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Thread: The Reality Of The Situation

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    The Reality Of The Situation

    Long Time Reader of this forum.

    Had to make a passing comment regarding the conduct of some of the \\\'\\\'fans\\\' of this \\\'discussion forum\\\' and the reality of the situation Ferrari are in.

    Formula one is all about relentlessness, that\\\'s the whole point of the sport, relentless development, relentless improvement, you win a race, you immediately think about how to get better as a driver, how to develop the car further, how to find more loopholes in the rules, how to cheat/lie or get the upper hand on your competition by ANY MEANS NECESSARY. To do this, you need a certain type of individual......a ruthless individual to some extent, this is why if you look at some of the true great drivers, guys like senna , schumacher, they had that ruthlessness, that \\\'\\\'i am going to win by any means needed because I am better than you\\\'\\\'\\\'

    Ferrari had this mentality once a upon a time, ruthless team headed by one of the most uncompromising drivers ever seen. No respect for others, no respect for the \\\'\\\'rules\\\'\\\' (whatever they are), WIN, that is all that matters.

    Ferrari have lost that mentality. This is part of the problem. They have a ruthless \\\'\\\'whatever it takes\\\' number one driver. But are headed by a team principal who should NEVER have been allowed to get to be team principal. I suspect he got there because of internal politics, because this man signifies everything that is wrong with the current ferrari.....WEAK. The man is out of his depth, and you can come at me with as much vitriol and fanboyism as you like, but only truly deluded \\\'\\\'tifosi\\\'\\\' belive this man is the correct choice. He has no buisness being a TP and it\\\'s disgrace that men have lost their jobs and yet he continues hang onto his job despite the obvious failings that have taken place over his watch.

    Felipe Massa.

    Another underperformer who has no business driving for a team like Ferrari. Again, the fanboys can throw the toys out of the pram till kingdom come. He has been poor for a good while now and his performance in qualifying today was nothing short of an embarrassment. The fact that he still drives a ferrari shows the weakness of the current management, in my view, Ferrari is the pinnacle of this sport, you dont get a free pass and if you cant deliver then you get the hell out and go to a midfield team and cry about your trouble. This team is for WINNERS, not out on their luck nearly men who are clearly not good enough.

    Thirdly these so called \'true fans\', the one accept defeat, the ones who almost embrace defeat, the\' we\'\'ll try again next year\'s, the \'\'its only a sport\'s \'\'thing\'s will get better\'\'s.

    That\'s called Loser Mentality or victim mentality. Thats not being a true fan, thats called not facing up to reality, burying your head in the sand, being soft, exactly the kind of things manifesting in the ferrari team over the last few years.

    The likelyhood is that this season is already finished, its not impossible to come back, but its very difficult to pull back a second a lap from the top teams, who will also continue to develop, especially teams like Mclaren who are very good at in season development, red bull may turn up the wick when they come up with a better exhaust config.

    If this carries on, Alonso will have to consider moving on too, because the man is a born winner, and wants to win championships, he wants to win them with ferrari, but a few more pathetic starts to the season like this, and you wonder.

    Oh and dont use lack of testing as an excuse, the other teams go by the same rules with fewer resources and they have produced cars as good as or better than ours.

    Ferrari is not a playground......... its very simple........... Perform or get out.
    Last edited by True Fan; 17th March 2012 at 17:27.

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    So yet again we have a fan who knows better than the owners, president and management of the racing team he supports. Only he knows the solution however because he is a fan and not directly involved in the team or the business.

    If you are omnipresent and of a higher calling, maybe you should intervene divinely instead of just writing it in a thread on a Ferrari fan forum and hoping someone will agree with you or that Luca D will see it and go "THAT'S IT! WHAT WERE WE THINKING!!!"

    Seeing as you've told us all that the season is over for Ferrari and that everyone except Alonso should be sacked, why don't you get fixing it for us then and leave us all alone to watch you. When the team is worthy of you again, at least we will know it was "TRUE FAN" off of TSN that we have to thank!

    "Luna faccia schiaffo testa"

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    \\Forza\\\Ferrari\\\\

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    Forza Ferrari

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    Greig, I think you need to ban "True Fan" if you are to be true to his own unchallengeable logic as the ultimate Ferrari fan.

    As a long time reader (how many seasons have we had to wait?) - he has only just managed to start posting here and his post is full of //////s.

    This is unacceptable.


    TSN is not a playground......... its very simple........... Perform or get out.

