2017 Singapore Airlines Grand Prix - Race

[jgonzalesm6]

You think that Seb and Kimi discussed this race scenario knowing Max?

Seb: "Okay Kimi, we know has Max is in the wet so IF he has a good start and passes me then we let him go, he is down on pts so what does it matter if he takes 1st place.
You come up behind me, 2-3 and defend against Ricci and the Mercs." Deal?

Kimi: " Bwoah....mmm....okay"

[ScuderiaBuckeye]

I, for one, don't agree w/ labeling bad decisions at the starts of GPs that lead to accidents and no championship points for your team as "racing".

[icedeepan]

Decisions here are in fractions of seconds. Seb would have been absolutely fine if Kimi and Max weren't fighting but there was no way for him to see what was going on there

[icedeepan]

If Lewis had a blistering start and was on the inside instead of max, what would we expect Seb to do then? Max might well have played on his mind but he did what any racing driver from pole with a bad start would do, defend the inside from whoever was trying to sneak through.

[Bonecrasher]

The period since the summer break has been devastating from Merc and Hamilton. They couldn't have wished for more...

[icedeepan]

If the moves had come off, we would have been 1-2 into turn 3 and we would have all been saying how Seb and Kimi orchestrated it perfectly . You win some and lose some.

[ScuderiaBuckeye]

Decisions here are in fractions of seconds. Seb would have been absolutely fine if Kimi and Max weren't fighting but there was no way for him to see what was going on there

You do not make this decision on the grid at the start of a race. You make it before the race in your driver briefing.

"Seb, what do we do at the start of the race if Max gets a good start and looks like he might take the lead?"

"We let him go b/c we are not racing Max for any titles. We need to beat Mercedes and Hamilton. That is our #1 goal. We can still win the title if Max wins this race as long as we beat Hamilton and gain points on Hamilton. I am only three points behind Lewis now. If I finish second and he finishes third, we will be tied in WDC points. If I cause a crash at the start by doing a stupid move and knock myself out of the race before the first corner and Hamilton goes on to win that is the worst possible outcome I can make happen. I will make sure I don't tangle with Max at the start b/c all I need to worry about Max is not to get into an accident by worrying about Max."

"That is correct, Seb. Make sure you keep your eyes on the prize, and beating Max into turn one tomorrow is not the prize."

[Silent Bob]

You do not make this decision on the grid at the start of a race. You make it before the race in your driver briefing.

"Seb, what do we do at the start of the race if Max gets a good start and looks like he might take the lead?"

"We let him go b/c we are not racing Max for any titles. We need to beat Mercedes and Hamilton. That is our #1 goal. We can still win the title if Max wins this race as long as we beat Hamilton and gain points on Hamilton. I am only three points behind Lewis now. If I finish second and he finishes third, we will be tied in WDC points. If I cause a crash at the start by doing a stupid move and knock myself out of the race before the first corner and Hamilton goes on to win that is the worst possible outcome I can make happen. I will make sure I don't tangle with Max at the start b/c all I need to worry about Max is not to get into an accident by worrying about Max."

"That is correct, Seb. Make sure you keep your eyes on the prize, and beating Max into turn one tomorrow is not the prize."

Sorry. But that is one of the most ridiculous things I've read.

[ScuderiaBuckeye]

Sorry. But that is one of the most ridiculous things I've read.

The result of Seb's move, on the straight well before the braking zone, taking out himself and his teammate by worrying about a driver who isn't in the WDC hunt one iota, is one of the most ridiculous moves I've ever seen a top, experienced F1 driver make. It was a mistake befitting a rookie. But it's all good, isn't it? Just bad luck...racing.

[icedeepan]

Like I said earlier, he wouldn't have seen that Kimi was there and he would have been absolutely fine without that fight between Max and Kimi.

[icedeepan]

Not saying it is Kimi's fault by any means

[ScuderiaBuckeye]

Like I said earlier, he wouldn't have seen that Kimi was there and he would have been absolutely fine without that fight between Max and Kimi.

This just supports my position on the matter. This is exactly why Seb should have been safe and smart at the start. You act like people never rocket from the second row at the start of a gp. The unknown factor of another car coming up the inside of Max in that situation is why you don't do what Seb did. Seb gambled, blindly, that there would be no car on Max's left and squeezing Max into the wall would not squeeze him into another vehicle. How did that work out?

