Thread: Scuderia Ferrari SF70H

  1. #1681
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    TRANSPORTED TIRES IN SOCHI
    Mercedes surprised himself


    Everything spoke at the GP Russia for a Ferrari victory. But then Mercedes won. The winners and losers were missing the words, because the tires once again behaved as no one had expected.
    You can be pretty stupid these days as an expert.The tires do what they want. And then the professionals in this business look old. "I told everyone before the race that Ferrari wins," admitted Niki Lauda, ​​only to admit after the GP Russia: "I've never been so deceived. It was a miracle, as Bottas used the mini-chance to get in the tire window with full tanks, and afterwards also remained in it. "


    Mercedes wins on Saturday and Ferrari on Sunday. Not correct. For the first time in Ferrari Ferrari had been racing with two cars in the first row. Mercedes reversed the order at the start. Ferrari is fast at the start of the race, and Mercedes does not wake up until the second half of the race. Also wrong. Mercedes dominated to the pit stops and in the end had to tremble for the victory.


    Bottas took Hamilton off 36 seconds


    Mercedes Has a problem with the soft tire mixtures and comes first with the hard rubber on tempo. Not right. In GP Russia it was exactly the opposite. Bottas drove on the Ultrasoft soles Sebastian Vettel up to 5.5 seconds. It was only the 3 minute lap time. Ferrari made steam on the Supersoft tire. Bottas only saved an advantage of 0.6 seconds.

    One more insight this season: Mercedes immediately puts the tires in their working window, but under certain conditions it will certainly be worthwhile. Up again. Sochi has also disproved this. Only Ferrari brought front tires and rear tires quickly and simultaneously into the working window. Therefore, the training gain. Mercedes sometimes needed up to 3 laps. On the other hand, the hind legs remained alive. Despite 40 degrees on the asphalt.

    To conclude, another expert opinion: Lewis Hamilton is more constant in the race than Valtteri Bottas. Old news. Bottas took his team colleague in half a second and over 52 laps 36 seconds in training. Hamilton Fought in the race with the same problems as in the training. Front and rear tires were only phase-wise in the window. The World Cup second lost mainly in the 90 degree curves on Bottas.

    Ferrari brings tires more stable into the window
    Mercedes-Teamchef Toto Wolff tried to get the order in order: "We learned again how difficult it is to bring the tires into the working window. Valtteri did it, Lewis did not. This can have many reasons and vary depending on the route. The driving style, the tuning of the vehicle, the balance, the asphalt, and the external temperatures also play a part. "
    Although Mercedes in the duel with Ferrari Wolff and Lauda still see advantages in their tire management. "Ferrari brings the tires more reliably into the window. We have to make this window bigger for us. "This will be a hard learning process. Because each stretch is different. "The asphalt in Sochi was as smooth as a glass plate. Since learning has begun at zero. The next race in Barcelona will be better. The track we know from the test drives ", Lauda makes courage.
    Certain puzzles can be explained by the prehistory of the GP Russia. Mercedes had trouble heating up the front tires, because after the bad experiences with the rear tires in the races had been more concerned about keeping the rear rollers alive. Ferrari put the front tires in the window with a simple trick. One chose more camber and paid in the race with blistering on the soft tire.

    Hamilton is simply wrong
    Also for the sudden strength on the Ultrasoft tires and the time loss with the Supersoft rollers, there is a plausible assessment of the engineers. After the softest rubber mix developed from Friday away as the Sorgenkind, Mercedes concentrated more on this tire type and neglected the Longruns on the Supersoft tires. Only Hamilton drove an 11-lap stint on Supersoft on Friday. At Ferrari, both drivers were on the dress-up on the supersofts.
    Valtteri Bottas got problems with the harder mixture in traffic. The Mercedes is obviously more affected by turbulences than the Ferrari. "The front tires are chilled behind the overturned. Then I took a brake pad. This has broken my rhythm for a few rounds. It was only when I was able to drive free that I could start the tires again, "the winner said.

