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Thread: The Reality Of The Situation

  1. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suzie View Post
    Remembered a quote from Piero Ferrari at Wrooom this year:

    "I think that today there are many good drivers, two or three who can be described as exceptional and one of them, Fernando, is one of us. We also have Felipe who is a great guy, held in great affection at Ferrari, who has shown that, even alongside an extraordinary driver like Schumacher, with a good car, he too can also be very quick: it is up to us to create the right conditions and maybe we owe him something."

    This

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  2. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suzie View Post
    Remembered a quote from Piero Ferrari at Wrooom this year:

    "I think that today there are many good drivers, two or three who can be described as exceptional and one of them, Fernando, is one of us. We also have Felipe who is a great guy, held in great affection at Ferrari, who has shown that, even alongside an extraordinary driver like Schumacher, with a good car, he too can also be very quick: it is up to us to create the right conditions and maybe we owe him something."

    That's a good quote Suzie but I don't really think loyalty has anything to do with it. Ferrari has been loyal to Massa and I think everyone knows that and would not accuse them of not being so if they fired him today. F1 is a tough business and tough decisions like that are made everyday.

    I think it is a matter of Ferrari knowing what is best at this point. They know Massa's bad season of last was not really of his making, what with the bad pit stops and Hamilton constantly running over him. They know their options are limited if they are thinking of replacing him. They also know one race is not something to make a judgement on and at this time and firing Massa just for the sake of getting rid of him is not in the team's best interest.

    I do agree with something you said earlier though that it probably doesn't matter what Massa does this season, he's probably gone at season's end. I think the way we will know if Ferrari thinks Massa just isn't up to the job anymore will be if towards the end of the season they put someone else in the car, and I'm thinking that someone else would be Bianchi.

    edit :

    Something I forgot to add, Piero is right in that if Ferrari gives Massa a good car, he will do much better. And they do "owe" him a better car, just like many say they do Alonso.


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  3. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by REDARMYSOJA View Post
    That's a good quote Suzie but I don't really think loyalty has anything to do with it. Ferrari has been loyal to Massa and I think everyone knows that and would not accuse them of not being so if they fired him today. F1 is a tough business and tough decisions like that are made everyday.

    I think it is a matter of Ferrari knowing what is best at this point. They know Massa's bad season of last was not really of his making, what with the bad pit stops and Hamilton constantly running over him. They know their options are limited if they are thinking of replacing him. They also know one race is not something to make a judgement on and at this time and firing Massa just for the sake of getting rid of him is not in the team's best interest.

    I do agree with something you said earlier though that it probably doesn't matter what Massa does this season, he's probably gone at season's end. I think the way we will know if Ferrari thinks Massa just isn't up to the job anymore will be if towards the end of the season they put someone else in the car, and I'm thinking that someone else would be Bianchi.

    edit :

    Something I forgot to add, Piero is right in that if Ferrari gives Massa a good car, he will do much better.
    Agree with everything you said except perhaps the word "Bianchi"


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  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by REDARMYSOJA View Post
    That's a good quote Suzie but I don't really think loyalty has anything to do with it. Ferrari has been loyal to Massa and I think everyone knows that and would not accuse them of not being so if they fired him today. F1 is a tough business and tough decisions like that are made everyday.

    I think it is a matter of Ferrari knowing what is best at this point. They know Massa's bad season of last was not really of his making, what with the bad pit stops and Hamilton constantly running over him. They know their options are limited if they are thinking of replacing him. They also know one race is not something to make a judgement on and at this time and firing Massa just for the sake of getting rid of him is not in the team's best interest.

    I do agree with something you said earlier though that it probably doesn't matter what Massa does this season, he's probably gone at season's end. I think the way we will know if Ferrari thinks Massa just isn't up to the job anymore will be if towards the end of the season they put someone else in the car, and I'm thinking that someone else would be Bianchi.

    edit :

    Something I forgot to add, Piero is right in that if Ferrari gives Massa a good car, he will do much better. And they do "owe" him a better car, just like many say they do Alonso.
    Fully agree with this.

    Replacing Massa mid-season will only add to our problems. As long as the car is not up to scratch, we just have to accept the fact that that we won't be challenging for any of the titles. If the F2012 is developed so well that Alonso is fighting for the win every race, and Massa is barely making top 10, then may be there's a point.

    But let's not forget, that without in-season testing, it will be very difficult for any driver to jump into a car half way through the season and be competitive straight away. So the best thing Ferrari can do, is whatever happens this season, at the very least stick with Massa until the end of the year, and then think about replacing him with someone else for the start of 2013.

    Let's not kid ourselves, if the car remains as difficult to drive as it was this weekend, someone like a Perez or Bianchi will get murdered next to Alonso. So no point blaming Massa really. Stability is more important to us than anything else at this stage, well apart from improving the car obviously.

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  5. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curbs View Post
    What does he deserve after Gemany 2010? I´m just curious...
    Wait a second. What did Felipe wrong in Germany 2010? Wasn't there Fernando the "bad one"? Or was I watching a different race?