    "Luna faccia schiaffo testa"

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tifosi View Post
    So yet again we have a fan who knows better than the owners, president and management of the racing team he supports. Only he knows the solution however because he is a fan and not directly involved in the team or the business.

    If you are omnipresent and of a higher calling, maybe you should intervene divinely instead of just writing it in a thread on a Ferrari fan forum and hoping someone will agree with you or that Luca D will see it and go \"THAT\'S IT! WHAT WERE WE THINKING!!!\"

    Seeing as you\'ve told us all that the season is over for Ferrari and that everyone except Alonso should be sacked, why don\'t you get fixing it for us then and leave us all alone to watch you. When the team is worthy of you again, at least we will know it was \"TRUE FAN\" off of TSN that we have to thank!

    If you cannot see, that Felipe Massa has no business being in a ferrari f1 car, then you are deluded. Simple as that. The race results and stats do not lie in this case. He is not good enough.

    This nonsensical moronic rambling from regarding \'\'Why do you do a better job\'\', \'\'you said everyone must be sacked\'\' has got to stop, its fanboyism at its worst.

    This is the problem with ferrari, weak minded people, weak minded supporters, who take to failure like a duck takes to water.

    Drivers like Alonso, senna, schumacher, become the drivers they become because they are UNRELENTING, they do not accept failure easily, they do not console themselves with pointless munbo jumbo like\'\'we are true fan\'s, we dont need you\'\'. They are born winners, simply because they do accept defeat.

    That is the mentality required to win things in this era of F1. Look at red bull over the last two years, Relentless pushing of the boundaries inside and outside the car, and they got their rewards.

    Ferrari do not have this mentality, and a lot of the so called \'\'fans\'\' i see on forums do not have this mentality either.

    I repeat.

    Ferrari is not a playground, a care home for once good drivers that dont cut it, or weak team principals who are quick to fire other members of staff, but not take responsibility for their own failings.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    \\Forza\\\Ferrari\\\\

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    I have to admit tho, he could be (and probably is) right in certain things...

    "If he can't do it with Ferrari, well, he can't do it." - John Surtees

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    Laugh all you want. Heīs still 100% spot on.

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    So what you going to do about it as a fan then? Just moan?

    "Luna faccia schiaffo testa"

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    Reading the headlines now:
    "Domenicali Calls For Patience After Disastrous Qualifying"...

    Well, Tifosis calls for results. I wounder wich is most justified???

    I think the fans has shown more patience than he could ask for...

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    \\Forza\\\Ferrari\\\\

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    What's with the loser mentality?
    Forza Jules

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    Well, this is the first race, and Ferrari is not in a hurry to decide the driver for the 2nd seat next year.

    Massa will have the entire season to prove himself, so lets just see what happens. Maybe he just need more time to get in tune with the F2012. We don't know.

    But ultimately, Ferrari's decision will depend on how well Massa does this year. Luca DM have shown that he's not afraid to show someone the exit door if he believe its the right thing to do. He does what he feel is best for the team.

    There will be a reason to whatever decision LDM takes by the end of this year. Not just about Massa, but anyone in the team. If there's something that isn't up to the team's expectation, LDM will take action. Don't worry

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    Forza Jules

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tifosi View Post
    So what you going to do about it as a fan then? Just moan?
    I don't want to offend you or something. <- I am writing this to prevent a flame

    Can a Ferrari fan do something about it? I would happily help.

    "If he can't do it with Ferrari, well, he can't do it." - John Surtees

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    If Massa hasnīt got on top of our previous cars, how on earth is he going to understand this one?

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    Right, I'm off for a back slash!
    "Okay,...Jean is smarter than you....... can you confirm you understood that message" Bernie on the phone to Max circa 2009

    Aerodynamics are for people who can't build engines - Enzo Ferrari circa 1960

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    Quote Originally Posted by True Fan View Post
    If you cannot see, that Felipe Massa has no business being in a ferrari f1 car, then you are deluded. Simple as that. The race results and stats do not lie in this case. He is not good enough.

    This nonsensical moronic rambling from regarding \'\'Why do you do a better job\'\', \'\'you said everyone must be sacked\'\' has got to stop, its fanboyism at its worst.

    This is the problem with ferrari, weak minded people, weak minded supporters, who take to failure like a duck takes to water.

    Drivers like Alonso, senna, schumacher, become the drivers they become because they are UNRELENTING, they do not accept failure easily, they do not console themselves with pointless munbo jumbo like\'\'we are true fan\'s, we dont need you\'\'. They are born winners, simply because they do accept defeat.

