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Thread: What is going on with Sebastian Vettel

  1. #1081
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Eyes View Post
    This is what I am talking about. Why are we becoming divided. We all bleed red.

    Vettel is part of our team. He's one of us. Why are some trying to blame him. He made a few mistakes trying to beat the most dominant car in F1 history, and a team that had Pirelli and the FIA in their back pocket. He still stole many wins for us against a better car. We can't do any better than him. We can only do worse.

    Don't let the British Press and Hamilton's fanboys win. Let's stay united and support our great team.
    last year the Mercs were not very dominant, which is why Ferrari won 6 races and RB won 4

  2. #1082
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    Quote Originally Posted by aroutis View Post
    If all I say is true, then the rest you say make no sense. Please stay away from the booze.
    FIA, MERC, Pirelli, and those last two years that Schumy was with Merc according to Toto, he put them on track with all his knowledge and input. A very "Sobering Fact ! " I always believed he came back to break Ayrtons pole record alone. Who knew it was to put his home team on top?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferrarichamp View Post
    last year the Mercs were not very dominant, which is why Ferrari won 6 races and RB won 4
    Those wins were Vettel making the difference. The Ferrari was slower. The Merc was faster. Vettel was better.

    Listen to me, Vettel is the fastest driver of all time. Michael was a gentleman and you can't argue with his numbers. Michael is the greatest sportsman to have ever lived. But Vettel is quicker than him in qualifying and equal to him in race conditions. When Vettel was fighting the dominant Brawn and Mercedes cars it reminded me of Michael fighting those dominant McLaren, Renault and Williams cars for us.

    I was sad when Vettel beat us in 2010 and 2012. I knew he was the quickest driver and wished more than anything that he would join us. Then he took those Belgium chocolates to Luca. An act of incredible kindness. He then drove slower in 2014 so he could join us. I knew then he was one of us all along. It is not our fault or his fault we have not won the championship in the past two years. It's Pirelli and the FIA, who are in Hamilton's corner.

  4. #1084
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Eyes View Post
    Those wins were Vettel making the difference. The Ferrari was slower. The Merc was faster. Vettel was better.

    Listen to me, Vettel is the fastest driver of all time. Michael was a gentleman and you can't argue with his numbers. Michael is the greatest sportsman to have ever lived. But Vettel is quicker than him in qualifying and equal to him in race conditions. When Vettel was fighting the dominant Brawn and Mercedes cars it reminded me of Michael fighting those dominant McLaren, Renault and Williams cars for us.

    I was sad when Vettel beat us in 2010 and 2012. I knew he was the quickest driver and wished more than anything that he would join us. Then he took those Belgium chocolates to Luca. An act of incredible kindness. He then drove slower in 2014 so he could join us. I knew then he was one of us all along. It is not our fault or his fault we have not won the championship in the past two years. It's Pirelli and the FIA, who are in Hamilton's corner.
    I don't think so. If that were true, Seb would have more than 4 titles by now. But hey, everyone has a right to their opinion

  5. #1085
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Eyes View Post
    Those wins were Vettel making the difference. The Ferrari was slower. The Merc was faster. Vettel was better.

    Listen to me, Vettel is the fastest driver of all time. Michael was a gentleman and you can't argue with his numbers. Michael is the greatest sportsman to have ever lived. But Vettel is quicker than him in qualifying and equal to him in race conditions. When Vettel was fighting the dominant Brawn and Mercedes cars it reminded me of Michael fighting those dominant McLaren, Renault and Williams cars for us.

    I was sad when Vettel beat us in 2010 and 2012. I knew he was the quickest driver and wished more than anything that he would join us. Then he took those Belgium chocolates to Luca. An act of incredible kindness. He then drove slower in 2014 so he could join us. I knew then he was one of us all along. It is not our fault or his fault we have not won the championship in the past two years. It's Pirelli and the FIA, who are in Hamilton's corner.
    And in 2014, Riccardo outclassed him? Faster than Schumacher This is probably a joke

  6. #1086
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noquarter View Post
    And in 2014, Riccardo outclassed him? Faster than Schumacher This is probably a joke
    He drove slower on purpose to get out of his Red Bull contract. He wanted to join us in Italy.

    I mean no disrespect to Michael. He is a wonderful man. A respectful gentleman. The best sportsman to have ever lived. But Sebastian can drive a race car quicker than anyone. Don't let the British press win. They want you to turn against Seb. Just like they wanted you to turn against Arrivabene. We don't see Maurcio in the paddock this year because of the smear campaign that the British waged against him.