    "If he can't do it with Ferrari, well, he can't do it." - John Surtees

  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by REDARMYSOJA View Post
    It is because people are angry and are looking for someone to blame. Felipe has always been an easy target for some to vent their frustration towards, but they don't look at the big picture. We don't know if there was something wrong with Felipe's car this weekend or if possible what with Ferrari still trying to sort out the F2012 they tried something with Felipe's car that wasn't the same as Alonso's car. The comments post race from Stefano and Fry seems to indicate it was one of the two.

    It's much easier though for many to just blame Felipe. But really Felipe has never been a driver to get more than a car has, but give him a good car and he can be as fast as anyone. I'm sure Ferrari knows this better than anyone and know what is really going on with Felipe, whether he is just not performing as he should or if much is due to the car.

    One thing Ferrari is NOT going to do is toss him after one race the way so many think they should. It is Ferrari that will make the decision on Felipe, so complaining about him on a message board serves no purpose other than to make the folks that do feel better. I suppose they think supporting our drivers through thick and thin is a sign of weakness or something.
    Yeah I agree with all of this

  7. #187
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    Oh please can we not open the Hockenheim 2010 can of worms!
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  8. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suzie View Post
    Oh please can we not open the Hockenheim 2010 can of worms!
    Was just curious If I missed something that was going on here on forums. Because I don't really remember Felipe doing anything wrong there.

    "If he can't do it with Ferrari, well, he can't do it." - John Surtees

  9. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyss4k View Post
    Was just curious If I missed something that was going on here on forums. Because I don't really remember Felipe doing anything wrong there.
    That's odd because I seem to remember him being held responsible by quite a few people for Ferrari being investigated as a result of his emotion after the race.

  10. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sianellen View Post
    That's odd because I seem to remember him being held responsible by quite a few people for Ferrari being investigated as a result of his emotion after the race.
    Oh yeah, this... ok, I will not dig in that. But Felipe is inocent in this.

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  11. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyss4k View Post
    But Felipe is inocent in this.

    Yeah, inocent...he was really smooth...
    Not to mention Rob Smedley. OMG - I hope Ferrari doesn´t pay these hilarious guys any money for ehmm, whatever it is they are doing FOR the team...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curbs View Post

    Yeah, inocent...he was really smooth...
    Not to mention Rob Smedley. OMG - I hope Ferrari doesn´t pay these hilarious guys any money for ehmm, whatever it is they are doing FOR the team...
    You are a joke of a troll matey

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  13. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curbs View Post

    Yeah, inocent...he was really smooth...
    Not to mention Rob Smedley. OMG - I hope Ferrari doesn´t pay these hilarious guys any money for ehmm, whatever it is they are doing FOR the team...
    Yawn. Done to death.
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  14. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curbs View Post

    Yeah, inocent...he was really smooth...
    Not to mention Rob Smedley. OMG - I hope Ferrari doesn´t pay these hilarious guys any money for ehmm, whatever it is they are doing FOR the team...
    If there wasn't team orders in first place, nothing of it would happen. Rob messed up, but Felipe was just a victim.

    "If he can't do it with Ferrari, well, he can't do it." - John Surtees

  15. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyss4k View Post
    If there wasn't team orders in first place, nothing of it would happen. Rob messed up, but Felipe was just a victim.
    Felipe knew before the race what those words meant. He was just childish ignoring the words "forcing" Rob to mess all up even more. Then he made the move as obvious as Barrichello in Austria.

  16. #196
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    Dont feed the troll

    "Luna faccia schiaffo testa"

  17. #197
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    The reality of the situation...
    we are 4th, mabey 5th best team right now. Hows that for reality?

    I think that since the rules changed in 2009, Massa has had a problem with the cars and finding a balance with this generation rules.. He did ok, almost becoming wdc under the old rules. But those cars were vastly different than now and the last few years.
    I think he simply has had a problem w/the current generation cars. I was hoping to see him a bit better today, n there's still time..he may get the thing setup to more of his
    driving style. But we sure couldve used 2 cars in the points. Thing is, a lot of drivers have managed ok pre 09 and since.

  18. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tifosi View Post
    Dont feed the troll
    We could agree to diasagree rather thaqn your stupid comments....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curbs View Post
    We could agree to diasagree rather thaqn your stupid comments....
    Now now boys n girls..play nice.

