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Thread: 2018 USA GP: Race Thread

  1. #631
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    Quote Originally Posted by 512 TR View Post
    Exactly. And not only faster. When both Ferrari started their laps after the line they were already running at a higher speed than Merc. That was also shown. So why was that? It couldn't be because of the aero package from Hockenheim only.
    Noooo. Ferrari were on the US tires, MB were on the SS tire so in essence, Kimi had a better grip coming off the line....advantage Kimi into T1.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  2. #632
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    Ferrari removed upgrades that went back to Hockenheim, people seem to think this means we ran the exact same car as we did in Germany? probably not LOL. Our acceleration out of corners is down to our mechanical grip which clearly was affected by new upgrades.
    Forza Ferrari

  3. #633
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    The FIA deemed the rims "limited illegality" which in my book is a crock of [censored by FOM] !!!!
    Is there a FIA document that uses the phrase "limited illegality" in this case? Probably not, right? So do Ferrari have a case should they complain about the final result from Monza/Singapore onwards? I mean, something can't be illegal in Austin but legal prior to that.

    So now we have three factors for the recent strenght/weakness of both packages. Supposedly dodgy Ferrari aero, Ferrari PU "trick" system and Merc rims.

  4. #634
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    Noooo. Ferrari were on the US tires, MB were on the SS tire so in essence, Kimi had a better grip coming off the line....advantage Kimi into T1.
    I'm talking about qualifying. Seb was on the same supersofts as Lewis in Q2. They both used ultra softs in Q1 and Q3.

  5. #635
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    Quote Originally Posted by 512 TR View Post
    Is there a FIA document that uses the phrase "limited illegality" in this case? Probably not, right? So do Ferrari have a case should they complain about the final result from Monza/Singapore onwards? I mean, something can't be illegal in Austin but legal prior to that.

    So now we have three factors for the recent strenght/weakness of both packages. Supposedly dodgy Ferrari aero, Ferrari PU "trick" system and Merc rims.
    Nope, this "limited illegality" was made up and to avoid any PR nightmare from this term, the FIA and MB reverted back hence MB covering the holes in the rims with silicone.

    Quote Originally Posted by 512 TR View Post
    Seb was on the same supersofts as Lewis in Q2. They both used ultra softs in Q1 and Q3.
    I'm talking about the race.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  6. #636
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    Nope, this "limited illegality" was made up and to avoid any PR nightmare from this term, the FIA and MB reverted back hence MB covering the holes in the rims with silicone.
    Yes, obviously. So what now?

    I'm talking about the race.
    Well, I'm talking about the qualifying clip with Lewis and Seb head-to-head, on the same tyres. It clearly shows how Seb is running a lot faster when out of the last corner and therefor starting his lap, at the timing line, at a higher speed than Lewis. For every meter then until the breaking point that gap remains. The gain in acceleration comes early on the straight. Most of it even prior to the timing line.

  7. #637
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    Quote Originally Posted by 512 TR View Post
    Yes, obviously. So what now?
    W09 meltdown (tirewise)


    Quote Originally Posted by TR View Post
    Well, I'm talking about the qualifying clip with Lewis and Seb head-to-head, on the same tyres. It clearly shows how Seb is running a lot faster when out of the last corner and therefor starting his lap, at the timing line, at a higher speed than Lewis. For every meter then until the breaking point that gap remains. The gain in acceleration comes early on the straight. Most of it even prior to the timing line.
    It's the track...really. It suits both cars with their LWB. Both cars are evenly matched.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  8. #638
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    W09 meltdown (tirewise)
    Could be but what about the final results at Monza, Singapore, Sochi and Suzuka, where Merc ran their new rims? Will they stand even though there were "illegal" in Austin?

    It's the track...really. It suits both cars with their LWB. Both cars are evenly matched.
    Come on, you can see it with your eyes even without the graph in the middle where both cars are gaining and losing. Seb clearly gains everything out of slow corners and Lewis then gets everything back going into corners and at the apex. Seb is also running a lot faster when the timing starts. He's then clearly on pole until going into the last corner which he then loses the pole in. Had then the timing line been 10 meters further up the straight he would have made it back on pole.

