Ferrari F2012 Development News Thread

[ferrari4life]

Ah what a waste of a day should be Alonso for day 2 as well.

seriously.. what a waste that Alonso should require a team to drive for... He should be able to build a car and drive it and not have to rely on anyone.

[Ferrari_Fanatic]

Ah what a waste of a day should be Alonso for day 2 as well.

[ferrari1.8t]

Ah what a waste of a day should be Alonso for day 2 as well.

Here we go again...I'll be the first to say it: lets keep the massa vs alonso debate out of the news and development thread.

[Nova]

Ah what a waste of a day should be Alonso for day 2 as well.

[Dino]

6 tenths in race pace would be a great gain

It would be a great gain but will not be enough eventually.

...TRACK.......LAPS.........WINNER........OUR CAR.....POSITION.........GAP..................AVER AGE PER LAP
AUSTRALIA.....58...........BUTTON.........ALONSO.. ..........5.........21.5 seconds.............0.371 seconds.
MALASIA........56...........ALONSO................ .................................................. .............................
CHINA...........56...........ROSBERG........ALONSO ............9........37.2 seconds..............0.664 seconds.
BAHRAIN........57...........VETTEL..........ALONSO ............7........57.8 seconds..............1.014 seconds.

By the fourth race the gap has been rising steadily from 0.371 to 1.014 seconds even though Ferrari have been improving!!!!
You might say that it does make a big difference when the leader is running in clean air while Alonso is following or defending from another car and I agree.
Ferrari will have to improve by 1 whole second at least and then they will maybe be near enough to challenge for the first row on the grid at Barcellona..Let's hope.....

[underdog13]

Ah what a waste of a day should be Alonso for day 2 as well.

Go troll somewhere else.

[hogo]

We need INNOVATIONS, slight improvements aka copy/paste won't do us any good. Look at our pit stops, we innovated and now we are the best at them. But can we create something no one else has in such a short period of time? I don't think so, well we couldn't in half a year so there's no hope now either imo.

[FFFerrari]

Ferrari will have to improve by 1 whole second at least and then they will maybe be near enough to challenge for the first row on the grid at Barcellona..Let's hope.....

In Barcelona passing is all but impossible. It is also known as the "car track" where you need all the qualities of the perfect car to get a perfect lap. A long straight that demands top speed, high speed corners, low speed corners, need of great traction out of corners. 1 second would put as at the top of the grid, .500 would put us likely in the first or second row.

[F2002]

We need INNOVATIONS, slight improvements aka copy/paste won't do us any good. Look at our pit stops, we innovated and now we are the best at them. But can we create something no one else has in such a short period of time? I don't think so, well we couldn't in half a year so there's no hope now either imo.

That's unless we had something really good in winter testing, tested it, didn't work, and now having refined it are ready to put it in place.

You'd always have to think that there is that one thing that will improve things dramatically, or at least we all hope there is.

[sam101]

And all the upgrades planned for Barcelona will not be tested in Mugello !!!! So let's hope the bits that are tested at Mugello next week delivers that 0.5 sec - and assuming the mercs and bulls and the rest improve by a smaller margin - we're in for for PR until Barcelona. Let's keep the faith shall we!!

[Naeem]

It would be a great gain but will not be enough eventually.

...TRACK.......LAPS.........WINNER........OUR CAR.....POSITION.........GAP..................AVER AGE PER LAP
AUSTRALIA.....58...........BUTTON.........ALONSO.. ..........5.........21.5 seconds.............0.371 seconds.
MALASIA........56...........ALONSO................ .................................................. .............................
CHINA...........56...........ROSBERG........ALONSO ............9........37.2 seconds..............0.664 seconds.
BAHRAIN........57...........VETTEL..........ALONSO ............7........57.8 seconds..............1.014 seconds.

