - McLaren is a chassis builder, no matter how good their race cars/road cars are. As far as I know, their engines have always been produced by third party manufacturer.

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I get what you are saying. However, the historic rivalry between Ferrari (Italy) and the other British teams (McLaren in particular) is good for the sport. Supplying them with Alfa engines may hurt this rivalry. Ferrari has Haas and let's hope it will stay that way. Other teams that may be swayed is Force India. They are based in Britain but are a new team that doesn't have any historical significance.
16th July 2017, 11:03
kshitijmalkan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormy

I get what you are saying. However, the historic rivalry between Ferrari (Italy) and the other British teams (McLaren in particular) is good for the sport. Supplying them with Alfa engines may hurt this rivalry. Ferrari has Haas and let's hope it will stay that way. Other teams that may be swayed is Force India. They are based in Britain but are a new team that doesn't have any historical significance.

Lol! I agree with you too, every inch of it.

But the slight difference in my thinking is, the rivalry in recent years at commercial and sporting fronts is between Ferrari and McLaren. Alfa is isolated! Although a subsidiary, partnering up the two brands should be an issue. Isolating Ferrari from a back lash (commercial and sporting).

The break Alfa has taken from sporting means a large part of its heritage is now lost with the brand being massively different from the hay days.

Mercedes, from the silver arrow days have no real fans (relatively speaking) majority are McLaren fans who carried over with Hamilton.

I used to like Hamilton when he first joined (for a few races) and used to like Mercedes when Brawn was taken over, Ferrari was always the team for me though. You cannot love a team and not appreciate what others do.

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16th July 2017, 11:41
Stormy

Quote:

Originally Posted by kshitijmalkan

Lol! I agree with you too, every inch of it.

But the slight difference in my thinking is, the rivalry in recent years at commercial and sporting fronts is between Ferrari and McLaren. Alfa is isolated! Although a subsidiary, partnering up the two brands should be an issue. Isolating Ferrari from a back lash (commercial and sporting).

I don't know man, it will still be a Ferrari engine going under the Alfa brand. It will be way too weird and most people will be aware that McLaren has a Ferrari engine inside. McLaren are desperate but not that desperate. They still have Merc as an option which is much better than going with an Alfa branded Ferrari engine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kshitijmalkan

Mercedes, from the silver arrow days have no real fans (relatively speaking) majority are McLaren fans who carried over with Hamilton.

Well, i think this is a bit of an understatement. Many McLaren fans back in the Merc days were actually for Mercedes in the first place who jumped ship when Merc made their own team.