    It makes me so angry that so many of us have turned against Seb.

  7. #1087
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Eyes View Post
    He drove slower on purpose to get out of his Red Bull contract. He wanted to join us in Italy.

    I mean no disrespect to Michael. He is a wonderful man. A respectful gentleman. The best sportsman to have ever lived. But Sebastian can drive a race car quicker than anyone. Don't let the British press win. They want you to turn against Seb. Just like they wanted you to turn against Arrivabene. We don't see Maurcio in the paddock this year because of the smear campaign that the British waged against him.

    It makes me so angry that so many of us have turned against Seb.
    so did Alonso in 2012, he put that "dog" of a car in places that did NOT deserve to be, and almost WON us the WDC.....if it wasn't for the rocketship that Vet had that year.....you think your "idol" Seb would have done the same in hte 2012 Ferrari.....i think not

    asa ca nu mai veni cu povesti de adormit copii pe forum-ul asta......Vet n-a fost niciodata mai bun decat Scumi......Schumi is a legend, he won those TWO WDC's with Benneton in a car that was by far slower then the Williams and Mclaren those years.....i betcha dollars to donuts that your boy Seb could NOT have done that......not in a million years
    So 2023 started off bad, but managed to claw back some lap time come end of the year. Lets hope SF24 will give us tifosi something to smile about.

  8. #1088
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    Quote Originally Posted by FerrariF60 View Post
    so did Alonso in 2012, he put that "dog" of a car in places that did NOT deserve to be, and almost WON us the WDC.....if it wasn't for the rocketship that Vet had that year.....you think your "idol" Seb would have done the same in hte 2012 Ferrari.....i think not

    asa ca nu mai veni cu povesti de adormit copii pe forum-ul asta......Vet n-a fost niciodata mai bun decat Scumi......Schumi is a legend, he won those TWO WDC's with Benneton in a car that was by far slower then the Williams and Mclaren those years.....i betcha dollars to donuts that your boy Seb could NOT have done that......not in a million years
    Vettel would have won us the drivers cup in 2012. The cars were equal. Our engineers did a great job that year.

    Vettel and Schumacher are equal. Both are legends. Both are gentleman. Both bleed red. Schumacher has the numbers and is the greatest. Seb has the speed and is the best.

  9. #1089
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Eyes View Post
    Those wins were Vettel making the difference. The Ferrari was slower. The Merc was faster. Vettel was better.

    Listen to me, Vettel is the fastest driver of all time. Michael was a gentleman and you can't argue with his numbers. Michael is the greatest sportsman to have ever lived. But Vettel is quicker than him in qualifying and equal to him in race conditions. When Vettel was fighting the dominant Brawn and Mercedes cars it reminded me of Michael fighting those dominant McLaren, Renault and Williams cars for us.

    I was sad when Vettel beat us in 2010 and 2012. I knew he was the quickest driver and wished more than anything that he would join us. Then he took those Belgium chocolates to Luca. An act of incredible kindness. He then drove slower in 2014 so he could join us. I knew then he was one of us all along. It is not our fault or his fault we have not won the championship in the past two years. It's Pirelli and the FIA, who are in Hamilton's corner.
    When it comes to qualifying, I don't think anyone has any doubt that Vettel is the ultimate qualifier. McLaren themselves were envy of Sebastian's pace.

    This is what McLaren's McGrath said in 2012 analyzing the last few races of 2011.

    McGrath added that beating qualifying master Sebastian Vettel will be crucial if McLaren is to be successful in 2012, particularly as its analysis indicated that the raw pace of last year's MP4-26 was superior towards the end of the season despite Red Bull and Vettel's run of poles.

    "He must be a brilliant driver, because by the end of last season we definitely had the best car and he was still whupping us," McGrath said.

    "We're trying to figure out exactly what he's doing that's so good. How does he pull out that fast qualifying lap every time? We think it's driver skill. There's no trickery on the cars, he just gets more out of it than we do."
    McLaren Mercedes had the quickest car in 2012 but Hamilton was struggling to beat Vettel. As you rightly pointed out, Seb drove slower in 2014 to trigger the clause which allowed him to leave Red Bull early and join the team he always wanted to drive for - Ferrari.

    Some people think that Ricciardo is actually better driver than Vettel. Even Red Bull bosses don't believe that. In 2015, F1 asked all team bosses to name their dream team, the driver pairing they considered to be the greatest drivers of all time. Helmut Marko selected Ayrton Senna and Sebastian Vettel. Christian Horner selected Nigel Mansell and Sebastian Vettel. Both of them consider Vettel among the top 2 greatest drivers of all time. Toro Rosso boss Franz Tost who after working with Vettel, Ricciardo, Kvyat, Verstappen etc.. said that Vettel is the best driver.

