Scuderia Ferrari SF70H

[GustavoTrunci]

article of Gary "Will Hamilton's woe continue in Canada?"


As a die-hard Lewis Hamilton fan, I just wanted to know what went wrong on Lewis's car at Monaco. Is it just the set-up, or something else? Did Mercedes give him a different set-up to Bottas and could this affect the next race in Canada?

Rohan Devara, via Facebook

I am sure the engineers at Mercedes would also like to know what happened there! They will be trawling through the data trying to find whatever widget it was that wasn't widgeting correctly.
I'm pretty sure there would be at least subtle differences in the set-up between the two cars, but they should be easy to recognise. Remember, in FP3 both Mercedes cars were struggling a little bit. While Bottas got it together for qualifying, Hamilton didn't.
Since last month's post-Bahrain Grand Prix test, I don't think that Hamilton has been as comfortable with the car as Bottas has. They altered something on the set-up there to try to improve the tyre life and whatever it was seemed to affect Hamilton that little bit more.
Both of them drive quite differently. Hamilton likes to take his braking right into the apex of the corner, and for that you need rear-end stability on the brakes.
Bottas brakes more in a straight line, and is then fairly reactive with the steering wheel going through the corner. For that you need consistent front grip, while both need good traction.
Watching the car at the Barcelona test and again in the grand prix on television, I believe the Mercedes has inherent understeer. But around that understeer, the rear of the car is rotating so in effect the whole car is sliding.
I'm pretty sure it doesn't just lack grip, and if Mercedes tries to fix the understeer, the rear rotation will just get worse. If Mercedes tries to fix the rotation, the understeer will just get worse, so it's a Catch 22 situation. It also looks worse with softer tyres.
To me, the Ferrari doesn't show any of these characteristics no matter what tyre it's on.
Montreal is a whole different deal and I'm pretty sure Mercedes still has a little bit extra power over Ferrari. In Canada, that will be an advantage. But if the Ferrari chassis has a better balance, the team may just be able to aerodynamically trim it that little bit better. So I'm expecting the battle to continue.

[vetalo]

article of Gary "Will Hamilton's woe continue in Canada?"


As a die-hard Lewis Hamilton fan, I just wanted to know what went wrong on Lewis's car at Monaco. Is it just the set-up, or something else? Did Mercedes give him a different set-up to Bottas and could this affect the next race in Canada?

Rohan Devara, via Facebook

I am sure the engineers at Mercedes would also like to know what happened there! They will be trawling through the data trying to find whatever widget it was that wasn't widgeting correctly.
I'm pretty sure there would be at least subtle differences in the set-up between the two cars, but they should be easy to recognise. Remember, in FP3 both Mercedes cars were struggling a little bit. While Bottas got it together for qualifying, Hamilton didn't.
Since last month's post-Bahrain Grand Prix test, I don't think that Hamilton has been as comfortable with the car as Bottas has. They altered something on the set-up there to try to improve the tyre life and whatever it was seemed to affect Hamilton that little bit more.
Both of them drive quite differently. Hamilton likes to take his braking right into the apex of the corner, and for that you need rear-end stability on the brakes.
Bottas brakes more in a straight line, and is then fairly reactive with the steering wheel going through the corner. For that you need consistent front grip, while both need good traction.
Watching the car at the Barcelona test and again in the grand prix on television, I believe the Mercedes has inherent understeer. But around that understeer, the rear of the car is rotating so in effect the whole car is sliding.
I'm pretty sure it doesn't just lack grip, and if Mercedes tries to fix the understeer, the rear rotation will just get worse. If Mercedes tries to fix the rotation, the understeer will just get worse, so it's a Catch 22 situation. It also looks worse with softer tyres.
To me, the Ferrari doesn't show any of these characteristics no matter what tyre it's on.
Montreal is a whole different deal and I'm pretty sure Mercedes still has a little bit extra power over Ferrari. In Canada, that will be an advantage. But if the Ferrari chassis has a better balance, the team may just be able to aerodynamically trim it that little bit better. So I'm expecting the battle to continue.

