Why was it luck?
Forza Ferrari
Wow. Now the whining has actually descended into wanting ALONSO, possibly our biggest asset, gone?
Unbelievable.
Forza Jules
I KNEW there was something freakishly wrong with all the peace and harmony on here last night, everyone singing praises for Massa, Alonso, the team, etc... now this is more like it. The SACK THEM ALL brigade is back. Order has been restored on TSN.
The future is RED
I think our team of engineers is 2 old school for the new aerodinamic stuff thats going on they are not much into it and thats why we cant make a nice car.
New times came that we need to take drastic measures off with their heads all of them and bring new engeeners than can make aerodinamic upgrades.
And yeah sack Domenicali pls and bring Briatore if we can he has a strong hand and will bring order.
And what did I just say?
The future is RED
Ferrari has at no time been "nobodies" and had won many a championship before Todt, Brawn and Schumi ever came along. True they were in a long dry spell but won races and championships in that time (everyone seems to forget the WCC's won and close championship fights several years in that "dry spell".)
Don't play dumb with me. I'm better at it than you are.
I remember that thread, it was a great one! If I remember correctly, we finally agreed to fire everybody and get an all-female team and a pink car, and to bring back Schumacher in a tutu to drive it
PS Maybe there were some divergences about the car being pink or purple, but I am quite sure about Schumacher's tutu!
I defo think he will see his contract out, i mean McLaren will not be an option for him with Lewis, unlikely he will want to be with vettel at redbull...... where else is there for him, what other team at the moment can give you a realistic chance of getting the TITLE.
why are we even discussing Nando leaving ferrari??? Thats not gonna happen, and frankly its just one race down. The car is already better than it was in australia. Stop the whining.
Silently, like a shadow
1979 - Scheckter wins Title, followed his teammate and obvioustly Ferrari take constructor's title.
1980 - Ferrari scores only 7 points.
1981 - 2 Wins.
1982 - 3 Wins, and constructor title. Though the WDC could of been Gilles or Pironi's if it wasn't for their tragedies.
1983 - 3 Wins, and constructor title. The drivers finish 3rd and 4th in the championship, both missing on the title at the last race.
1984 - 1 Win.
1985 - 2 Wins. Alboreto comes second in the championship after leading it to the half way point.
1986 - 0 Wins.
1987 - 2 Wins.
1988 - 1 Win.
1989 - 3 Wins.
1990 - 6 Wins. Prost finished second, as does Ferrari.
1991 - 0 Wins.
1992 - 0 Wins.
1993 - 0 Wins.
1994 - 1 Win.
1995 - 1 Win.
1996 - Schumacher arrives.
Aside from 82 - 83 and 1990, Ferrari really didn't fight for the title since their last WDC. And before Schumacher's arrival that was 17 years of really just being a top 5 team at times.
vecchiasignora is somewhat right that Michael did arrive when Ferrari really lost their winning mentality. And realistically was a massive gamble in his career, so credit to him there.
Last edited by Omegablue; 23rd March 2012 at 22:18.
Those stats just prove that these things go in cycles. No one team can win forever, just like we could not dominate forever after the mid-2000s.
It will come again. History shows that.
Forza Jules
Totally agree with you. Look at Williams now. McLaren since there 8 titles from 1988 to 1991, only got 1 WCC and 3 WDC since.
However during that dark period, Ferrari fell completely behind against the electronics developed by Honda and Renault.
Ferrari were building petrol engines, not microchips, and them took so long to shift into the modern mentality.
That's why when Todt arrived, he changed the entire team bit by bit, and got rid of the old school designers and engineers.
Still there's no excuse for Ferrari to be off the pace these days. Unlike then, today they have the resources, the man power and the technology to at least be competitive at each race.
Don't play dumb with me. I'm better at it than you are.
Don't play dumb with me. I'm better at it than you are.
Ferrari might be part of a "circus" but we don't need clowns like Briatore. The suggestion that our engineers are too old for current aero designs is ridiculous. Adrian Newey is 54 and he seems to be doing just fine when it comes to aerodynamics. Bob Bell at Mercedes is also 54 years old and their wing design is the new bit of kit everyone will eventually copy. From where I'm standing the "old school" engineers are doing just fine
Huge difference. Schumacher came to us when we were nobodies.We had no winning mentality. posted by Originally Posted by vecchiasignora
Ferrari has at no time been "nobodies" and had won many a championship before Todt, Brawn and Schumi ever came along. True they were in a long dry spell but won races and championships in that time (everyone seems to forget the WCC's won and close championship fights several years in that "dry spell".)
Couldn't agree more with REDARMYSOJA Ferrari have always been somebodies even during the dry spell they were still winning GPs so you comment is wayyy... off and wrong
I can agree there, but winning a race a year, really isn't winning. We had to pay Berger fortune to convince him back.
And Senna would have never raced for Ferrari during those years. Prost left McLaren for the obvious clashes with Senna, and because the 89 Ferrari, eventhough broke down more often than finished a race, was fairly fast. But we know what happened in 91.
So yeah, Ferrari had plenty of history and trophies, but during that time, Williams was way better, McLaren leaps ahead, and then there was Benetton that also over took Ferrari.
Ferrari weren't nobodies, true, but wasn't appealing to many.
Though, I do remember reading an article during Todt's first years, that Ron Dennis did have a bit of a secret grudge for never really being chased by Ferrari. So I guess Ferrari was still something, even during the darkest years. :)
As well, Schumacher didn't build the team or the car. He had great technical input, but those winning years was not all his credit, it was the whole team, every individual involved from Brawn to the cook.
I wouldn't say they were old school in design, they were however trying to play catch up with new technology, such as carbon fiber and electronics. Changes had been made to improve in that area, like bringing in Barnard and Brunner, it's just that what they tried didn't work. That's what helped usher out Forghieri and Dr. Postelthwaite, so there was a wholesale changing of the guard. They did during this time though come up with the paddle shifter, which is perhaps the greatest innovation in F1 in decades.
Don't play dumb with me. I'm better at it than you are.
And if Ferrari were winning, all of the posts would be fine.
Im all for critiquing the team, but some of these posts are
either from mac fans or people coming down off of something...
Oops, meant not in design, but in understanding the car.
Yeah, Barnard, tried twice, had a good design with the 640, but everything else was a disaster. Never forget when at the end of 1987, the Ferrari came together in the last 2 races, and then they left the car unchanged for the 1988 season. That was the shocking mentality with Ferrari in those times.
As for the semi-automatic gearbox and paddle system, it's also the only true mechanical/electronic innovation that's remained since then. Everything else has been labelled illegal or just failed. LOL
The future is RED
True, but those were two very dominant wins by Berger. He didn't just win he pretty much smoked the field. Perhaps they felt they had hit on the right design and everyone else would have to play catch up for awhile. Plus, Brunner left, but there was some evolution of the car.
True again. The semi-auto tranny and paddleshift would probably be ruled illegal if it came out today. They weren't as quick to ban something in those days.As for the semi-automatic gearbox and paddle system, it's also the only true mechanical/electronic innovation that's remained since then. Everything else has been labelled illegal or just failed. LOL
I think the main point I'm aiming for is, Ferrari does react when they aren't doing well, just as they are now, they just don't always react the right way. But when you're around as long as they are you are going to build some duds. Let's just hope this current streak doesn't last as long as the one we are referring to.
Don't play dumb with me. I'm better at it than you are.
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