    Vettel won 9 races in a row in 2013 but those Red Bull cars don't even make the cut among the top 3 most dominant constructors. The list is topped by Hamilton's Mercedes because of the performance advantage enjoyed by the cars he drove since 2014, unrivaled in history of F1. Despite having only his teammate to beat, he still couldn't beat Vettel's 9 wins in a row. Vettel would have easily gotten in to double digit consecutive wins if he drove the Mercedes the past few years.

    In the initial days of Vettel's debut, Michael Schumacher recognized that Vettel is the future star so he said to Ferrari that Vettel is the driver Ferrari needs for future.

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  11. #1091
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    Great post Chinmay.

    And as Michael once said. The best is yet to come.

  12. #1092
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Eyes View Post
    Great post Chinmay.

    And as Michael once said. The best is yet to come.
    The best from who is yet to come, Merc? I know is yet to come they’ll win all races this year unless Ferrari will do something about it

    But we all know this season is over, is like beating a dead horse so to speak....they better concentrate on 2020....something tells me they alr day are and realized they desig d a flop this year
    So 2023 started off bad, but managed to claw back some lap time come end of the year. Lets hope SF24 will give us tifosi something to smile about.

  13. #1093
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    The greatest pole qualifier is for sure Seb! Lewis @ 86 poles is just for show ! Seb showed up @ Ferrari with a little help from Schumy so he could take a rest and then come back to retire with his home boys. Nothing wrong with that. He gave as much of his experience and what ever Ferrari knowledge he had to put them capable of being where they are. And as an extra bonus he got Senna's pole record. Not a bad ending to a great career !!

  14. #1094
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Eyes View Post
    Those wins were Vettel making the difference. The Ferrari was slower. The Merc was faster. Vettel was better.

    Listen to me, Vettel is the fastest driver of all time. Michael was a gentleman and you can't argue with his numbers. Michael is the greatest sportsman to have ever lived. But Vettel is quicker than him in qualifying and equal to him in race conditions. When Vettel was fighting the dominant Brawn and Mercedes cars it reminded me of Michael fighting those dominant McLaren, Renault and Williams cars for us.

    I was sad when Vettel beat us in 2010 and 2012. I knew he was the quickest driver and wished more than anything that he would join us. Then he took those Belgium chocolates to Luca. An act of incredible kindness. He then drove slower in 2014 so he could join us. I knew then he was one of us all along. It is not our fault or his fault we have not won the championship in the past two years. It's Pirelli and the FIA, who are in Hamilton's corner.
    Back in his day 2010-2013 maybe he was *fastest* like you say but still his racecraft was somewhat questionable. Belgium 2010(when he crashed into Button) and Abu Dhabi 2012(when he crashed in a DRS sign) come to mind.

    Please note that being the fastest racer doesn't make you the best driver of all time. For that you need 2 more things: racecraft and of course *CONSISTENCY*. Seb's racecraft has improved a lot since he joined Ferrari but his consistency has just disappeared since Germany 2018. He made so many mistakes in the second part of 2018 and this year that you just don't know what to expect of him the following weekend or any racing weekend.

    I really wish that he was *still* the driver that you are portraying him to be. I know very well that this year it's just impossible to beat Mercedes, but at least if Seb was that good, he shouldn't have finished any race this year lower than 3rd.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcana View Post
    Back in his day 2010-2013 maybe he was *fastest* like you say but still his racecraft was somewhat questionable. Belgium 2010(when he crashed into Button) and Abu Dhabi 2012(when he crashed in a DRS sign) come to mind.

    Please note that being the fastest racer doesn't make you the best driver of all time. For that you need 2 more things: racecraft and of course *CONSISTENCY*. Seb's racecraft has improved a lot since he joined Ferrari but his consistency has just disappeared since Germany 2018. He made so many mistakes in the second part of 2018 and this year that you just don't know what to expect of him the following weekend or any racing weekend.

    I really wish that he was *still* the driver that you are portraying him to be. I know very well that this year it's just impossible to beat Mercedes, but at least if Seb was that good, he shouldn't have finished any race this year lower than 3rd.

    Abu Dhabi 2012? Are you for real? That was probably one of his best races when he started from the pit lane and finished on the podium after fighting up the order twice.

