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Thread: Rate the drivers on the grid

  1. #91
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    I often think that these driver rating lists too often mostly mirror the actual points standings, i.e. the drivers with more points are further up the list and those with few or no points are usually in the middle or at the bottom of the list.

    I think the way to rate drivers is to ask oneself: 1. How well has the driver done with their own machinery? 2. How do they compare with their teammate in the same machinery? 3. To what extent have they been unlucky with their machinery, i.e. technical faults, engine blow-outs or involved in accidents not their fault?

    It goes without saying that there are a million nuances that may dictate the races and fortunes of any driver - bad pit calls, strategies gone wrong, being ill or not physically at their peak for whatever reason, etc., etc. We as fans can never know all the nuances anyway, so we can only go on what is evident and what we do know for sure.

    And I don't factor in so-called 'politics' into the equation, e.g. so-and-so is given preferential treatment, the other guy is not treated the same, etc. None of us know for sure and it's all speculation.

    It's based on my criteria that both our drivers feature quite weakly on my list - because, to be brutally honest, neither of them have really been up to the quality of the machinery they've had this year. Sorry, but they have not. Imagine Michael Schumacher in this car...

    My list of driver ratings thus far in 2018:

    1. Leclerc
    2. Alonso
    3. Gasly
    4. Ocon
    5. Perez
    6. Magnussen
    7. Hamilton
    8. Hulkenburg
    9. Verstappen
    10. Ricciardo
    11. Vettel*
    12. Raikkonen*
    13. Sainz
    14. Ericsson
    15. Grosjean
    16. Sirotkin
    17. Vandoorne
    18. Bottas**
    19. Stroll
    20. Hartley

    * In my mind's eye I thought I was going to rate both our drivers even lower (i was thinking around 13th-14th initially) but all the drivers behind them on this list have had even more erratic or poor performance this year, even relative to their machinery.
    ** I cannot rate any driver highly who allows himself to so blatantly play second fiddle to another driver, especially with such excellent machinery at his hands - regardless of team orders and contracts. I think he was better last year anyway.

  2. #92
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    It's hard to rate #2 drivers from the top teams because they run on different strats (tire & opponent plus playing "rear gunner").

    The rest of the other teams pretty much race each other.

    1. Alonso (mainly for driving a "pig" of a car and for the mental capacity to bring it home when he can however he can)
    2. Vettel (he is carrying the weight of the team on his back for 2018....before, it was the car having issues).
    3. Hamilton (yes, everything has to be working right and he has the team to make it so; he's tactful during a race but lacks the mental capacity when things go wrong)
    4. Kimi and Bottas are tied (Kimi has the car now and so does Bottas and both play their roles to....a.....tea).
    5. Ricciardo
    6. Max
    7. Perez and Ocon
    8. Hulkenberg
    9. K-Mag
    10. LeClerc
    Last edited by jgonzalesm6; 17th September 2018 at 18:31.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  3. #93
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    3. Hamilton lacks mental capacity when things go wrong! 33 yrs. old, 79 POLES , 69 wins , est. worth $240 million!! I can't wait to see when things start going wrong!! It's the car, no wait it's pure luck, no it's the tires! we fans at Ferrari have Seb, lets hope for the best , there's still hope.

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brembo View Post
    3. Hamilton lacks mental capacity when things go wrong! 33 yrs. old, 79 POLES , 69 wins , est. worth $240 million!! I can't wait to see when things start going wrong!! It's the car, no wait it's pure luck, no it's the tires! we fans at Ferrari have Seb, lets hope for the best , there's still hope.
    HAM hasn't had many occasions over the past 4 seasons where his mental capacity has been tested, if we're honest, except maybe when up against ROS in the same car. Given the challenges that Ferrari and Seb have had to endure trying to catch up, it's not surprising that Seb is suffering from frustration and pressure to deliver. It's no excuse for a top-line driver, of course, but being a Ferrari driver with those huge expectations was never going to be easy and I'm pretty sure Hamilton would suffer under those conditions too.

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by wisepie View Post
    HAM hasn't had many occasions over the past 4 seasons where his mental capacity has been tested, if we're honest, except maybe when up against ROS in the same car. Given the challenges that Ferrari and Seb have had to endure trying to catch up, it's not surprising that Seb is suffering from frustration and pressure to deliver. It's no excuse for a top-line driver, of course, but being a Ferrari driver with those huge expectations was never going to be easy and I'm pretty sure Hamilton would suffer under those conditions too.
    What about this year? I'm sure a guy who wasn't mentally tough would not have been leading by 40 points against arguably best car on the grid. He is one of the stupidest person available on Earth but Lewis the driver is delivering just great
    “I prefer to beat them on Sunday” -Fernando Alonso, Press Conference Korean GP 2010

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  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by wisepie View Post
    HAM hasn't had many occasions over the past 4 seasons where his mental capacity has been tested, if we're honest, except maybe when up against ROS in the same car. Given the challenges that Ferrari and Seb have had to endure trying to catch up, it's not surprising that Seb is suffering from frustration and pressure to deliver. It's no excuse for a top-line driver, of course, but being a Ferrari driver with those huge expectations was never going to be easy and I'm pretty sure Hamilton would suffer under those conditions too.
    Wisepie, I think you just described the German when with Red Bull; equal at the time as Lewis now with Merc. His mental capacity, mid field know how was not tested. He had the car. He has the "Ferrari car" , now 2018. There's still hope.