By the fourth race the gap has been rising steadily from 0.371 to 1.014 seconds even though Ferrari have been improving!!!!
You might say that it does make a big difference when the leader is running in clean air while Alonso is following or defending from another car and I agree.
Ferrari will have to improve by 1 whole second at least and then they will maybe be near enough to challenge for the first row on the grid at Barcellona..Let's hope.....

safety car(s) in australia

[Naeem]

Any news from the oracle (Jose Luis)?

[Hornet]

And all the upgrades planned for Barcelona will not be tested in Mugello !!!! So let's hope the bits that are tested at Mugello next week delivers that 0.5 sec - and assuming the mercs and bulls and the rest improve by a smaller margin - we're in for for PR until Barcelona. Let's keep the faith shall we!!

Where did you here this?

I hope its just a rumor. There's some serious problem in Ferrari if we can't even get those new parts out by next week after 2 months since winter testing.

[Crucial_Xtreme]

Where did you here this?

I hope its just a rumor. There's some serious problem in Ferrari if we can't even get those new parts out by next week after 2 months since winter testing.

Domenicali:

"The coming days will be very important, during which the primary objective will be to push as hard as possible on the development of the car: next week we have three days of testing at Mugello, but it’s not definite that all the updates planned for Barcelona will be seen then. We must try and make the most of every minute available to us to increase the performance of the F2012.”

Link--> http://www.ferrari.com/English/Formu...de-Europe.aspx

Which is fine with me, I don't mind them using all available time to get the car right. I'm sure they have a plan and feel confident in it playing out correctly as long as the updates work. :)

[Hornet]

Thanks. I wonder what we'll see at Mugello then

[Crucial_Xtreme]

Thanks. I wonder what we'll see at Mugello then

I think we'll see most of the updates in Mugello, but I also think some they're working on won't be ready until Spain. Development is a never ending process so it's expected. Also they may have a few things in mind and have a proto of a few pieces, and if they work well in Mugello they send them to manufacturing to have them ready by Spain.

Here are some of the F2012 Technical Updates & Analysis for recent GP's

[scuderiafan]

Thanks. I wonder what we'll see at Mugello then

I think we shall see a lot. Seems like a lot more than the chrome guys.

Jenson content to miss test as there "aren't any massive updates to try"

http://www1.skysports.com/formula-1/...it-out-Mugello

I guess they just want to work out the tyres, and make sure their simulator is working. And judging by Paddy Lowe's comments, they do not seems to want this test.
I don't like McLaren, never have, but always respected them. But lost a bit of respect with the 'Williams/HRT' stance to testing from me. I know they like their simulator, but testing makes sense.

Anyways, sorry about that, a bit off topic, but maybe We can make a nice step, if they aren't bringing much, if this was RedBull, I'd have my slat ready, but this is McLaren, the kitchen sink team and JB, who goes on his twitter daily to tell us how 'tasty' the new parts are every day.

On Ferrari, I don't think it is a cause of worry, they will be testing what needs to be tested, but they will also be working day and night to get as many parts as possible ready for the next race, some which will be made after collecting the data in mugello with the new exhaust/sidpods whichever type they choose.

[Nova]

Hopefully the updates will work..
Last race was odd, RB have found their pace, so has Lotus..Mac on the other hand are
scratching their heads wondering where did their pace go???
At least Ferrari hasnt found any pace yet, so most updates "should" have some sort of effect.

[Ophidian786]

Bahrain has been a GP where Ferrari have always faired well. It scared me to see them so far off the pace on sunday.

You are perfectly right. The changes have to have a positive impact, surely we can't get any worse than this. I think our fastest lap in the last race was only marginally faster than the Caterhams'

Edit:

Alonso was 1 tenth faster and massa 2 tenths from petrov.

[AvantiAlonsoWDC]

Bahrain has been a GP where Ferrari have always faired well. It scared me to see them so far off the pace on sunday.

You are perfectly right. The changes have to have a positive impact, surely we can't get any worse than this. I think our fastest lap in the last race was only marginally faster than the Caterhams'

Edit:

Alonso was 1 tenth faster and massa 2 tenths from petrov.

