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Thread: Ferrari signs new long-term Marlboro deal

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    So again show us the numbers?

    Let's try another example, how much is Santander paying PM to use their ad space and how much revenue is this giving them? Or are they taking a financial hit for exposure through advertising on a Ferrari? Again I assume you will have numbers at hand....
    Oh look what just popped up on my computer.......here's what sponsor's/partners pay for ad-space....seems pretty lucrative to me!!!

    just off the top....

    •Alfa Romeo: 100 M€
    •Santander: 30,5 M€
    •Shell: 27 M€
    •UPS: 23 M€

    total in all....473.5M euro's as of Sept. 11, 2017

    263 ferrari sponsors $$$$$.jpg
    Last edited by jgonzalesm6; 11th September 2017 at 10:28.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    Oh look what just popped up on my computer.......here's what sponsor's/partners pay for ad-space....seems pretty lucrative to me!!!

    just off the top....

    •Alfa Romeo: 100 M€
    •Santander: 30,5 M€
    •Shell: 27 M€
    •UPS: 23 M€

    total in all....473.5M

    263 ferrari sponsors $$$$$.jpg


    If your interested in the other teams.....here ya go

    https://twitter.com/AUTbusinessport

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    Oh look what just popped up on my computer.......here's what sponsor's/partners pay for ad-space....seems pretty lucrative to me!!!

    just off the top....

    •Alfa Romeo: 100 M€
    •Santander: 30,5 M€
    •Shell: 27 M€
    •UPS: 23 M€

    total in all....473.5M euro's as of Sept. 11, 2017

    263 ferrari sponsors $$$$$.jpg
    ok so now I'm a bit confused. I thought PM initially had a 10 year deal with Ferrari worth USD 1 Billion. Then once that got expired they signed another one for three years in 2015 for a cool 160 Million a year. So according to the media
    now that has been extended for an undisclosed figure. After looking at the what the sponsors have been paying individually....the figure 160 Million a year doesn't make much sense.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by aroutis View Post
    Of course it is a lucrative deal.
    Everyone that knows how a multi billion company works, knows they account on how even a dollar is spent.
    So of course this deal is good for both Ferrari and PMI.

    Not sure why anyone would debate this.
    I completely agree. However, some people here beg to differ.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by bondilad View Post
    ok so now I'm a bit confused. I thought PM initially had a 10 year deal with Ferrari worth USD 1 Billion. Then once that got expired they signed another one for three years in 2015 for a cool 160 Million a year. So according to the media
    now that has been extended for an undisclosed figure. After looking at the what the sponsors have been paying individually....the figure 160 Million a year doesn't make much sense.
    Did you make those figures yourself as they make no sense LOL and the figures are what they are paying Ferrari no?
    Forza Ferrari

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormy View Post
    I completely agree. However, some people here beg to differ.
    I could sponsor you per post, would I see a return on that?

    Nope....just because you sponsor something does not mean it's a money profit.....but off course anyone would know that.
    Forza Ferrari

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Did you make those figures yourself as they make no sense LOL and the figures are what they are paying Ferrari no?
    I read about it on ESPN f1.

    10 year deal worth a billion dollars
    http://en.espn.co.uk/ferrari/motorsp...ory/51683.html

    3 year deal 160 million a year.
    http://www.espn.com/f1/story/_/id/12...nsorship-quiet

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    No I don't believe Marlboro get a slice of any other ads. Ferrari is red not cause of Marlboro....Santander pay Ferrari for sponsorship they don't pay Marlboro?
    I think jgonzalesm6 is right. Philip Morris own a large part of the ad space on the Ferrari car. They sell it to other companies to use if and when they can't. Not sure if this new deal is the same But Rob was right as well, Ferrari sponsorship is still lucrative to Marlboro in countries where advertising smoking is still legal.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silent Bob View Post
    Ferrari sponsorship is still lucrative to Marlboro in countries where advertising smoking is still legal.
    Yeah, and they are pretty aggressive with their marketing there.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    I could sponsor you per post, would I see a return on that?