Thank you

[vetalo]

Really?? Is gang a race? You can say I am generalizing, but racist? ok! Doesnt he want to be like a gangster? With chains and tatoos and other things, earings and piercings. I am ok with all that, I am just saying as I see it. What is wrong with being a gangster? You are the one who has an issue with that word it seems. I dont hate him, I think he is a good driver, I just dont like that he complains and doesnt put the work in and trying to undermine others who put the work in by saying tiers are not good. I dont care about him and his lifestyles, I just say how it is.
Also, how do you know I didnt achieve what I wanted? Life is not just about money and fame you know.
Please, dont bring this political correctness in here. This is what is wrong with the world today. You have to say how things how they are!
One more thing, why the heck are people saying its the tiers are the ones it to blame for Mercedes problems. Look at Ferrari, Force India, and even to some extent Red Bull, they have done a decent job! So, its Mercedes fault for not building a good enough car. Its not fault of anyone else. Also, if Hamilton doesnt want to go tier testing, then its his fault, so he needs to go through the consequences. Simple!

Go and check the definition of the word gangster before you talk again so everybody that wear chain and tattoo are call gangster maybe where you are from

[bondilad]

Any idea if we are bringing new parts for the race ?

[jragona]

Nice article:

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/t...rgence-914696/

[FerrariF60]

weather dont' look too promising.
looks like i'm gonna get rained on come sunday...unless the weather will change by then

[mardyrt]

Go and check the definition of the word gangster before you talk again so everybody that wear chain and tattoo are call gangster maybe where you are from

Yup, exactly right, that is why I said in my previous post, "You can say I am GENERALIZING", but then again, what do I know, I am a stupid racist person that have not achieved anything.

[mardyrt]

Tyer Testing

Vettel - 2228km
Hamilton - 50km

All I can say is, WOW!

[da_one]

Nice article:

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/t...rgence-914696/

Not Seb's nor Kimi's fault if Ham finds tire testing a 'waste of my time." Look who is struggling now

[mardyrt]

Not Seb's nor Kimi's fault if Ham finds tire testing a 'waste of my time." Look who is struggling now

My point exactly. I think Mr. Toto needs to look into his own team before taking a shot at Ferrari and Pirelli, even if it was a joke, which I dont think he was joking.
I hope they do not change the tiers so it suits Mercedes like they did in 2012 in the middle of the season for Red Bull.

[mardyrt]

Nice article:

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/t...rgence-914696/

I think this is a good example of how hard work pays off.

[jragona]

I think this is a good example of how hard work pays off.

Exactly,looks like Merc really were resting on their laurels...

[gjoko-mkd]

[gvera]

PU components usage at the beginning of Canadian GP

http://www.fia.com/file/57938/download?token=Imgx_h55


Checo Perez and Lance Stroll have used only 1 of each component, that Merc is reliable.

[jgonzalesm6]

PU components usage at the beginning of Canadian GP

http://www.fia.com/file/57938/download?token=Imgx_h55


Checo Perez and Lance Stroll have used only 1 of each component, that Merc is reliable.

thanks for the update. They(FI) probably have the TC (turbocharger) turned down a bit and not running at max. boost pressure.

Here again we see both drivers running with different rear wing set-ups....don't know which one is which.


Attachment 7163

[abbottcostello]

PU components usage at the beginning of Canadian GP

http://www.fia.com/file/57938/download?token=Imgx_h55


Checo Perez and Lance Stroll have used only 1 of each component, that Merc is reliable.

Ferrari not in too bad position, all turbo allotment for Seb are in play but still usable I think - so careful management & fingers crossed!

[gvera]

Ferrari not in too bad position, all turbo allotment for Seb are in play but still usable I think - so careful management & fingers crossed!

Yes, but no chance to upgrade the TC without a penalty.
And this championship will depend on development.

[mizf1]

PU components usage at the beginning of Canadian GP

http://www.fia.com/file/57938/download?token=Imgx_h55


Checo Perez and Lance Stroll have used only 1 of each component, that Merc is reliable.

Stroll has only used 1 component each because if you add the 6 GP's together it would probably equal 1 full grand prix distance

[gvera]

Stroll has only used 1 component each because if you add the 6 GP's together it would probably equal 1 full grand prix distance

The PU is reliable and crash resistant!

[nani_s23]

IMG_5696.JPG
BOth Ferrari cars are fitted with different rearwing specs -amus

[nani_s23]

IMG_5697.JPG
Found in other forum..!!

[mizf1]

The 'Spoon' shape rear wing is something Merc have used in the past few seasons

[jgonzalesm6]

The 'Spoon' shape rear wing is something Merc have used in the past few seasons

Vettels rear wing "looks like the Mercs" while Kimi's rear wing is just straight across.