[icedeepan]

This just supports my position on the matter. This is exactly why Seb should have been safe and smart at the start. You act like people never rocket from the second row at the start of a gp. The unknown factor of another car coming up the inside of Max in that situation is why you don't do what Seb did. Seb gambled, blindly, that there would be no car on Max's left and squeezing Max into the wall would not squeeze him into another vehicle. How did that work out?

What if it had been Lewis instead of Kimi there from a good start rocketing up the inside and in a position to take the inside for turn 1 ? You cant anticipate who is going to be where, you defend instinctively

[icedeepan]

If Seb keeps his line in the above case, he might well lose the lead to Lewis into turn 1

[Super M]

This just supports my position on the matter. This is exactly why Seb should have been safe and smart at the start. You act like people never rocket from the second row at the start of a gp. The unknown factor of another car coming up the inside of Max in that situation is why you don't do what Seb did. Seb gambled, blindly, that there would be no car on Max's left and squeezing Max into the wall would not squeeze him into another vehicle. How did that work out?

Always easier said in hind sight mate!..........

I go back to a clip i put on here where Hammy did the exact same thing at monza 2 weeks agao........Lucky him Strol pulled back..........have a look at that clip and then tell me That only Vettel was stupid to do what he did yesterday!!.......Had he pulled it off, My guess is you'd be saying " WELL DONE SEB FOR NOT GIVING AN INCH HEY ???

What happened was a case of bad luck on our behalf..........end of !!

[ScuderiaBuckeye]

Always easier said in hind sight mate!..........

I go back to a clip i put on here where Hammy did the exact same thing at monza 2 weeks agao........Lucky him Strol pulled back..........have a look at that clip and then tell me That only Vettel was stupid to do what he did yesterday!!.......Had he pulled it off, My guess is you'd be saying " WELL DONE SEB FOR NOT GIVING AN INCH HEY ???

What happened was a case of bad luck on our behalf..........end of !!

Stop calling it hindsight. It is not hindsight. These are the scenarios that you need to go over w/ your drivers before the start of a race. It was not bad luck either. It was a bad decision and the result is what you see.

Hey, ice. Seb crashed into another car at the start and still beat Lewis into turn one. Pretty sure he beats him into turn one also w/o the drama.

[Super M]

Stop calling it hindsight. It is not hindsight. These are the scenarios that you need to go over w/ your drivers before the start of a race. It was not bad luck either. It was a bad decision and the result is what you see.

Hey, ice. Seb crashed into another car at the start and still beat Lewis into turn one. Pretty sure he beats him into turn one also w/o the drama.

Oh Phaaleeeeze!!!!!.........For your info, and again, please look at the clips iv'e posted on here before making comments...........Seb has every right to protect the racing line!!!!..........Not Sebs fault that Kimmi was alongside Verstapen and the 2 tangled and kimi hit vettel. !!!!......................Vettel was ahead when he came across.......... ( Like i said, its always easier to talk after an incident like this and put blame on someone.........and in your case, Its vettels fault!!!............Ya whatever dude

[nani_s23]

Leave it guys. Let's hope for the best for rest of the races.
One thing is for sure, luck is not on Ferrari side this year.
SC's n DNF's hurting Ferrari only.
On other side RB ric & mercs bottas n ham were lucky always.

[ScuderiaBuckeye]

Oh Phaaleeeeze!!!!!.........For your info, and again, please look at the clips iv'e posted on here before making comments...........Seb has every right to protect the racing line!!!!..........Not Sebs fault that Kimmi was alongside Verstapen and the 2 tangled and kimi hit vettel. !!!!......................Vettel was ahead when he came across.......... ( Like i said, its always easier to talk after an incident like this and put blame on someone.........and in your case, Its vettels fault!!!............Ya whatever dude

Why would I look at any other clip besides the clip of the start of the Singapore GP 2017 in which the #1 Ferrari driver caused a three-car accident before the braking zone of the first corner and handed his championship rival a victory and 25 points? It is the only clip of relevance.

Does Seb have every "right" to do what he did? Sure.

Should he have done what he did? No. Why shouldn't he have done it? The result speaks for itself.

[Louwrens]

The only thing I don't understand is, wasn't it the first race at night in the rain? When two midfield drivers complain about poor visibility, Grosjean and I believe it was Perez, not opt for a behind safetycar start. At least try that for safety as a point to evaluate after the race between drivers if a race could have started normally under same conditions. It's night, artificial lights, wet spray.