    Nope....just because you sponsor something does not mean it's a money profit.....but off course anyone would know that.
    This honestly makes no sense.

    Again, companies with the size of PMI do not throw money to deals of the likes we discuss, unless they make money out of them.
    It's called a business plan. Business plans in such organizations are not approved unless they can produce profit.
    A business plan has to take into account risks, show risk assessments, ROI ( Return of Investment ) etc.

    Approvals of such business plans are usually made over a board committee and the members of such board are accountable to the stakeholders of the organization / company.

    So understand , really, that yes, if such a sponsorship takes place, it will be profitable to the company otherwise head shall roll.

    And AFAIK , for the past years of this sponsorship, they haven't have they?
    Last edited by aroutis; 12th September 2017 at 12:16.
    "If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari" - Gilles Villeneuve

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by aroutis View Post
    This honestly makes no sense.

    Again, companies with the size of PMI do not throw money to deals of the likes we discuss, unless they make money out of them.
    It's called a business plan. Business plans in such organizations are not approved unless they can produce profit.
    A business plan has to take into account risks, show risk assessments, ROI ( Return of Investment ) etc.

    Approvals of such business plans are usually made over a board committee and the members of such board are accountable to the stakeholders of the organization / company.

    So understand , really, that yes, if such a sponsorship takes place, it will be profitable to the company otherwise head shall roll.

    And AFAIK , for the past years of this sponsorship, they haven't have they?
    Of course, when a company of this magnitude makes a deal like this you don't ask whether they have something to gain for it, because of course they do. They exist only for profit, they are not into this simply because of their love for Ferrari or because they made a dumb move.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by aroutis View Post
    This honestly makes no sense.

    Again, companies with the size of PMI do not throw money to deals of the likes we discuss, unless they make money out of them.
    It's called a business plan. Business plans in such organizations are not approved unless they can produce profit.
    A business plan has to take into account risks, show risk assessments, ROI ( Return of Investment ) etc.

    Approvals of such business plans are usually made over a board committee and the members of such board are accountable to the stakeholders of the organization / company.

    So understand , really, that yes, if such a sponsorship takes place, it will be profitable to the company otherwise head shall roll.

    And AFAIK , for the past years of this sponsorship, they haven't have they?
    Sponsoring something or someone does not mean it's automatic financial gain.....sorry if you can't accept that
    Forza Ferrari

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Sponsoring something or someone does not mean it's automatic financial gain.....sorry if you can't accept that
    It is when a multi-billion company does. Otherwise, why would they do that? Besides, marketing in countries where tobacco marketing is somewhat legal is not really beneficial for them? Add a percentage of ad space on top of it and you get both profit and brand advertising. Plus many people are constantly talking about it which connects PM to Ferrari.

  14. #74
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    Yeah multi billion companies never make anything but profit....
    Forza Ferrari

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Yeah multi billion companies never make anything but profit....
    Dude, the ban on tobacco is in place since 2007. PM's executives are not idiots to constantly renewal a contract if their company doesn't have any benefits out of it. I also just found out that PM still sponsors Ducati in Moto GP.

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormy View Post
    Dude, the ban on tobacco is in place since 2007. PM's executives are not idiots to constantly renewal a contract if their company doesn't have any benefits out of it. I also just found out that PM still sponsors Ducati in Moto GP.
    I am sure they have benefits without a doubt, but as I keep saying that does not mean they make money from the deal and we go round in circles.
    Forza Ferrari

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Sponsoring something or someone does not mean it's automatic financial gain.....sorry if you can't accept that
    This honestly makes no sense.

    Again, companies with the size of PMI do not throw money to deals of the likes we discuss, unless they make money out of them.
    It's called a business plan. Business plans in such organizations are not approved unless they can produce profit.
    A business plan has to take into account risks, show risk assessments, ROI ( Return of Investment ) etc.

    Approvals of such business plans are usually made over a board committee and the members of such board are accountable to the stakeholders of the organization / company.

