Full Member
If Ferrari has a new rear wing that can balance the front one which has been on and off for the last races they will use them both in Hungary.Originally Posted by Fer12
Alonso did not prefer the new front wing because it was upsetting the rear of the car.A more aggressive rear wing may solve that.
It does not matter if it rains or not this track is a high downforce one.
Full Member
is it a new update?
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Full Member
Nah..its been there on the car(page 88).They have screwed it down properly
Banned
Since 2009, our wings have looked like lego, compared to our rivals. It still hasnt changed. very basic, and the front wing IS the most crucial aero component of the car because it sets the airflow over the while car, so I think ours is a reflection of the entire aero concept. Basic, and lacking, which is why without Alonso's genius, this would be called the worst Ferrari in the last 30 years.
Banned
nowhere? williams has been a rocketship all season, and is still probably quicker than us. lucky it has rubbish drivers who keep messing up.
Full Member
I don't think Williams is quicker than us ... based on Massa's pace in races ...
I'm surprised that no team has copied the axle angle concept of the Williams gearbox. Seems like a huge gain if you can get it to work with no compromises.
http://scarbsf1.com/blog1/2011/02/10...wline-gearbox/
Banned
I doubt williams were able to show their race pace in the last race, i seem to remember they both has issues. We will see if we get a dry qualifying this race.
Full Member
If this is true what does that mean? Sauber is faster too then because they have shown excellent pace throughout the season versus Williams. Then of course that would mean Lotus is quicker than us too, and RB and McLaren. Even Mercedes have had plenty of races where they have shown similar and sometimes better pace then Williams.
In my mind implying Williams has true front runner pace, meaning being fast in ALL conditions is saying that Ferrari is a midfield team which we clearly aren't.
What is true of this season is that the gaps are very small from the front runners down to the end of the midfield.
Banned
Being fast in all conditons is dependant on the driver as well. Don't forget in the last dry qualifying, we didnt make the top 10. I personally think our car is still at the level of williams, sauber, which is a step behind lotus, redbull, and now mclaren. The main difference is that all these drivers have been making mistakes while alonso has been like a machine. If all these teams get it right on the same weekend, we could struggle. There is a big pack of cars all very close in speed, so difference is small enough for a driver like alonso to make the difference.
Alonso Maniac
Personally,I dont think williams is faster than ferrari..
ever since the major upgrade in Canada ferrari have definitely overcome williams and sauber in terms of performance
Full Member
I don't think an overly complicated wing is necessarily better. Maybe Ferrari don't need as much downforce from their front wing as Williams. Remember the Front wing is also responsible for directing air flow to the rear of the car where most of the downforce is produced, and Ferrari's philosophy is to run as much air under the car as possible, hence the pullrod suspension and large air gap under the nose... a wing like Williams may compromise that air flow.
Full Member
@ Oracle,
I do not agree. There is always the issue of balancing "Drag" which a wing with many elements most often has more "Drag". This not desirable! The Front Wing like the Rear Wing are designed to have greatest amount of Downforce but the lowest amount of Drag. the shape of the Wing also influences and can create Vortices of turbulant Air Flow about the race car.
Ciao.
Forza Ferrari!!!!
Full Member
it may look as plain black and white, unlike other front wings that looks complicated. its effectiveness that counts, there is about two of three teams that have more sophisticated front wings but they are struggling with their pace
Hell would have broken loose
Full Member
Alonso saying we've pretty much had the same car for 3 or 4 races and we need BIG upgrades to keep the title lead!
Alonso: It seems everyone keeps forgetting we are not quick
Fernando Alonso in the Ferrari pit garage during qualifying for the Hungarian GP
Jul.28 (Reuters) According to championship leader Fernando Alonso this year’s Formula 1 season defies any logic with team’s performances oscillating dramatically from race to race, and reiterating that the Ferrari F2012 is not quick.
Alonso, who leads by 34 points even though his Ferrari is widely considered to be slower than the cars of his Red Bull and McLaren rivals, said there was no point in trying to make a deep analysis.