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    Vettel raced like a warrior in 2018. He had to try and beat the faster and dominant Mercedes. That's why he made mistakes. If Hamilton or Alonso would have been in the Ferrari the past two seasons they would not have even mounted a title challenge. It was Vettel who was carrying Ferrari on his back. Even Michael could not have won a championship the past two seasons at Ferrari.

    It's not our team. Or our number 1 driver. There is a larger enemy out there that cannot be defeated. It's the combined alliance between Mercedes, the FIA and Pirelli. Helped along by the British specialist press. Everyone was happy in 2004 when Michael and us were winning. But the British had to complain and get the rules changed. When Sebastian did the same earlier this decade the Brits complained again. This time, the powers that be saw to it that Vettel couldn't win. No matter how much better he was that the rest. All because he's German. All because he's the best driver ever. Note I didn't say the greatest. That is Michael.

    The numbers don't like and Michael is the greatest until Seb passes him. That is if they let talent shine and the best driver win. But Sebastian is the best ever because he is a bit quicker than our Michael. Both are miles better than anyone else. Inside and outside of the car. But fear not, as time passes. We shall prevail. That goes for Seb. The memory of Michael. Our team. And our fanbase.

    "When Time shall have softened passion and prejudice, when Reason shall have stripped the mask from misrepresentation, then Justice, holding evenly her scales, will require much of past censure and praise to change places."

  17. #1097
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Eyes View Post
    Vettel raced like a warrior in 2018. He had to try and beat the faster and dominant Mercedes. That's why he made mistakes. If Hamilton or Alonso would have been in the Ferrari the past two seasons they would not have even mounted a title challenge. It was Vettel who was carrying Ferrari on his back. Even Michael could not have won a championship the past two seasons at Ferrari.

    It's not our team. Or our number 1 driver. There is a larger enemy out there that cannot be defeated. It's the combined alliance between Mercedes, the FIA and Pirelli. Helped along by the British specialist press. Everyone was happy in 2004 when Michael and us were winning. But the British had to complain and get the rules changed. When Sebastian did the same earlier this decade the Brits complained again. This time, the powers that be saw to it that Vettel couldn't win. No matter how much better he was that the rest. All because he's German. All because he's the best driver ever. Note I didn't say the greatest. That is Michael.

    The numbers don't like and Michael is the greatest until Seb passes him. That is if they let talent shine and the best driver win. But Sebastian is the best ever because he is a bit quicker than our Michael. Both are miles better than anyone else. Inside and outside of the car. But fear not, as time passes. We shall prevail. That goes for Seb. The memory of Michael. Our team. And our fanbase.

    "When Time shall have softened passion and prejudice, when Reason shall have stripped the mask from misrepresentation, then Justice, holding evenly her scales, will require much of past censure and praise to change places."
    Bruh.

  18. #1098
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    Seb could well be all that esp. ahead of Michael if it was now. If only he could get Ferrari at least 1 win he would be even greater! So far Lewis each race seems well; not miles ahead but seconds ahead of Seb. There's still time ! Park in front of Lewis come quali. ! Do a Shumy on him ! The way the champions did it!

  19. #1099
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    Quote Originally Posted by killer View Post
    Bruh.
    "Dead Eyes"...more like "Dead Neurons"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brembo View Post
    Seb could well be all that esp. ahead of Michael if it was now. If only he could get Ferrari at least 1 win he would be even greater! So far Lewis each race seems well; not miles ahead but seconds ahead of Seb. There's still time ! Park in front of Lewis come quali. ! Do a Shumy on him ! The way the champions did it!

  21. #1101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brembo View Post
    FIA, MERC, Pirelli, and those last two years that Schumy was with Merc according to Toto, he put them on track with all his knowledge and input. A very "Sobering Fact ! " I always believed he came back to break Ayrtons pole record alone. Who knew it was to put his home team on top?
    Michael helped putting merc in order yes, but it was the tyres test in 2013 that made them pretty much what they are, plus it was the fact they were well ahead in the engine dept that really put them ahead in the game.

    Again, stay away from the booze.
    "If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari" - Gilles Villeneuve

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    I think Michael should be awarded an honorary championship from Mercedes. He got the car ready for 2014. He developed the engine and the chassis so it would be the best on the grid for 5 years. Without his development work Hamilton and Rosberg would have only won a few races at Mercedes. Even with Pirelli in Mercedes' pockets.

    It was Seb that carried Red Bull in 2010 to 2013. The Ferrari and McLaren were always equal to the Red Bull. But Vettel's development work and driving won Red Bull 4 constructors championships and 4 drivers championships. They have won nothing since he left.