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brembo View Post
    Wisepie, I think you just described the German when with Red Bull; equal at the time as Lewis now with Merc. His mental capacity, mid field know how was not tested. He had the car. He has the "Ferrari car" , now 2018. There's still hope.
    I recall Vettel being able to make up a big points deficit to Alonso when he was still driving for RedBull. So yes, Vettel can still make it but he has to feel supported all out by his team, same as Lewis is right now with a no.2 driver (Bottas) that won't even speak if not asked to. One mistake and Vettel will break and give up for good. The tyre choice for Baku is already looking like a mistake, too many Hypers yet again. Let's see and fingers crossed.

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brembo View Post
    Wisepie, I think you just described the German when with Red Bull; equal at the time as Lewis now with Merc. His mental capacity, mid field know how was not tested. He had the car. He has the "Ferrari car" , now 2018. There's still hope.
    You have a point, Brembo, but how many times this year has Seb had to fight back through the field as a result of earlier mistakes/crashes, he is able to do that in the same way as HAM and only once did he actually throw away a possible win in Germany, which I'm still not convinced would have happened as both HAM and BOT were catching him fast. The other 'mistakes' Seb has made have been expensive but we'd still have been unhappy if he hadn't tried. Yes, there's still hope, but the wind has gone out of our sails for the moment.

  9. #99
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    I'm also sure that HAM is mentally tough, any F1 driver has to be, but the VET-HAM rivalry has of course taken centre-stage and HAM always seems to get away with any damage or retirements through contact, whoever was at fault. VET has made some dubious moves, agreed, but it seems he feels the same pressure as any of us Tifosi, and we're only watching, wishing and hoping!

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rishu View Post
    What about this year? I'm sure a guy who wasn't mentally tough would not have been leading by 40 points against arguably best car on the grid. He is one of the stupidest person available on Earth but Lewis the driver is delivering just great
    See above reply, Rishu.

  11. #101
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    I have no doubt Rosberg would be leading this championship if he were in the superior Ferrari.He competed in the same equipment with Lewis Hamilton and nabbed himself a title. That’s greater than Vettel’s 4 against ageing Webber. At this moment I rank Rosberg and Button higher than Vettel. Button beat Hamilton and Alonso over a season in the same car. That’s greater than anything Vettel has ever done.

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonecrasher View Post
    I have no doubt Rosberg would be leading this championship if he were in the superior Ferrari.He competed in the same equipment with Lewis Hamilton and nabbed himself a title. That’s greater than Vettel’s 4 against ageing Webber. At this moment I rank Rosberg and Button higher than Vettel. Button beat Hamilton and Alonso over a season in the same car. That’s greater than anything Vettel has ever done.
    Puzzles me why a Lewis fan needs to come here to hate on Seb, really do something better with your time.
    Forza Ferrari

  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonecrasher View Post
    I have no doubt Rosberg would be leading this championship if he were in the superior Ferrari.He competed in the same equipment with Lewis Hamilton and nabbed himself a title. That’s greater than Vettel’s 4 against ageing Webber. At this moment I rank Rosberg and Button higher than Vettel. Button beat Hamilton and Alonso over a season in the same car. That’s greater than anything Vettel has ever done.
    Rosberg was only racing Hamilton, who had his share of gremlins that year. Vettel had to beat Alonso, Hamilton, and Webber in a less dominant car than the Mercedes.

  14. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Puzzles me why a Lewis fan needs to come here to hate on Seb, really do something better with your time.
    Yo my dude, this is a topic not just on Ferrari drivers what’s your gripe? Besides I support Kimi but I have to conclude he is way past. That leaves me with ability to scrutinise other drivers with impartiality and if that means pointing out Vettel's glaring shortcomings so be it.

  15. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonecrasher View Post
    Yo my dude, this is a topic not just on Ferrari drivers what’s your gripe? Besides I support Kimi but I have to conclude he is way past. That leaves me with ability to scrutinise other drivers with impartiality and if that means pointing out Vettel's glaring shortcomings so be it.
    +1
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  16. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonecrasher View Post
    Yo my dude, this is a topic not just on Ferrari drivers what’s your gripe? Besides I support Kimi but I have to conclude he is way past. That leaves me with ability to scrutinise other drivers with impartiality and if that means pointing out Vettel's glaring shortcomings so be it.
    Your a Lewis fan, it's ok to admit it.....don't hide behind another driver. Ranting at Vettel in nearly every post you make is not pointing out shortcomings, saying Rosberg would be winning the title in this Ferrari is rather clutching at straws in another attempt to discredit Vettel.
    Forza Ferrari

  17. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giallo 550 View Post
    Rosberg was only racing Hamilton, who had his share of gremlins that year. Vettel had to beat Alonso, Hamilton, and Webber in a less dominant car than the Mercedes.
    +1
    Forza Ferrari

  18. #108
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    Hamilton 10, Verstappen 8. VETTEL 6 Kimi, Bottas and Daniel 4

  19. #109
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    1. Alonso
    .
    .
    .
    .
    2.Ricciardo
    3.Hamilton
    4.Verstappen
    5.Vettel
    6.Hulkenberg
    7.Gasley/Leclerc
    8.Sainz
    9.Ocon
    10.Raikkonen
    11.Bottas
    12.Perez

  20. #110
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    Tier 1 (Champions)
    Alonso

    Hamilton
    Vettel

    Raikkonen

    Tier 2 (Likely Future Champions)
    Leclerc
    Verstappen

    Gasly
    Ocon

    Tier 3 (Midfielders)
    Ricciardo
    Bottas

    Hulkenberg
    Perez

    Sainz
    Vandoorne



    Grosjean


    Tier 4 (Bottom Feeders)
    Hartley
    Ericsson
    Sirotkin
    Stroll

    For the record, I don't think the bottom five belong in F1. There's a LOT of talent currently knocking on the door.
    Last edited by Giallo 550; 25th September 2018 at 20:18.

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