Well,I think that's because in Bahrain you need a lot of traction as well as top speed, both things we lack at the moment and the F10 was great at. We were warned that this type of track would expose our weaknesess so I don't think it'd be fair to compare F2012's performance with previous cars' performance at Bahrain (also this car seem to inherit little from prevoious cars) . Hopefully there'll be a major step foward both in Muggello and BCN.

Forza Ferrari

[Imperatore]

Here we go again...I'll be the first to say it: lets keep the massa vs alonso debate out of the news and development thread.

Fair enough, you are correct, but it is a true statement and one echoed throughout Italy for those that don't know.

[Hombre B]

Ferrari technical director says that main problem was the car's initial error in the design of the exhaust exits

No one hides in the Ferrari that these next few weeks will be crucial for the team. Tests Mugello next week, and the Barcelona race should determine whether the Scuderia be able to improve enough to fight for the championship this year.

Pat Fry, head coach of the team, ensures that the Italians already know what the problems, but stresses that the solutions will not come overnight.

"I think we have a reasonable understanding of the areas that need work. There is a light that we can connect and solve everything. You can know what's wrong, but you must work hard to solve it. And it's not something you do in a week. "

Fry says that the greatest obstacle in the beginning of the season was the need to redesign the exhaust after the initial solution proves ineffective. This caused several areas of the back of the car had to be rethought.

"There are different problems, and the most obvious was the difficulty we had with the rear tires due to our original exhaust system still in pre-season. Hopefully by now overcome that - although we have not used that setting from the Barcelona test. "

Even assuming that Ferrari will change your car for the very next race in Spain, Fry does not want to cause expectations about a significant improvement. "There will be a lot of new parts in Barcelona. It's a race of development. But we have so many new features as our rivals. "

http://www.totalrace.com.br/site/not...-resolver-tudo

[Alessandra]

Is Pat Fry a man of psychotically pessimistic disposition?

I flaming hope so!

[ferrari1.8t]

Is Pat Fry a man of psychotically pessimistic disposition?

I flaming hope so!

I hope so as well...we desperately need these updates to work.

[Gerhard Berger]

Fry is right, you can not cut corners in F1, you have to build up to a point. There rarely is a magic fix that will make you go 1 second quicker.

[Crucial_Xtreme]

Corriere dello Sport article today on the Ferrari Wind Tunnel


La galleria del vento beffa ancora la Rossa

27 aprile 2012 – La Ferrari non si sta comportando ancora da studente modello nella preparazione dell’esame di Aerodinamica, che resta il più importante e ineludibile nel corso di laurea della Formula 1. Non è questione di uomini come i recenti acquisti sul mercato dei tecnici potrebbero far pensare, ma di mezzi. Il nodo è sempre lo stesso, stretto al collo dei ferraristi: la galleria del vento, l’ormai famigerato impianto griffato Renzo Piano, che una volta era eccellenza tecnologica e oggi è puntellato per stare al passo con i tempi, sempre senza perdere d’occhio il budget. Una fortuna se n’è già andata per acquistare, installare e far funzionare il gigantesco ragno detto simulatore, quasi si trattasse di una playstation.

FALSATI Per tarare la galleria del vento non sono bastati quindici mesi. Il problema emerse nella sua serietà un anno fa, quando in Cina Stefano Domenicali spiegò il giallo dei dati falsati che quel sistema forniva. Non collimavano con la realtà della pista e pertanto quella galleria faceva solo danni: hai voglia a essere bravo come meccanico, se maneggi una chiave inglese sbeccata. Pareva tutto risolto alla fine del 2011, e invece non è così. Proprio in questi giorni la Ferrari sta procedendo a test comparativi tra la sua galleria e quella della Toyota a Colonia, tecnicamente molto evoluta e di cui Maranello è ormai assidua cliente.