The Spaniard, world champion in 2005 and 2006, will start on the third row for Sunday’s Hungarian Grand Prix. But, having won the European Grand Prix from even further down the grid, Alonso said anything was possible.
“In Valencia, we started 11th and won the race,” he told reporters. “It’s impossible to explain because you win one race and the next, you’re in a bad position.
“There’s no analysis. You can try and comment on what happens each weekend… but it’s a championship with no type of clear order.”
“We have seen very strange races… We were in Germany one week ago and Sauber was the second or third fastest car in dry conditions and here they were one and a half seconds (per lap) slower,” he said after the Swiss team failed to get a car in the top 10 of qualifying.
“We change race by race and day by day. Friday can be a very good day for you, Saturday bad and Sunday good and vice versa.”
The 2012 season has been one of the most open for years, partly due to the delicate Pirelli tyres which have proved a brainteaser as teams and drivers struggle to extract the most from them.
Alonso’s only certainty was that Ferrari, who benefited from wet qualifying sessions before the British and German races, need to improve in the one-month break which will follow Sunday’s race at the Hungaroring.
Even though Alonso will lead the championship into the break, regardless of the outcome in Hungary, he said the car needed improving.
“We said after Germany that we are very happy with the points we have achieved in the first 10 races but we are not happy with the performance of the car and we are honest with ourselves,” he said.
“We keep repeating this message but it seems everyone keeps forgetting we are not quick.
“This was another demonstration. We have been racing with the same car from three or four races with no new parts in the car, this is the problem. We are losing ground with the fastest cars.
“We need hopefully after the summer break to bring some updates to the car and hope they really work and close that gap, because if not it will be too much.”
Full Member
Do we have problem with wind tunnel regarding to fact that we fail to use new front wing for qual and race?
Ferrari Lover
It's been since 1981 when someone had such a big lead and didn't win the WDC.
I believe in statistics and pray in them now!
Hero's come and go, but legends never die!
Full Member
points system has changed since then.
Religion? Ferrari!
"This was another demonstration. We have been racing with the same car from three or four races with no new parts in the car, this is the problem. We are losing ground with the fastest cars."
What he hell? How is this called development? Come on, don't stop with what you were doing. Don't throw away this chance you have.
"If he can't do it with Ferrari, well, he can't do it." - John Surtees
Full Member
Fernando Alonso: “We did something better than theothers”
http://adamcooperf1.com/2012/07/29/f...an-the-others/Fernando Alonso was in upbeat mood after finishing fifth in Hungary, and he made it clear that he was delighted to have scored a good helping of points on a track which did not suit Ferrari.
Although he lost ground to some of his rivals he finished three spots ahead of Mark Webber, and he thus actually extended his advantage over the man in second place.
“I finished ahead of Button and ahead of Webber,” said Alonso. “So in the end we did something better than the others in terms of the strategy, in terms of consistency. We managed to lose one position with Vettel, to win some positions with Webber, and increase the lead in the championship. So, a very nice Sunday.”
Alonso nearly got ahead of Vettel at the start, and thereafter had a busy afternoon.
“We were quite close, but it was not possible, not enough. We needed to start on the clean side, maybe the opportunity was better. Overall the race was not easy, we were not quick, we were defending first with Webber, then with Kimi, then with Button.
“So a defending race, but I think in terms of points, a good amount of points again in a difficult weekend, because we were not quick on Friday, not quick in qualifying, not quick on Sunday, and even with that we scored a lot of points today.”
Alonso says that Ferrari has some catching up to do and suggested that Ferrari has some useful updates in the pipeline.
“We need to work. I think we saw today in dry conditions there are three teams in front of us, Lotus, McLaren, Red Bull, it has been like this all season more or less. So we need to close this gap. I think we have some nice ideas to develop in this coming weeks, and hopefully in Spa and Monza we can introduce them.”