    Pirelli technical manager Mario Isola does not understand the needs of the teams. He does not want to know anything about a window that is too small. "The tires behave differently because they are harder throughout than in the previous year. So you have to treat them like hard tires. It's a little harder to get them to work, but when they get them, they'll stay in their windows. "
    Niki Lauda also believes that the tire question will soon find its answers. "Somehow you understand. The question is, who can do it faster? "This also applies to the drivers. "Lewis is simply wrong in the setup somewhere," summed Toto Wolff. "We saw that in other teams. In one driver the performance was very good, the other was not. "

  2. #1682
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    This is just brilliant. I don't know if you guys have seen it https://youtu.be/zke9YI-6Xvc

  3. #1683
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jax View Post
    This is just brilliant. I don't know if you guys have seen it [video]https://youtu.be/zke9YI-6Xvc[/url]
    Good traction off that Ferrari in the last sector and good brakes

  4. #1684
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    Quote Originally Posted by mizf1 View Post
    Good traction off that Ferrari in the last sector and good brakes
    yup, we just seem to NEED a bit more top end speed on the long straights....and i believe that is due to the engine OR we need to get our OWN oil burner engine map.....lol
    So 2023 started off bad, but managed to claw back some lap time come end of the year. Lets hope SF24 will give us tifosi something to smile about.

  5. #1685
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jax View Post
    This is just brilliant. I don't know if you guys have seen it [video]https://youtu.be/zke9YI-6Xvc[/url]
    S1! And that is where we lost the race... Car is on pair if not even better than Mercedes, but we need to upgrade engine with some more HP

  6. #1686
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    Quote Originally Posted by FerrariF60 View Post
    yup, we just seem to NEED a bit more top end speed on the long straights....and i believe that is due to the engine OR we need to get our OWN oil burner engine map.....lol
    Could also be setup. We might be sacrificing a bit of top end for better grip.
    Silently, like a shadow

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  8. #1688
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    Quote Originally Posted by stefa View Post
    S1! And that is where we lost the race... Car is on pair if not even better than Mercedes, but we need to upgrade engine with some more HP
    Stefa I thing that is not engine problem, but we run with slightly more aero package than mercs.

    To me it looks like ferrari prepare car to be fast across all track and race , and merc only for time to escape first 10 laps and control the race. Bassicly they are doing that last 3 years, and every time when competition push merc make errors.

    Merc dont know yet to play with near competition
    Ferrari = 235 victories + 219 pole positions + 248 fastest laps = constructors championships 16

  9. #1689
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    I am not sure tbh, yes we are great in corner entry exit and braking zones BUT, none of our guys had a near perfect lap, let alone perfect. Heck Kimi didn't even go faster on his second run. I think Kimi lost the poll position tbh. The mercs just had no answer what so ever in sector 3. This all bodes well for barcelona :)

    Quote Originally Posted by zamlatuljko View Post
    Stefa I thing that is not engine problem, but we run with slightly more aero package than mercs.

    To me it looks like ferrari prepare car to be fast across all track and race , and merc only for time to escape first 10 laps and control the race. Bassicly they are doing that last 3 years, and every time when competition push merc make errors.

    Merc dont know yet to play with near competition

  10. #1690
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    This is just pure , whatever they do they will not recover 2 seconds ~~

    Quote Originally Posted by nani_s23 View Post

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  12. #1692
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    Quote Originally Posted by zamlatuljko View Post
    Stefa I thing that is not engine problem, but we run with slightly more aero package than mercs.

    To me it looks like ferrari prepare car to be fast across all track and race , and merc only for time to escape first 10 laps and control the race. Bassicly they are doing that last 3 years, and every time when competition push merc make errors.

    Merc dont know yet to play with near competition
    Well, i think they are faster on the straights while it's obvious that we are faster in corners. Our car also has a better suspension allowing our drivers to attack chicanes more aggressively. I think we can dominate the season if Ferrari manage to put a bit more HP in the engine. If not, we may see a close battle for WCC till the very end. When it comes to WDC, it's looking good at the moment, let's hope Bottas can keep the momentum and take points off Lewis and vice versa. Let's hope Mercedes will not put team orders soon though.