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    Time to wipe the slate clean and look forward to next week.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Tifosi View Post
    You shouldn't assume you know how to run an F1 team that you are not part of - just because you are involved in a profession associated with its activities.
    I never did. You shouldn't get so worked up over others' opinions, to the point where you have to mock them (OP). I merely jumped in to point out your hypocrisy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Diamond View Post
    Weren't Fredifosis demanding the sacking of Costa and Dyer? Why the turn around?
    I hope that wasn't directed at me... Generalization at its best.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sianellen View Post
    Ferrari is a team and Massa is part of that team and yeah he didn't have a great weekend, but whatever he does he seems to become a punchbag on here. He gets treated worse than Lewis by people claiming to be Ferrari fans. What happened to support through thick and thin, it's not like he doesn't care that he is underperforming. Everyone on here joined together to support him when it came to his accident and we were all just hoping he would get the chance to race again, but now he spends each weekend being ripped to shreds. It is not like he has no track record of winning and fighting for championships. There is accepting someone will need to get better results if they want to stay, and then there is just pulling someone apart. I won't stop supporting him and I won't stop supporting Alonso or the team either, whatever the results.
    Thanks man! Great post, couldn't agree more!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sha1 View Post
    I never did. You shouldn't get so worked up over others' opinions, to the point where you have to mock them (OP). I merely jumped in to point out your hypocrisy.
    I'm a fan of the name above the door mate. Not just one of it's current drivers. I'll defend that.

    You shouldn't assume that everyone should be happy with your standards of critique of something you may not be as bothered about supporting, or to be patronised by someone about the relevance of their profession in knowing better than the team they support.
    Last edited by Tifosi; 19th March 2012 at 00:10.

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  25. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curbs View Post
    We could agree to diasagree rather thaqn your stupid comments....
    then stop trolling with repeated sarcastic comments about Massa when we all know you are not a supporter and you have already made your negative point clear. It's childish

    "Luna faccia schiaffo testa"

  26. #206
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tifosi View Post
    I'm a fan of the name above the door mate. Not just one of it's current drivers.

    You shouldn't assume that everyone should be happy with your standards of critique of something you may not be as bothered about supporting, or to be patronised by someone about the relevance of their profession in knowing better than the team they support.

  27. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tifosi View Post
    As an Alonso fan, what is your interest here?

    To stir the pot? , or are you seriously suggesting that swapping Massa now will win us the WCC?

    You are not primarily a Ferrari fan (as your moniker makes clear) so is it that you want Massa to be a better rear gunner for your boy's WDC Campaign?

    Nail your colours to the mast if you like but don't be vague when you are rubbishing part of the team that this Forum supports (Fredifosi aside that is )
    Mate what are you always getting on about? It is quite clear from an objective person that you have an underlying problem with Fernando for whatever reason. While it is annoying, it's getting to the immature side of things if I may be frank. Before you go off on your childish name calling, I've been a Ferrari fan since 98. I would rather the team win the WCC before either driver wins the WDC. I've pulled/rooted/supported Michael, Felipe & Kimi and now Fernando. As you my first priority is the team. However the team has two drivers and their job is to get the maximum from the car and finish as well as possible. I believe everyone knows which driver is going to do that more often than the other one regardless of how good the car is or isn't.
    Any time anyone says the slightest thing negative about Felipe, you're very quick to break out the junior high school name calling. As the place you live, the reality of the situation is there hasn't been much positivity coming from Massa in the past few years aside from a miraculous comeback from a horrific accident. While some people certainly prefer one driver over the other nowadays, I think with all the goal is for Ferrari to be number one, even with the ones that came with Fernando. The past few years Felipe hasn't helped the cause. For multiple reasons, some of them quite justified others are most certainly not.

    Felipe had an awful day yesterday. Should he be fired? Heck no. You cannot blame Felipe for the fact the F2012 was born poorly. Nor can he be expected to outdrive the car like Fernando did, because Fernando himself will not always be able to do such things. There is much pressure on the drivers and even more pressure on the team. Everyone(who's reading this) wants Ferrari to be number one. To do this both drivers will need to carry their own weight. Both drivers will make mistakes sure, they are human. But both drivers should be based on performances. And will be. When Fernando has a bad day or makes a mistake, it should be recognized & discussed. And the same goes for Felipe. But anyone who says something negative about Felipe shouldn't be called childish names because you disagree with their opinion. Felipe should be given time. How much time? That is up to Stefano & Luca.
    If you would like to discuss the finer points of this situation, we definitely can as long as you leave the antics at the door. Sure some people here are only in it for the driver and they should be known as such, but you paint everyone with the same brush if they are critical of Felipe which is not fair.

  28. #208
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    Right. Cracking race yesterday. What do we all think of Ferrari, Fernando, and Felipe?

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    I love to have daniel ricciardo in a ferrari

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tifosi View Post
    I'm a fan of the name above the door mate. Not just one of it's current drivers. I'll defend that.

    You shouldn't assume that everyone should be happy with your standards of critique of something you may not be as bothered about supporting, or to be patronised by someone about the relevance of their profession in knowing better than the team they support.
    I think you may have mistaken my dislike of your badgering of others' opinions as arrogance? And when did I assume that? On the contrary, I am always open to criticism.

    This isn't about me though, this is about you attacking other members rather than disagreeing with their opinions in a fair manner. My point was for you not to assume that every opinion that goes against your way of thinking must be coming from a clueless fan who's only been following the team since Bahrain 2010.

    And if you are to assume that "negative" opinions only come from uninformed members, then why not take the same stance on positive ones as well? They don't seem to be based around very many facts either.

    Forza Ferrari.

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