  9. #639
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    Quote Originally Posted by 512 TR View Post
    Could be but what about the final results at Monza, Singapore, Sochi and Suzuka, where Merc ran their new rims? Will they stand even though there were "illegal" in Austin?
    Yes
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  10. #640
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    Not to mention the issues with tyre wear that Hamilton faced.
    "If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari" - Gilles Villeneuve

  11. #641
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    W09 meltdown (tirewise)




    It's the track...really. It suits both cars with their LWB. Both cars are evenly matched.
    You can see in Q2, vettel was faster on SS almost matched Kimi lap who was on US.
    Ham took 2 laps to get closer to vettel but still diff was .5sec.

  12. #642
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    The FIA deemed the rims "limited illegality" which in my book is a crock of [censored by FOM] !!!!
    The FIA is full of you know what. What about the Rats poll lap?... all 4 wheels off the track. How much time did he gain here? How different would the race have been had Vettel had taken pole? Lets not forget the difference was only .61 between Ham and Vet. Ferrari should keep pushing the FIA to strip Mercs last few race wins with the "limited-illegal" rims.

    Hams Pole Lap - (37 Seconds in) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLXdxyJJrhY

    Last edited by ferrari1.8t; 22nd October 2018 at 15:01.
    ~FORZA FERRARI~

  13. #643
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    Quote Originally Posted by ferrari1.8t View Post
    The FIA is full of you know what. What about the Rats poll lap?... all 4 wheels off the track. How much time did he gain here? How different would the race have been had Vettel had taken pole? Lets not forget the difference was only .61 between Ham and Vet. Ferrari should keep pushing the FIA to strip Mercs last few race wins with the "limited-illegal" rims.

    Hams Pole Lap - (37 Seconds in) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLXdxyJJrhY

    http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h2...ps7f8505ag.jpg
    Yes, I saw that. Track limits not being enforced. .

    The usual "no further investigation" IF Charlie and the stewards "investigated" it.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  14. #644
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    Yes, I saw that. Track limits not being enforced. .

    The usual "no further investigation" IF Charlie and the stewards "investigated" it.
    It wasn't even close, or near the line...he was way off! Useless stewards.
    ~FORZA FERRARI~

  15. #645
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    Quote Originally Posted by ferrari1.8t View Post
    It wasn't even close, or near the line...he was way off! Useless stewards.
    Saw race highlights, I feel Vettel's state of mind is not good at the moment. He needs to sit down & relax, needs of support who can push his confidence level high.
    Although it was a racing incident, he should have stayed patient & could have made a move in the next sector. Similar to suzuka.

    But ohhhh boy, that ferrari car looks like very delicate. Even if we touch with our hand looks like it will make 180-360 deg donuts.

    Race moment was - Kimi holding up Ham (who was on fresh set of softs).....

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    Great photo...

  17. #647
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    ?????
    I wonder how bad is it,AND how it has effected next years car ??!!!
    https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f...mpression=true
    FERRARI FOR EVER !!!!!!!

  18. #648
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    Quote Originally Posted by nani_s23 View Post

    Race moment was - Kimi holding up Ham (who was on fresh set of softs).....
    It was'nt just Kimi, Max helped out too. That was awesome wheel-to-wheel racing.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  19. #649
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    Just watched the race again, and Mercs did 2 mistakes, they did keep Hamilton out too long and did not use SS, so they can make mistakes too, but anyways, great race.

  20. #650
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    Quote Originally Posted by PURE PASSION View Post
    ?????
    I wonder how bad is it,AND how it has effected next years car ??!!!
    https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f...mpression=true
    Criticizing Maranello that openly was what got Prost fired back in the day. The difference being Prost used the not so politically correct french approach and Seb using the more mellow german one. "Truck" vs "too long". I wouldn't go down that route the day after the other Ferrari clearly won on merit as Lewis would never get passed Kimi no matter if he pitted earlier for his second stop or not.

  21. #651
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    Quote Originally Posted by 512 TR View Post
    I wouldn't go down that route the day after the other Ferrari clearly won on merit as Lewis would never get passed Kimi no matter if he pitted earlier for his second stop or not.
    We just don`t know, but Kimi was 2 sec faster and they did keep Hamilton out, so that was a real mistake and not using SS was another mistake.