Meanwhile he’s looking forward to the summer break: “I’m happy to relax a little bit, I think we arrive quite tired at the end of July, we had three races in four weeks, a lot of work in the factory, a lot of aeroplanes, hotels, I think we need to have two or three weeks off to relax and come back in September with the batteries full.”
In Stefano Domenicali, we have a team boss who has proved to be a leader. - Luca diMontezemelo
Full Member
It seems we have gone backwards at this race, our pace was shocking. I know Red Bull and McLaren were faster at Hockenheim, but it wasn't a completely different class, but even with Fernando's talent I can't see him beating any of the Red Bull's, McLarens or Lotus's in a normal dry weekend on a track that allows overtaking. If there was overtaking possibilities yesterday I think Alonso would have finished 7th maximum. A 40-50 point gap won't last long unless he can finish at least top 5 at each circuit.
We need some serious updates within the next 2-3 races otherwise I don't think Alonso will win the WDC, which would be a tragedy considering all his magic this season. At least the high speed tracks Spa and Monza should mean we can be more competitive against the others.
The very good news on the other hand is that Lotus in my opinion would have scored a 1-2 yesterday if there was overtaking. It could be great for the championship if Grosjean wins a couple of races. Raikkonen could emerge as a serious title contender IMO if Lotus keep the pace they showed yesterday.
Full Member
We need a massive working upgrade in order to be leading the championship...
Yesterday Mclaren and Lotus took over the lead for constructors championship from us...
If we compare last two years upgrades that Ferrari brought at SPA...both failed to deliver performance...so are we going to have any updates for SPA this year...
We are still lagging behind in the straight line speed and traction control....
AKROCKS
Salut Gilles
No don't think they will bother with any updates since according to you they never work anyway. In 2010 Alonso spun out at Spa when in good position, and then won the next 2 races but nothing ever works I guess
Forza Ferrari
Full Member
RedBull were struggling as well, if they weren't on 3 stops their pace would probably have been similar to Fernando.
I just don't know what happened there in Hungary.
I guess there has been a bit of a delay in developments, so hopefully the summer break can mean we get on top of that now.
In Stefano Domenicali, we have a team boss who has proved to be a leader. - Luca diMontezemelo
Salut Gilles
And vice versa if we went on 3 stops we might have been on Red Bull pace.
Forza Ferrari
Banned
I don't think 3 stops was the way to go given the nature of the circuit. One thing I found strange about the race was that Alonso only found pace in the final third of the race...
Full Member
Ferrari performance this season so far:
1-4 races Started worst...
At Barcelona we were Ok...
At Canada we were good...
Then at Valencia we were good...
Silverstone and Germany we were ok....
At Hungary we are below Ok and above bad....
What at SPA ?
AKROCKS
Banned
Silverstone and Germany, ok?
The car was good at those races.
Full Member
no one knows how we're going to be at Spa; only Ferrari know what upgrades they're going to bring, and how WELL they're going to work??? i guess we'll find out in friday practice.
one thing is for sure, we DEPEND on this next (hopefully) BIG upgrade and more importantly it HAS to work in order to maintain our lead in the WDC, otherwise we're slowly going to lose it towards rivals like Lewis and Vettel...
having said that, i have faith in our TEAM that they're going to do a good job at bringing our car in terms of performance where it belongs, AT THE TOP...
So 2023 started off bad, but managed to claw back some lap time come end of the year. Lets hope SF24 will give us tifosi something to smile about.
Full Member
we need normal working updates...just like McLaren and Lotus introduced in last races and are again quicker more than 0.5s
If our updates after the break again work only if temperature is 23.4 exactly, and if Alonso finds exactly 5 fourleaf clovers on a field north-west from the driver camp, and if tyres on our cars produce exactly 125,5 gm graining, and if Scuhmacher forgets to take pills and Kimi 3 Magnums, and if....well you know what I mean :)
We need to push push push even make small excursions into gray area (fine with me, just look at RBs they're trying ANYTHING)...
Full Member
But our rivals were better than us...so it can be good..it has to be ok... and if i were to say good then its only because of Fernando...but not the car...
AKROCKS
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