    So understand , really, that yes, if such a sponsorship takes place, it will be profitable to the company otherwise head shall roll.

    And AFAIK , for the past years of this sponsorship, they haven't have they?
    I understand that perhaps you don't understand concepts like Business plan, Risk analysis and assessments, ROI, etc.
    I am open to send you available links so you can understand what I answer here.
    In short, it's simple :
    A sponsorship is an investment
    An investment is expected to pay back the original amount plus profit
    If this sponsorship is a recurring act, it can only mean that it DOES return profit and there is no way that it does not, yet money is spent on an endless pit.

    Clear?
    Last edited by aroutis; 13th September 2017 at 12:37.
    "If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari" - Gilles Villeneuve

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    I am sure they have benefits without a doubt, but as I keep saying that does not mean they make money from the deal and we go round in circles.
    The only reason we're going in circles is that you claim that there is a chance that PMI is renewing a sponsorship agreement for some reason other than profit.

    Now, I do hope you're familiar with Occam's razor that in short states :
    "when you have two competing theories that make exactly the same predictions, the simpler one is the better."

    So, we have two theories here :
    1. PMI sponsors Ferrari for numerous years because they gain financial profit
    2. PMI sponsors Ferrari for numerous years DESPITE gaining money out of this act.

    Under Occam's raisor, the simplest of the two theories gains to be the better.
    Simple and clean really.

    If you insist, I say we put these two to a vote.
    "If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari" - Gilles Villeneuve

  19. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by aroutis View Post
    The only reason we're going in circles is that you claim that there is a chance that PMI is renewing a sponsorship agreement for some reason other than profit.

    Now, I do hope you're familiar with Occam's razor that in short states :
    "when you have two competing theories that make exactly the same predictions, the simpler one is the better."

    So, we have two theories here :
    1. PMI sponsors Ferrari for numerous years because they gain financial profit
    2. PMI sponsors Ferrari for numerous years DESPITE gaining money out of this act.

    Under Occam's raisor, the simplest of the two theories gains to be the better.
    Simple and clean really.

    If you insist, I say we put these two to a vote.
    And we go in circles as you along with others can't post any fact or figures about how much money is made or not.

    Marlboro sponsor Ferrari for a financial loss but gain in exposure of their brand is the theory you seemed to miss.....Let's even expand it further how about Santander how much are they making from the sponsorship from Ferrari? They are promoting their brand how many customers have they gained from the Ferrari exposure?
    Forza Ferrari

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    I am sure they have benefits without a doubt, but as I keep saying that does not mean they make money from the deal and we go round in circles.
    What those benefits can be? Money laundering?

  21. #81
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    Why Philip Morris still sponsors Ferrari

    After Ferrari came under fire over subliminal Marlboro cigarette advertising on its car this week, Formula Money's Christian Sylt looks at why parent company Philip Morris continues to sponsor the team.

    The key reason why Philip Morris and Marlboro still sponsor Ferrari is the subliminal recognition with consumers that a long-term partnership creates. In 2005 a study by British American Tobacco showed that the Camel cigarette brand, which stopped its F1 sponsorship in 1993, still had double the awareness level of its rival Mild Seven - title sponsor of the world championship-winning Renault team that year. The same applied to other brands such as Gauloises, which left F1 in 2000, but still had around 12.5% awareness by 2005 compared to Mild Seven's 10%.

    By maintaining the impression of a presence on the Ferrari cars, Marlboro increases the length of its association with the team. In turn, this increases the length of time people will believe it is an F1 sponsor once it has completely pulled out of the sport.

    In a nutshell, the purpose of a long-term partnership is to embed in the consumer's mind the connection between the brand and the team, and, even more so, to get an emotional connection between the two of those. For example, while Marlboro is still a Ferrari partner it can use the image of the cars on cigarette packets even though its own logo is not used on the cars.