    That is the mentality required to win things in this era of F1. Look at red bull over the last two years, Relentless pushing of the boundaries inside and outside the car, and they got their rewards.

    Ferrari do not have this mentality, and a lot of the so called \'\'fans\'\' i see on forums do not have this mentality either.

    I repeat.

    Ferrari is not a playground, a care home for once good drivers that dont cut it, or weak team principals who are quick to fire other members of staff, but not take responsibility for their own failings.

    I know that Ferrari is not a playground, its a company that makes sports cars and has several racing teams including an F1 team.

    What are you achieving here with your lambasting? A sense of self justification and superiority?

    Not only do you have enormous arrogance to tell Ferrari what it is and what it is not - you also have laughable arrogance to assume how other people feel about it just because they are not as simplistic as you by pretending that what they think in their heads is reality and post it as if it undeniably is!

    It's laughable and its patronising and its nothing but self serving.

    I come across lots of bleaters at work and what I notice is that non of them are actually trying to be helpful. They just like to sound like they alone hold the answer to everything and that everyone else must be delusional or stupid - even though they have no idea what everyone else's opinion is or what they have to say.

    What it isn't is either realism, constructive, or in any way connected to supporting a team.

    Not a bit!

    "Luna faccia schiaffo testa"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fiondella View Post
    Right, I'm off for a back slash!
    lol. Going against the grain here ////////////

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    True Fan is spot on.

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    Luca and Stefano has said many times that "this is not Ferrari standard". We underperform. So if we have the same level year after year, why on earth canīt a Ferrari fan be unhappy about it? You are a trater for wanting results. Well, as the threadstarter says. Thats kind of what F1 is all about.
    Its normal for people to get replaced if the results doesnīt show. All we get is excuses for the lack of results. And donīt you dare to question this....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curbs View Post
    Laugh all you want. Heīs still 100% spot on.
    Of course I am.

    The fanboys can say whatever they like, Massa is a poor driver, i dont care if he wins the GP tommorrow, he is not ferrari standard, and nor is stefano, who symbollises everything wrong with this soaking wet, weak minded ferrari where we roll over and have our tummy tickled by smaller teams with less resources.

    Alonso and Di Montezemolo have the attitude this team needs, win at all costs, perform or go home.

    What the existing personal are doing is NOT working. And some personnel are clearly not good enough.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheeseman View Post
    lol. Going against the grain here ////////////


    In Stefano Domenicali, we have a team boss who has proved to be a leader. - Luca diMontezemelo

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    TRUE FAN!

    Thanks for a true meaningfull post. It realy make sense to me.

    May the best man/team win!

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    Wrong place to post this, some people here can accept a constructive critic like yours.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curbs View Post
    Luca and Stefano has said many times that "this is not Ferrari standard". We underperform. So if we have the same level year after year, why on earth canīt a Ferrari fan be unhappy about it? You are a trater for wanting results. Well, as the threadstarter says. Thats kind of what F1 is all about.
    Its normal for people to get replaced if the results doesnīt show. All we get is excuses for the lack of results. And donīt you dare to question this....
    Yes, i think we ALL question this. However, I don't see how a bunch of fans (some most notably driver fans of vested interest) have the arrogance to believe that they know what the solution is when they don't know what the problem is. All it is is supposition and frustration and a load of old carp moaning about how changing everything with fix it.

    Nothing to do with not believing there is a problem. It always happens after day 1 of the new season too when the exciteable people get angry and they have to find something specific to be angry at - even though they don't KNOW that it's the problem.

    Its just really boring and predictable and tedious because they just bleat for their own sakes - NOT FERRARI's!!!!

    "Luna faccia schiaffo testa"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tifosi View Post
    Yes, i think we ALL question this. However, I don't see how a bunch of fans (some most notably driver fans of vested interest) have the arrogance to believe that they know what the solution is when they don't know what the problem is. All it is is supposition and frustration and a load of old carp moaning about how changing everything with fix it.

    Nothing to do with not believing there is a problem. It always happens after day 1 of the new season too when the exciteable people get angry and they have to find something specific to be angry at - even though they don't KNOW that it's the problem.

    Its just really boring and predictable and tedious because they just bleat for their own sakes - NOT FERRARI's!!!!
    Think before you post.

    Felipe Massa, there is NO justification for this man to be driving a ferrari.

    Even at his ''best'' he was only ever lights to flag man, he's never shown a consistently world class race craft that would make you put him in the same league as alonso, vettel, button, hamilton, webber even.