  22. #652
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    Quote Originally Posted by ferrari1.8t View Post
    The FIA is full of you know what. What about the Rats poll lap?... all 4 wheels off the track. How much time did he gain here? How different would the race have been had Vettel had taken pole? Lets not forget the difference was only .61 between Ham and Vet. Ferrari should keep pushing the FIA to strip Mercs last few race wins with the "limited-illegal" rims.

    Hams Pole Lap - (37 Seconds in) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLXdxyJJrhY

    http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h2...ps7f8505ag.jpg
    If we ignore Seb over the lines as well, everyone did at that corner

    Attached Images Attached Images
    Forza Ferrari

  23. #653
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    Sainz did get 5 sec penalty, and Seb did not get penalty and both did the same thing at the start.

    I think this is the problem, penalties should be same every where and every time.

  24. #654
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    Quote Originally Posted by KimiBot View Post
    Sainz did get 5 sec penalty, and Seb did not get penalty and both did the same thing at the start.

    I think this is the problem, penalties should be same every where and every time.
    Vettel didnít get a penalty because he didnít gain an advantage, sainz passed ocon or Perez canít remember who, thatís why he got the penalty

  25. #655
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    Quote Originally Posted by T99 View Post
    Vettel didn’t get a penalty because he didn’t gain an advantage, sainz passed ocon or Perez can’t remember who, that’s why he got the penalty
    Maybe you are right, I just can not see that.


  26. #656
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    Quote Originally Posted by KimiBot View Post
    Sainz did get 5 sec penalty, and Seb did not get penalty and both did the same thing at the start.

    I think this is the problem, penalties should be same every where and every time.
    watched the video, vettel didn't gain anything. Where as Sainz & others did gain by overtaking cars ahead.

  27. #657
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    It was'nt just Kimi, Max helped out too. That was awesome wheel-to-wheel racing.
    I was referring to Kimi US vs Ham new set of softs. That was very great defense from Kimi, using different lines around the circuit. After a long time, i'm impressed with Kimi on race pace skills.

    I feel it's a revenge for Monza battle.

  28. #658
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    Quote Originally Posted by ferrari1.8t View Post
    It wasn't even close, or near the line...he was way off! Useless stewards.
    Well, to be fair, "everyone" was doing it as Greig mentioned.

    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    If we ignore Seb over the lines as well, everyone did at that corner

    http://www.thescuderia.net/forums/at...tid=7533&stc=1
    True.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  29. #659
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    Quote Originally Posted by nani_s23 View Post
    I was referring to Kimi US vs Ham new set of softs. That was very great defense from Kimi, using different lines around the circuit. After a long time, i'm impressed with Kimi on race pace skills.

    I feel it's a revenge for Monza battle.
    Agreed, Kimi did put on a show of "D." You could see from Lewis's on-board that Kimi's car was getting "squirrely" as the laps counted down.

    Before that though, Max put up a hell of a wheel to wheel fight against Lewis in a less inferior car. Max was sandwiched between Kimi and Lewis. Both Lewis and Max gave each other room during the wheel to wheel until Lewis backed off. Max ran a very mature race....P18 at the start to P2 podium finish.

    This race has to be one of the best we have seen for 2018....for the moment.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  30. #660
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    So the latest regarding the Merc rims is that they changed them (plugged them) because they feared Ferrari would lodge a protest. But why would Merc be afraid of Ferrari lodging a protest if the FIA had passed them prior to the US race weekend? And if they were afraid, why weren't they afraid at earlier races? They've been running them since Spa/Monza. The other rumor is that the FIA asked Merc to do something about them. But why would the FIA do that if they felt the rims are legal from the start? All this stinks! In my opinion is that is has something to do with Liberty wanting to spice up the show. At the same time the Ferrari acceleration "trick" is back after being gone after Monza. In the meantime though the gap in both championships have grown to basicly a done deal and then everything is back to the kind of fight just after the summer break, a pretty even one.

    Last year I congratulated Merc and Lewis for winning both championships. I bowed my head. I won't be doing that this year. This is season is tainted beyond words and beyond being able to view it any other way. To much BS since the introduction of the "special tyres" at Barcelona and everything up until today. The list of things that stink is substantial.

    But to be fair I also don't feel Seb deserves any other place than 2nd in the WDC. But I do feel sorry for the guys at Maranello who deserve the WCC title. They at least deserve a shot at it until the last race.

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