  13. #1693
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormy View Post
    Well, i think they are faster on the straights while it's obvious that we are faster in corners..........
    What zamlatuljko and others are trying to say is that top speed is not only related to HP but in F1 it's heavely influenced by drag.
    Ferraris seems to have a lot of downforce but it might be 'draggier' than the Merc, aero refinement can also get those missing km/h as much as more HP.

  14. #1694
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    Quote Originally Posted by jragona View Post
    That article is obviously highly speculative... however... how does Mercedes get away with placing a dummy steering wheel in their car when it goes to scrutineering?
    Rest in Peace Leza, you were a true warrior...

  15. #1695
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    We had it last year(but inside cockpit),so nothing there!!
    Attachment 7103
    FERRARI FOR EVER !!!!!!!

  16. #1696
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    Quote Originally Posted by gvera View Post
    What zamlatuljko and others are trying to say is that top speed is not only related to HP but in F1 it's heavely influenced by drag.
    Ferraris seems to have a lot of downforce but it might be 'draggier' than the Merc, aero refinement can also get those missing km/h as much as more HP.
    Yeah i agree. However, is it possible to come with a more relaxed aero package at one race like Monza for example? Nevertheless, more downforce is better for most tracks.

  17. #1697
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormy View Post
    Yeah i agree. However, is it possible to come with a more relaxed aero package at one race like Monza for example? Nevertheless, more downforce is better for most tracks.
    Yep, Red bull had same idea when they dominated. Slow on straights but fast on corners

  18. #1698
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    Can someone paste the article

    http://www.autosport.com/premium/fea...push-in-russia

    Thanks

  19. #1699
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    Here it is mizf1!!


    May's Spanish Grand Prix usually signals the start of major upgrades, but already we have seen the development race beginning to ramp up - and various teams brought brand new parts to Sochi in the pursuit of performance boosts.
    Although the changes for next year, detailed further below, offer a momentary distraction, teams are still very-much focused on the present. And Ferrari seems to be leading the way.

    FERRARI'S DOUBLE MONKEY SEAT
    Ever since F1 adopted the central tailpipe to reduce any exhaust gas wizardry, adding a monkey seat above the rear crash structure has been a popular method of improving rear-end downforce.
    It also helps the engineers to manage the exhaust gas flow and reduce the effect on the car's wake, cutting drag generated from turbulence at the rear.
    Ferrari has doubled its fun in this area by adding a second monkey seat in front of its existing one, attaching it to the swan-neck rear-wing mounts.
    This adds a little extra downforce, and also helps to contain the flow from the exhaust a little as it leaves the pipe.
    Since prolonged exposure to heat from the exhaust can potentially cause deformation of components, wrapping the mounting points in gold foil helps to conduct that heat away.

    Further developments into cooling on the SF70-H are visible at the rear brake ducts, as Ferrari sought to reduce the brake temperatures generated by the stop-start nature of the Sochi circuit.
    A cutaway in the rear hub casing exposes a section of the brake disc, allowing it to dissipate heat as the wheel assembly rotates.
    Just behind the cutaway, cool air is channelled to the wheel rim by a slot, helping to carry away any heat build-up from the brakes. Not only does this prevent the braking issues described previously, but also minimises the risk of overheating the tyres.
    Extra heat bleeding into the tyres from the brakes can cause pressures to rise, compromising the chemical properties of the tyre rubber and increasing degradation.

    NEW T-WINGS FOR SAUBER AND WILLIAMS
    The new ruling on T-wings has no immediate effect, and teams will continue to develop in this area as they seek to maximise the effectiveness of their rear wing through 2017.
    Both Sauber and Williams brought new designs to Russia, the two teams opting for slightly different philosophies.
    Williams has replaced its single T-wing with a double-element design. Doing this creates a greater upwash effect, which elevates any unsteady airflow over the rear wing and improves its efficiency.
    Another way to do this would be to add more camber to the single-wing design, increasing the curvature of the profile, but this adds a higher drag penalty compared to using multiple shorter-chord elements.
    Williams has also done away with the small added wing above the exhaust pipe, considering it surplus to requirements of managing airflow at the rear.
    Sauber has experimented with a number of T-wing designs, and raced in Russia with a design similar to that adopted by McLaren in China.
    This consists of a cambered wing element that curves around and back underneath to add an extra point of attachment to the shark fin, reducing the wing flex under load.
    This also offers greater control over the direction of airflow, helping shape any vortices to be directed away from the rear wing.