    You can stick your head in the sand and pretend this guy is ferrari standard and we can keep him on and throwway any chance of a constructors or any chance of our second driver taking points off the leaders..........

    Or you can step into the real world and accept he needs to pack his bag and get out.

    And thats before we talk about Stefano ''HR Manager'' Dominecali.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingdom Hearts View Post
    Wrong place to post this, some people here can accept a constructive critic like yours.
    constructive?

    What's constructive? I see lots of knee jerking and opinion based on nothing but fan level knowledge after half of one race week-end.

    Total arrogance.

    As for the Fredifosi, they can just moan because they are here purely for their boy. They don't care about Ferrari because they will go with Fernando when he moves on and we know who they are .

    If Ferrari changed everything and it didn't work there'd still be people on here saying "you should have done this instead".

    I repeat, nothing to do with supporting a team. Just self-stroking the old ego and wounded pride cos we looked like amateurs today.

    Lips are out. That's all.

    "Luna faccia schiaffo testa"

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    Quote Originally Posted by True Fan View Post
    Think before you post.

    Felipe Massa, there is NO justification for this man to be driving a ferrari.

    Even at his ''best'' he was only ever lights to flag man, he's never shown a consistently world class race craft that would make you put him in the same league as alonso, vettel, button, hamilton, webber even.

    You can stick your head in the sand and pretend this guy is ferrari standard and we can keep him on and throwway any chance of a constructors or any chance of our second driver taking points off the leaders..........

    Or you can step into the real world and accept he needs to pack his bag and get out.

    And thats before we talk about Stefano ''HR Manager'' Dominecali.

    However, YOU know better what Ferrari should do than they do?

    Get real.

    They've been running Ferrari longer than YOU have. Think before you reply, and please dont assume that because I don't act like i have all the answers that I think that nothing should be done. But then again that doesn't suit your "I know better" mentality for this thread.


    Don't bother replying to me if its just another "We know what to do because we are fans" carp!

    Many Thanks

    "Luna faccia schiaffo testa"

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    No arrogance.Just stating opinions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tifosi View Post
    constructive?

    What's constructive? I see lots of knee jerking and opinion based on nothing but fan level knowledge after half of one race week-end.

    Total arrogance.

    As for the Fredifosi, they can just moan because they are here purely for their boy. They don't care about Ferrari because they will go with Fernando when he moves on and we know who they are .

    If Ferrari changed everything and it didn't work there'd still be people on here saying "you should have done this instead".

    I repeat, nothing to do with supporting a team. Just self-stroking the old ego and wounded pride cos we looked like amateurs today.

    Lips are out. That's all.
    From your posts, you are making yourself look as arogant as him. How can you judge people, you don't know? You are doing it based only on your opinion. Exactly like he does.

    I think you both are overreacting a bit. He is right, that in EVERY company, the leader is responsible and he has to deal with it and without results, it's time to give a chance to someone else. I am not 100% sure that's the case with Stefano, but I as well kind of have this feeling

    You are right about moaning fans. It's really for nothing and we are only torturing ourselves (and I imagine that even the readers of our messages...)

    "If he can't do it with Ferrari, well, he can't do it." - John Surtees

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tifosi View Post
    However, YOU know better what Ferrari should do than they do?

    Get real.

    They've been running Ferrari longer than YOU have. Think before you reply, and please dont assume that because I don't act like i have all the answers that I think that nothing should be done. But then again that doesn't suit your "I know better" mentality for this thread.


    Don't bother replying to me if its just another "We know what to do because we are fans" carp!

    Many Thanks
    What ''they'' are doing DOES-NOT-WORK

    Do you understand this.

    Can you see this.

    IT DOES NOT WORK.

    Massa as a second driver......DOES NOT WORK. Not only he is a poor excuse for a top driver who handicaps us in the constructors, he's cant even play wingman to alonso because he's crashing into hamilton, messing about in the midfields or about 30 seconds behind the main battle where Alonso is being sandwiched by mclarens and red bulls.

    Stefano Dominecali as a team principal....DOES NOT WORK. When you are TP, the buck stops with you, constant and regular bad tactical decisions for which other members of staff have been demoted, shocking development of cars in the off season, for which members of staff have been fired, consistent ignorance of the rules and loopholes ferrari could have exploited, consistently promising the team will deliver when infact they do not. The man is not a leader, thats clear, he is not ruthless, what he is a very nice guy and HR Manager who is in way over his head.

    Do you accept that what these personnel are doing is not working? Or do we hve to endure another crappy season where we are a second a lap behind from the season start before you get it?

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