[jgonzalesm6]

Seeing through the window - - - Pirelli analysis June 5, 2017

How working range affects tyre performance


There’s a window looking onto Formula 1®, in two senses of the word. The first vista is of the battle between Ferrari and Mercedes – or rather Lewis Hamilton and Sebastian Vettel, as they fight for the world titles. The other window is to do more specifically with tyres. We’re talking of course about the working range: the area in which each compound is operating at its best.


The right working range has been key to performance pretty much since tyres were invented. Tapping into the ideal working range means accessing the very best that a tyre can offer: maximum performance, therefore optimal grip and better balance, wear and degradation. Operating a tyre below its working range means not getting the best out of it; above its ideal working range means that performance drops off and tyre wear can become critical.

This year, the new generation of tyres that are 25% wider can guarantee considerably enhanced performance if used properly, and this means that getting into the right working range is more important than ever.

That’s why, in Monaco where Vettel and Ferrari dominated the sixth grand prix of the year, there was little talk of anything other than the working range of the tyres. The streets of the Principality are characterised by asphalt with a traditionally low level of abrasion, generating little by way of downforce thanks to the low average lap speed. All this together tends to make for slippery conditions.

For Monaco – and only for Monaco – it would be useful to have a compound considerably softer than the ultrasoft: currently the softest compound available in the F1® range. And for now, that’s clearly impossible, with the same five compounds (ultrasoft, supersoft, soft, medium and hard) chosen during the winter for all the races on the calendar.

So, here’s the school of thought for now: Ferrari somehow manages to use its tyres better than its rivals. Or to be more specific: it manages to get them within (or at least closer to) the correct working range more often. This seems to be one of the key technical themes of the 2017 season: Ferrari and Mercedes, which have each won three of the first six grands prix, are delivering one of those enduring technical duels that have always made, and will continue to make, history in Formula 1®. The German squad comes off the back of three dominant years; whereas the Italian team has this year come up with a car that is remarkable for its efficiency and versatility. Its ability to get the best out of its tyres, despite the differing demands of each circuit, will be an even more crucial factor than usual when it comes to the business of obtaining results.

But what exactly does ‘working range’ – or ‘optimal usage window’ – mean? Essentially, it comes down to temperature. It’s a well-known fact that a tyre offers more grip with more temperature, which enhances its capacity to adhere to the surface. But only up to a certain point: beyond which over-heating can lead to too much degradation, lack of grip, and other problems. These optimal usage windows vary according to the five slick compounds (the ones for the intermediates and full wets, which use another structure and compound, are different) as you can see on the table below.

Attachment 7166

Generally speaking, these compounds cover a working range of about 30 degrees each, starting with the low working range compounds (ultrasoft, supersoft and medium – although this last one can be defined as medium working range) and peaking at more than 100 degrees centigrade for the high working range compounds: soft and hard. It’s a question of not only bringing these tyres up to the ideal working range quickly but also of keeping them there: in other words, making sure that they don’t subsequently heat up or cool down too much.

The challenge also consists of making sure both the front and the rear tyres are both working in that ideal range at the same time. This factor in particular seems to have been one of the key factors influencing car performance at the start of the 2017 season.

The one important point to bear in mind – and it’s a fact worth underlining – is that all the tyres and compounds are identical for everyone. They are assigned to each team by the FIA with a barcode and every team receives and shares the same technical information with Pirelli, even when it’s one team rather than another carrying out a particular test.

What makes the difference from that point onwards is set-up: those important technical decisions based on aerodynamics, chassis, weight and dimensions, as well as the characteristics of the suspension and its geometry.

All the things, in summary, that are targeted at one sole objective: optimising the performance and driveability of a car, by – amongst other things – nailing the optimal working window of the tyres. It sounds straightforward enough, but throughout the history of motorsport, thousands of races have been won or lost just because of this very variable…


source: http://racing.pirelli.com/global/en-...gh-the-window#

[JPBD]

It looks like Ferrari have brought a good range of updates to this GP. I'm excited.

Whether we win or not, I'm proud of Ferrari. They're taking no prisoners this season. It's great.

[mizf1]

Vettels rear wing "looks like the Mercs" while Kimi's rear wing is just straight across.

They possibly doing back to back comparisons.

[nani_s23]

THE TIRE ROLL ON THE TRACK
Mercedes is experimenting with setups
Mercedes is on the trail of the tire. Suspicion is the coordination of the landing gear. In the luggage for Canada are new parts, which are to enlarge the tuning window. Hamilton and Bottas will experiment with the training.