    The Swiss team also continued with a twin-bargeboard design trialled in Bahrain, which includes a series of tiny strakes along the bottom of the first bargeboard.
    This collects any turbulent airflow from the front part of the car, cleans it up and sends it to be directed around the sidepod by the second bargeboard.

    HAAS LATE ON THE BRAKES
    Following a spate of braking woes that have plagued Haas for the best part of a year, the American team emerged from the garage on Friday sporting new Carbone Industrie brakes, in place of components from supplier Brembo, which it has used since joining the grid for 2016.
    Haas tested the Carbone Industrie brakes in the post-Bahrain GP test and, although the drivers seemed happy with the feel of the car under braking then, the team came across a number of issues in Friday practice at Sochi.
    The Carbone Industrie discs featured rows of six holes around the disc circumference, but despite its best efforts Haas was still unhappy with the cooling of the new brakes and was worried that in the current configuration they may not last the race distance.
    On Saturday morning the decision was made to revert to Brembo for the rest of the Russian GP weekend, prompting Haas to seek further developments for cooling the Carbone Industrie components more effectively for Spain.
    Generally, failing to cool the brake components properly results in thermal expansion of the disc and calipers, and this can result in the disc shedding material and creating a lot of dust as the driver brakes.
    If this happens too often, the brake assembly can become severely damaged, the result of which is often a driver in the wall, much like Romain Grosjean's brake failure in Malaysia last year.
    The road to fixing the brake issues has been long and arduous for Haas, but the team is hoping that it is close to a resolution.

    MINOR TOUCHES AT MERCEDES...
    Although bodywork is meticulously sculpted by aerodynamicists across the grid, packaging everything as tightly as possible to guide airflow towards the rear, this still creates the problem of managing the air afterwards.
    After airflow has passed over the bodywork, it creates large wake structures at the rear and as a result creates a lot of drag.
    To combat this, Mercedes has added a small flap around the trailing edge of the rear bodywork, guiding the airflow over the lower suspension wishbones to manage the wake and directing it towards the diffuser to boost performance.
    As a result, it also helps prevent the air passing over the bodywork from mixing with the cooling outlets, meaning that hot air expelled from the internal components does not cycle back into the car.

    ...AND AT RED BULL
    Looking to close the gap to leading duo Mercedes and Ferrari, Red Bull has made minimal changes to its RB13 so far this season, instead prudently using practice sessions to thoroughly assess the drawbacks of its current package.
    The team investigated the deflection of its front wing at Sochi, developing a greater understanding of how it performs under the various loads experienced on-track.
    Red Bull also trialled a new flow conditioner around the sidepod, moving the mounting point further outboard. The team tested this area with flow-viz over the Bahrain weekend, and the new design suggests Red Bull perhaps felt the conditioner spanning the length of the sidepod was not producing the flow structures needed over the rest of the car.
    It is expected to bring a hugely upgraded car to Barcelona; Red Bull advisor Helmut Marko has promised a "revamped chassis" for the Spanish Grand Prix, where the Milton Keynes-based outfit will be hoping to repeat its surprise victory last year, when Max Verstappen held off Kimi Raikkonen to win in his first race for the team.

    RENAULT'S NEW FRONT WING
    As Renault seeks to continue its ascent up the order, the engineers at Enstone sent a brand new front wing out to Sochi.
    In the picture above, underneath the old front wing, you can see the new design. This features an extra element on the upper flap assembly, also removing the V-shaped cut-out from the top flap in the process.
    Although the elements now have shorter chord lengths, the wing ensures that airflow is able to stay attached more easily, providing more-adequate control of flow around the suspension geometry.
    The overall surface area also appears to be greater than the previous design, adding an increase in front-end downforce and further management of airflow downstream.
    The new wing also features a change in the vortex tunnel, where the opening has been moved closer to the endplate. This works the airflow slightly harder, directing the resulting vortex around the tyre with greater effect and reducing any problems that the rotating wheel creates through generating unpredictable flow structures.