[mwk360]

What does the points table look like now? 6 to go imo merc tracks

[Super M]

Why would I look at any other clip besides the clip of the start of the Singapore GP 2017 in which the #1 Ferrari driver caused a three-car accident before the braking zone of the first corner and handed his championship rival a victory and 25 points? It is the only clip of relevance.

Does Seb have every "right" to do what he did? Sure.

Should he have done what he did? No. Why shouldn't he have done it? The result speaks for itself.

Here's a racing drivers point of view......... https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%...fUXcBjysfzUQng


Senna's comment in an interview a while back : By being a racing driver you are under risk all the time. By being a racing driver means you are racing with other people. And if you no longer go for a gap that exists, you are no longer a racing driver because we are competing, we are competing to win. And the main motivation to all of us is to compete for victory, it's not to come 3rd, 4th, 5th or 6th.

[TheProdigalSon]

You do not make this decision on the grid at the start of a race. You make it before the race in your driver briefing.

"Seb, what do we do at the start of the race if Max gets a good start and looks like he might take the lead?"

"We let him go b/c we are not racing Max for any titles. We need to beat Mercedes and Hamilton. That is our #1 goal. We can still win the title if Max wins this race as long as we beat Hamilton and gain points on Hamilton. I am only three points behind Lewis now. If I finish second and he finishes third, we will be tied in WDC points. If I cause a crash at the start by doing a stupid move and knock myself out of the race before the first corner and Hamilton goes on to win that is the worst possible outcome I can make happen. I will make sure I don't tangle with Max at the start b/c all I need to worry about Max is not to get into an accident by worrying about Max."

"That is correct, Seb. Make sure you keep your eyes on the prize, and beating Max into turn one tomorrow is not the prize."

That is the most logical sensible thing I've read here today. He only has himself to blame for ruining three drivers races and gifting Hamilton a easy route to the championship.

[Silent Bob]

The result of Seb's move, on the straight well before the braking zone, taking out himself and his teammate by worrying about a driver who isn't in the WDC hunt one iota, is one of the most ridiculous moves I've ever seen a top, experienced F1 driver make. It was a mistake befitting a rookie. But it's all good, isn't it? Just bad luck...racing.

By your reasoning then, why did MAx bother to try at all? He's out of the WDC race. Why should Seb back off when he needs maximum points and Max isn't racing for anything. Shouldn't Max have backed off and not been the deciding factor in the WDC championship?
Like I said earlier... if it was any other top driver, they would have backed out of that situation. Max believes that he never needs to give up a spot.

[Silent Bob]

That is the most logical sensible thing I've read here today. He only has himself to blame for ruining three drivers races and gifting Hamilton a easy route to the championship.

Ok. Let's say it's Vettel's fault because some seem to think he should know what's happening behind him. So he shouldn't have moved over to cover Max becasue he should have known that Max was behind him and that Kimi was coming up the side. Shouldn't Max have known Kimi was coming up the inside then and realized he had nowhere to go? If Seb should have been aware of where the cars behind him were then so should Max.

[ChrisFerrari]

I see you guys are still arguing over what happened. It wont make it easier or disappear, in fact its just making it harder to forget. 7 races to go, 28 points differential, thats what matters. As Arrivabene said its best to forget what happened and concentrate on the future. If someone told me last year that we would have a chance to win the WDC with 7 races to go and only down a race-win differential to Lewis then I would have accepted it.

[ScuderiaBuckeye]

Ok. Let's say it's Vettel's fault because some seem to think he should know what's happening behind him. So he shouldn't have moved over to cover Max becasue he should have known that Max was behind him and that Kimi was coming up the side. Shouldn't Max have known Kimi was coming up the inside then and realized he had nowhere to go? If Seb should have been aware of where the cars behind him were then so should Max.

Seb needed to be smart. He wasn't. You simply want to excuse a stupid decision by the Ferrari driver who wrecked his own race before somebody else had a chance to wreck it for him at the first corner.

[Rishu]

Still not done with all this? Stewards have deemed it as a racing incident which is the right call. No one to be blamed. Move on for Christ's sake

[stefa]

And now for the two long weeks this is going to be discussed over and over again

[Otakukim]

Racing incident. If one of the three were not there. This would not have happened. It cost us a lot and will probably cost us the championship. Onwards and upwards. See you in sepang!