    If this connection is made effectively, not only are the benefits optimised while the brand is sponsoring the team but there should also be a residual benefit after it has pulled out, particularly in terms of awareness as time goes on. Marlboro's current agreement allows it to continue forging this connection in the minds of consumers, despite tobacco brands being barred from the sport. Hence the comments by the European Public Health Commissioner.


    http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/vi...nsors_Ferrari/
    #KeepFightingMichael | #CiaoJules

  22. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    And we go in circles as you along with others can't post any fact or figures about how much money is made or not.

    Marlboro sponsor Ferrari for a financial loss but gain in exposure of their brand is the theory you seemed to miss.....Let's even expand it further how about Santander how much are they making from the sponsorship from Ferrari? They are promoting their brand how many customers have they gained from the Ferrari exposure?
    Exposure of their brand equals financial gain. That is what you miss here.
    "If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari" - Gilles Villeneuve

  23. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by vcs316 View Post
    Why Philip Morris still sponsors Ferrari

    After Ferrari came under fire over subliminal Marlboro cigarette advertising on its car this week, Formula Money's Christian Sylt looks at why parent company Philip Morris continues to sponsor the team.

    The key reason why Philip Morris and Marlboro still sponsor Ferrari is the subliminal recognition with consumers that a long-term partnership creates. In 2005 a study by British American Tobacco showed that the Camel cigarette brand, which stopped its F1 sponsorship in 1993, still had double the awareness level of its rival Mild Seven - title sponsor of the world championship-winning Renault team that year. The same applied to other brands such as Gauloises, which left F1 in 2000, but still had around 12.5% awareness by 2005 compared to Mild Seven's 10%.

    By maintaining the impression of a presence on the Ferrari cars, Marlboro increases the length of its association with the team. In turn, this increases the length of time people will believe it is an F1 sponsor once it has completely pulled out of the sport.

    In a nutshell, the purpose of a long-term partnership is to embed in the consumer's mind the connection between the brand and the team, and, even more so, to get an emotional connection between the two of those. For example, while Marlboro is still a Ferrari partner it can use the image of the cars on cigarette packets even though its own logo is not used on the cars.

    If this connection is made effectively, not only are the benefits optimised while the brand is sponsoring the team but there should also be a residual benefit after it has pulled out, particularly in terms of awareness as time goes on. Marlboro's current agreement allows it to continue forging this connection in the minds of consumers, despite tobacco brands being barred from the sport. Hence the comments by the European Public Health Commissioner.


    http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/vi...nsors_Ferrari/
    Excellent piece. Marketing by association as I explained at the beginning of this threat.
    "If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari" - Gilles Villeneuve

  24. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by aroutis View Post
    Excellent piece. Marketing by association as I explained at the beginning of this threat.
    True. This also confirms Philip Morris does not sell Ferrari advertising space on the F1 cars.
    #KeepFightingMichael | #CiaoJules

  25. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by aroutis View Post
    Excellent piece. Marketing by association as I explained at the beginning of this threat.
    True. This also confirms Philip Morris does not sell Ferrari advertising space on the F1 cars.
    #KeepFightingMichael | #CiaoJules

  26. #86
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    Wasn't it Henry Ford who said that half of his advertising worked - he just did n't know which half..?
    We're doomed, Cap'n Mainwaring, doomed I tell ye!

  27. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by aroutis View Post
    Exposure of their brand equals financial gain. That is what you miss here.
    Not always
    Forza Ferrari

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    Quote Originally Posted by vcs316 View Post
    True. This also confirms Philip Morris does not sell Ferrari advertising space on the F1 cars.
    No it doesn't. It just proves that PM still sponsors Ferrari. I'm sure they can still sell their space to other companies if they aren't using it.

  29. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silent Bob View Post
    No it doesn't. It just proves that PM still sponsors Ferrari. I'm sure they can still sell their space to other companies if they aren't using it.
    correct

  30. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Singer View Post
    Wasn't it Henry Ford who said that half of his advertising worked - he just did n't know which half..?
    Just noticed your avatar. Holy cow!

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