A solution needs to be done, and that quickly. Otherwise, Ferrari will leave with the World Championship title. Mercedes is on the trail of the tire. The GP Canada is to provide initial answers to many questions. Montreal is once again a racing circuit, on which the warming up of the tires is a balancing act. Actually even worse than in Monte Carlo because the covering is smooth, the curves short and the straight so long that between the tires cool down.

Ferrari brings its tires reliably into their working windows. Front and rear. At Mercedes it can happen that the front tires only work when the rear soles already dismantle. For Teamchef Toto Wolff, the broader cars with their extreme aerodynamics reveal weak points rather than in the past: "The load changes are more extreme. The tire is no longer able to compensate for this because it has a different structure. "

The mechanical setup is suspected
The problem is partly in the heredity of the Mercedes W08. "The tuning window, in which our car harmonizes with the tires, is too small," explains an engineer. This resulted in an analysis of the first six races. Because a racing car can not be rebuilt overnight, a short-term solution has to be prepared for the next races. "And that is only about setup," explains Wolff.
Valtteri Bottas Confirms "We have investigated our tire problems and have come to certain knowledge. The focus is on the mechanical tuning and the vehicle balance. "The Finn is convinced:" If we could drive again today in Monte Carlo, we would be faster. Whether it would be enough for Ferrari, I can not say. "

Mercedes Will use the Friday training in Montreal to go new ways with the chassis tuning. Both Lewis Hamilton and Valtteri Bottas do mysteriously: "We have a few new things that we will try." For example, weight has been slimmed down. "We are now close to the ideal," says Bottas.
The rest of the changes can only be expected. It should lie in the area of ​​the dampers, stabilizers and springs. The goal is to make the car more mobile over a wide range. "Sometimes it's really a ride on Messer's edge. On Sunday in Monte Carlo the car was not easy to drive, "Bottas admits.

Quick response yes, panic no
But how much time does Mercedes still have to react to a problem, Does not seem to have? "We're not panic," Bottas says. "But it is clear that we must not let ourselves be allowed too much time. Every bad race of us gives Ferrari points. We have to work on the car and the set-up, because there is hardly any difference between us and Ferrari on the engine. "
Toto Wolff has already the medium-term changes in mind: "First comes the setup. Then new Aero parts to optimize the balance. "Programs are already running in the long term. "We have to ask ourselves whether we need to change something in the overall concept.
One thing the investigation of Mercedes revealed: the long wheelbase is not the problem. The low angle of attack may already be. However, Mercedes can only be a long-running driver. Wolff says: "This is a concept we do not know. On the fast side, a strong angle of attack might solve some problems.

[gvera]

They possibly doing back to back comparisons.

The curved wing might be a low downforce wing for Baku, let's see if they continue to use it thru the weekend

[mardyrt]

Quick rant!

Ok. None of the media people talk about what is the main reason why Mercedes have tyer problems. The main reason is, non of their current drivers had any more than 50km of experience with the team, to set up or how the previous years car behaved on these new tyers at the beginning of the year.
Either they are not diligent enough to find out that information, or they just dont want to show that the real reason is the Mercedes team was complacent including Hamilton. They just cannot say its Pirellis fault, making the tyers too complicated or suit Ferrari.
It did not suit Ferrari. Ferrari suit their car to the tyers! This is what Mercedes should do! They (Mercedes) and the British media, should not bring up the problem with the tyers, they should say, the Mercedes simply have not done a good enough job. Simple. Then, just move on!

[da_one]

Quick rant!

Ok. None of the media people talk about what is the main reason why Mercedes have tyer problems. The main reason is, non of their current drivers had any more than 50km of experience with the team, to set up or how the previous years car behaved on these new tyers at the beginning of the year.
Either they are not diligent enough to find out that information, or they just dont want to show that the real reason is the Mercedes team was complacent including Hamilton. They just cannot say its Pirellis fault, making the tyers too complicated or suit Ferrari.
It did not suit Ferrari. Ferrari suit their car to the tyers! This is what Mercedes should do! They (Mercedes) and the British media, should not bring up the problem with the tyers, they should say, the Mercedes simply have not done a good enough job. Simple. Then, just move on!

I think RB and Merc believed their trick suspension will be deemed legal this year and so were (over)confident enough not to compel their two main drivers do the tire testing themselves and instead use their test drivers do the dirty work.

As we know, their trick suspension makes it easier for the drivers to keep the tires in their ideal operating window (since they keep pressure and temperature stable) to obtain maximum performance while being easy on them and thus extend their life during the race.

At the end of the day, it caught them out big time! It's no coincidence that they lost a bit of their performance once their truck suspension got banned.