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    Ferrari and McLaren were equal to Red Bull?? are you actually serious lol....Newey was the reason for their titles.
    Forza Ferrari

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Ferrari and McLaren were equal to Red Bull?? are you actually serious lol....Newey was the reason for their titles.
    In 2010 and 2012 the Ferrari, McLaren and Red Bull were all equal. Vettel won

    In 2011 the Red Bull and McLaren were equal. Vettel won.

    In 2013 the Mercedes and Red Bull were equal for most of the season. Vettel walked it.

    It was Vettel making the difference. We made some great cars in 2010 and 2012. But our drivers didn't take advantage. Vettel used his cars better.

  25. #1105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Eyes View Post
    In 2010 and 2012 the Ferrari, McLaren and Red Bull were all equal. Vettel won

    In 2011 the Red Bull and McLaren were equal. Vettel won.

    In 2013 the Mercedes and Red Bull were equal for most of the season. Vettel walked it.

    It was Vettel making the difference. We made some great cars in 2010 and 2012. But our drivers didn't take advantage. Vettel used his cars better.
    you spelt Newey wrong again
    Forza Ferrari

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    Quote Originally Posted by chinmay View Post
    When it comes to qualifying, I don't think anyone has any doubt that Vettel is the ultimate qualifier. McLaren themselves were envy of Sebastian's pace.

    This is what McLaren's McGrath said in 2012 analyzing the last few races of 2011.



    McLaren Mercedes had the quickest car in 2012 but Hamilton was struggling to beat Vettel. As you rightly pointed out, Seb drove slower in 2014 to trigger the clause which allowed him to leave Red Bull early and join the team he always wanted to drive for - Ferrari.

    Some people think that Ricciardo is actually better driver than Vettel. Even Red Bull bosses don't believe that. In 2015, F1 asked all team bosses to name their dream team, the driver pairing they considered to be the greatest drivers of all time. Helmut Marko selected Ayrton Senna and Sebastian Vettel. Christian Horner selected Nigel Mansell and Sebastian Vettel. Both of them consider Vettel among the top 2 greatest drivers of all time. Toro Rosso boss Franz Tost who after working with Vettel, Ricciardo, Kvyat, Verstappen etc.. said that Vettel is the best driver.

    Vettel won 9 races in a row in 2013 but those Red Bull cars don't even make the cut among the top 3 most dominant constructors. The list is topped by Hamilton's Mercedes because of the performance advantage enjoyed by the cars he drove since 2014, unrivaled in history of F1. Despite having only his teammate to beat, he still couldn't beat Vettel's 9 wins in a row. Vettel would have easily gotten in to double digit consecutive wins if he drove the Mercedes the past few years.

    In the initial days of Vettel's debut, Michael Schumacher recognized that Vettel is the future star so he said to Ferrari that Vettel is the driver Ferrari needs for future.
    I laugh so hard while reading this

  27. #1107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Eyes View Post
    I think Michael should be awarded an honorary championship from Mercedes. He got the car ready for 2014. He developed the engine and the chassis so it would be the best on the grid for 5 years. Without his development work Hamilton and Rosberg would have only won a few races at Mercedes. Even with Pirelli in Mercedes' pockets.

    It was Seb that carried Red Bull in 2010 to 2013. The Ferrari and McLaren were always equal to the Red Bull. But Vettel's development work and driving won Red Bull 4 constructors championships and 4 drivers championships. They have won nothing since he left.
    So how come when Michael was actually racing at Mercedes from 2010 till 2012 and they made barely progress but when he left it's all Michael ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by tifosi1993 View Post
    "Dead Eyes"...more like "Dead Neurons"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Eyes View Post
    He drove slower on purpose to get out of his Red Bull contract. He wanted to join us in Italy.

    I mean no disrespect to Michael. He is a wonderful man. A respectful gentleman. The best sportsman to have ever lived. But Sebastian can drive a race car quicker than anyone. Don't let the British press win. They want you to turn against Seb. Just like they wanted you to turn against Arrivabene. We don't see Maurcio in the paddock this year because of the smear campaign that the British waged against him.

    It makes me so angry that so many of us have turned against Seb.
    Vettel drove slower because he wanted to join us ? based upon what if i may ask ?
    And please stop that British press nonsense, British press is solid unlike from Spain for example. I am a South American and tell you i have not seen bias from the British press.

  30. #1110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Louisa Fortuna View Post
    So how come when Michael was actually racing at Mercedes from 2010 till 2012 and they made barely progress but when he left it's all Michael ?
    He was preparing them for the new regulations in 2014. It worked.

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