    AN EYE ON 2018
    As mentioned in the beginning, prior to the Sochi race the FIA revealed its intention to roll out the new 'shield' cockpit protection system next year, discarding the much-maligned halo concept that has not only divided opinions among the F1 fanbase, but also between the drivers.
    The shield draws cues from the Red Bull-endorsed aeroscreen, but sits lower down and extends down the nose, aiming to deflect any debris from the driver's head.
    Although the aesthetics of the design are a marked improvement over the halo, concerns have been raised over its ability to contend with larger pieces of bodywork.
    The other 2018 change affects a controversial loophole in this year's regulations that resulted in various interpretations of shark fins and T-wings.
    Due to the reprofiling of the newly swept-back rear wing, this left an open platform for teams to add aerodynamic devices onto the shark-fin.
    Amid complaints from miscellaneous quarters in the paddock, the fins and wings have been nipped in the bud for 2018 by the FIA revising the permitted dimensions of the engine-cover bodywork.
    The bounding boxes defined in the FIA regulations 3.5.2 and 3.5.7, in which aerodynamic devices are not permitted, will be expanded for 2018 to discourage the further development of shark-fins and T-wings.
    This move should placate some of the more extreme critics of the new appendages.
    Last edited by GustavoTrunci; 2nd May 2017 at 19:54.

  20. #1700
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    Thanks

  21. #1701
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    I think that Ferrari for hi speed tracks will be less dragier. Right now they setup car to be fast on every corner and straight evenly.
    Mercs looks to catchup in corner area.
    Remeber 2 years ago, there was some news about merc design, their filosophy was to make car fast on 17 race tracks of 20.

    Because of huge powerplant from engine Merc never was challenged in some track that suit them, last example is Sochi.
    When realised that Ferrari is fast across whole lap, merc was in mess. Thirs sector was awfull, if Ferrari was in league with RB, Mercs will be laping 0.5sec slower and everything will be fine for them and tyres.

    Right now after very bad year after 4 races Ferari have 2 wins, and 2 races lost but fight to last corner.
    Lets enjoy in moment for our red guys, strong Ferrari and finaly formula 1.

    Good news that in this time Kimi have great chance for some wins.
    Ferrari = 235 victories + 219 pole positions + 248 fastest laps = constructors championships 16

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  23. #1703
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    http://en.f1i.com/news/267294-eddie-...-mercedes.html
    this guy doesn't shut his mouth...

  24. #1704
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    Quote Originally Posted by nani_s23 View Post
    maybe there's some truth to it....who knows!?!?!?
    but i personally think that if Ferrari gives Seb a championship winning car, i see NO reason for him to jump "ships"....but that's just me though

  25. #1705
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    Damn if Vettel Goes, thats it i guess till Ferrari can pull a miracle and bring a car that dominates every race and not just 3 or 4 suited tracks

  26. #1706
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    the tire allocation fr Spain on F1.com is S M H?

    https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/h...r-austria.html

  27. #1707
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    Quote Originally Posted by zike View Post
    the tire allocation fr Spain on F1.com is S M H?

    https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/h...r-austria.html
    yes

  28. #1708
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    Mercs are planning to bring some upgrades for barcelona, which they think will give slight advantage over ferrari.

    Hopefully we too have few upgrades under our sleeves.

  29. #1709
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    Quote Originally Posted by nani_s23 View Post
    Mercs are planning to bring some upgrades for barcelona, which they think will give slight advantage over ferrari.

    Hopefully we too have few upgrades under our sleeves.
    o NO :o, The gap will be increasing, any info on possible ferrari upgrades?

  30. #1710
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    Quote Originally Posted by mwk360 View Post
    o NO :o, The gap will be increasing, any info on possible ferrari upgrades?
    Ferrari seems to have brought updates to almost every race so far; technically SPAIN is the track that lot of teams will bring significant upgrades and im sure Ferrari will be amongst those teams.

    let's hope our updates will be just better tehn the Merc's

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