SBILANCIATA Nel tunnel del vento due aspetti contano quanto i sostegni di un ponte: la pulizia della vena fluida (vilmente: il getto d’aria, che dev’essere uniforme come il muro di vento contro il quale la macchina si scontra) e il sistema delle bilance che sono quattro, una per ogni ruota, in modo da poter misurare le differenze di carico sugli assi longitudinale e trasversale. Questo sistema non funge ancora come dovrebbe: è stato risolto il complesso problema delle vibrazioni, ma non ci siamo con la taratura delle bilance quando il carico aerodinamico raggiunge i valori più alti. Ecco perché la F2012 non è così male sui tratti tortuosi – i problemi sono tutti di trazione in uscita dalle curve – mentre nei rettilinei prende il vento a testate, risultando più lenta della concorrenza anche di dieci chilometri all’ora. I patimenti dell’aerodinamica posteriore, l’instabilità della macchina, la tendenza a masticare e sputar via velocemente le gomme, lo stesso rafforzamento del reparto
proprio pochi giorni fa è stato preso il greco Ben Agathangelou – sono tutti figli di questo tallone d’Achille. L’incubo cominciò verso la fine del 2010 quando il vertice tecnico della Ferrari, scoperta la falla, si chiese se cambiare l’intero sistema o ritararlo. Si optò per la seconda soluzione ritenendola certamente più economica e, s’immaginò allora, anche più rapida, considerati i tempi lunghi che avrebbe richiesto un impianto ex novo per togliersi il vizio che tutti i macchinari sofisticati palesano alla nascita: dire bugie.

Fonte: Il Corriere dello Sport (articolo a firma di Fulvio Solms)

[Ophidian786]

I don't know what the above says, but if we have a wind tunnel problem this year, I'm gonna explode.

[f300v10]

I don't know what the above says, but if we have a wind tunnel problem this year, I'm gonna explode.

Reading the article via google translate, it basically says the Ferrari tunnel has issues with a distorted flow field, and with the scale/balance system used to measure the forces on the car. It also implies it would be costly and time consuming to fix the issues, and that Ferrari is again doing comparison tests with the Toyota tunnel.

[Ferrari Man]

Reading the article via google translate, it basically says the Ferrari tunnel has issues with a distorted flow field, and with the scale/balance system used to measure the forces on the car. It also implies it would be costly and time consuming to fix the issues, and that Ferrari is again doing comparison tests with the Toyota tunnel.

Ah here!!!!

[Jas]

found this intresting, particually about massa in the first few lines!!!

Ferrari

No matter what he is faced with, Fernando Alonso continues to defy logic and be utterly brilliant. He may have Felipe Massa driving the other car, but engineers in the team have pointed out that Massa’s data matches his driving in 2008, when he was winning races. There is no other way to describe Alonso other than a magician. During pre-season testing, it was obvious that the F2012 was not the car Ferrari wanted. It was by no means a no-hoper, but to a team that harbour ambitions of winning the title for the first time since 2008, it was as bad as it gets. Qualifying in Australia was their nadir, when a furious Alonso misjudged his braking point and got stuck in the gravel. But since then he has performed excellently; his drive in Malaysia may have been overshadowed by the equal brilliance of Perez, but it should go down in history as one of the all-time great performances. Felipe Massa’s season has been next to disastrous. There was a telling photo in Malaysia: Alonso was crossing the line to win, a couple of seconds ahead of Ferrari Academy Driver Perez. A few seconds ahead of Alonso was Massa, just shy of being lapped. Massa’s problems are exacerbated considering the closeness of the field. He may only be a few tenths behind Alonso on occasion, but that’s all it takes to be out of Q2 rather than inside Q3. Points in Bahrain were well received, but it’s difficult to envisage Massa remaining at Ferrari – or even Formula One – next season. For Alonso, the rest of the season will be about dragging every remaining tenth out of the F2012 and push for better results. The championship is all but out of reach, despite only a ten point deficit to Vettel, and focus has to go on 2013: firstly to give Alonso a car capable of the crown and secondly a driver who can consistently back him up