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Thread: When will this end????

  1. #91
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    In my humble opinion .... Ferrari's main problem is decision-making on the pitwall ...... they are always a step behind! When will the team really become pro-active and not reactive?

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Harley View Post
    If the windtunnel results etc. do not correlate with reality perhaps those startegy tools leave room for improvement as well. Just speculating, though.

    [AMuS]

    Ferrari's cardinal mistake in qualifying is still the subject in paddock. "At Ferrari, there is no one who dares to make decisions, the system is sick, they all rely on their simulations, just do not take responsibility." says Maurizio Arrivabene

    Arrivabene said after a similar mistake in Suzuka 2018: "We have too few racers in the team."
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  3. #93
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    I wonder what changed this season, and lead to a pit wall that operates as if they are all competing in F1 for the first time.

    I think the team is in need for a good leadership to pull the team back onto the right track. We already have a long challenge ahead in building a competitive car, and now we have a pit wall that is in a mess

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grinsomx View Post
    IMHO we had a good leader in Arrivabene.
    he made mistakes and maybe did not make himself too popular in the media but the team was making progress.

    There is always a better choice but he was the best we have had in years.
    Agreed.

    I don't understand why they got rid of him.

    Under him the car was back to a championship competing level, for much of last year it was the best car.

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPZ View Post
    Agreed.

    I don't understand why they got rid of him.

    Under him the car was back to a championship competing level, for much of last year it was the best car.
    Because Binotto said he couldn't work with Arrivabene. Ferrari didn't want Binotto to leave the team.

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by tifosi1993 View Post
    One of the ingredient of Ferrari's successes during Todt-Brawn-Schumacher era was the absence of LDM. Jean Todt and Ross Brawn kept LDM away from team operations, which kept non-sense political stuffs at bay.

    Now first of all, I don't want to lose Binotto to Mercedes or any other team, he is a brilliant engineer and should stay as our TD. But I do believe Ferrari needs someone from outside, someone who can protect this team from "Spaghetti" culture.
    Bring back Ross Brawn.

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPMFerrari View Post
    Bring back Ross Brawn.
    If only.
    But you are right and there must be some Ross Brawn types around. We need someone who can come in take charge and whip this team into shape (not literally of course)
    The problem is Binotto has been promoted and he will have to stay in some kind of managerial position...... no problem just find another title for him which is of a technical nature.
    I don't know who that can be but I must admit I was very impressed by Bob Fernley while he was at Force India but I am sure there are probably better out there maybe not working in F1 but another Formula at the minute.
    Do we really need a racer to lead the team or a successful manager who knows how to delegate.


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  8. #98
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    If only MA was here today, this would have never have happend. We had such a stunning strat team last 3 years ...

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by darkchild View Post
    If only MA was here today, this would have never have happend. We had such a stunning strat team last 3 years ...

    Must admit I thought Arrivabene was better than anyone since Jean Todt. He even managed to motivate Kimi and get the best out of him.
    Also Marchionne is missed.


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  10. #100
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    So we're dealing in 2019 with a car under Arrivabene's rule which brings me to the NEW tires for 2019. Yes, we tested them in Barcelona for 2019 under those climate conditions.

    Binotto explains: "In recent years, we have had no problem getting the tires in their working window. Once they were in, we had to cool them. Today we do the opposite. They do not heat up so easily, and we have to heat the tire when they're in the window. "

    Red Bull chief technology officer Adrian Newey says the same thing: "The working window has shifted upwards. That played Mercedes perfectly in the cards. It was bad for us because we always kept the tires at the bottom of the window. That's why they've cut down less on us than on others. "A Mercedes engineer admits:" The new tires have solved our biggest problem without us having to do much for it. "However, he makes one caveat:" After our bankruptcy in 2015 In Singapore, we worked hard on this issue and changed eight or nine things on the car that helped us get a grip on the overheating of the tires. "

    The big question: Can Red Bull and Ferrari still counter-steer? Binotto does not think he has to turn the whole car upside down because of the tire issue. "There are tools that can help regardless of the concept. For example, more downforce, better use of the braking heat, the tuning of the suspension. "Adrian Newey looks rather black there:" That will be difficult. The whole concept of the car is designed so that the tires do not get too hot. It is always difficult to break out of a concept. "

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  11. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by racingbradley View Post
    If only.
    But you are right and there must be some Ross Brawn types around. We need someone who can come in take charge and whip this team into shape (not literally of course)
    The problem is Binotto has been promoted and he will have to stay in some kind of managerial position...... no problem just find another title for him which is of a technical nature.
    I don't know who that can be but I must admit I was very impressed by Bob Fernley while he was at Force India but I am sure there are probably better out there maybe not working in F1 but another Formula at the minute.
    Do we really need a racer to lead the team or a successful manager who knows how to delegate.
    Ferrari has the money pay him whatever it takes to right this sinking team.

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    So we're dealing in 2019 with a car under Arrivabene's rule which brings me to the NEW tires for 2019. Yes, we tested them in Barcelona for 2019 under those climate conditions.

    Binotto explains: "In recent years, we have had no problem getting the tires in their working window. Once they were in, we had to cool them. Today we do the opposite. They do not heat up so easily, and we have to heat the tire when they're in the window. "

    Red Bull chief technology officer Adrian Newey says the same thing: "The working window has shifted upwards. That played Mercedes perfectly in the cards. It was bad for us because we always kept the tires at the bottom of the window. That's why they've cut down less on us than on others. "A Mercedes engineer admits:" The new tires have solved our biggest problem without us having to do much for it. "However, he makes one caveat:" After our bankruptcy in 2015 In Singapore, we worked hard on this issue and changed eight or nine things on the car that helped us get a grip on the overheating of the tires. "

    The big question: Can Red Bull and Ferrari still counter-steer? Binotto does not think he has to turn the whole car upside down because of the tire issue. "There are tools that can help regardless of the concept. For example, more downforce, better use of the braking heat, the tuning of the suspension. "Adrian Newey looks rather black there:" That will be difficult. The whole concept of the car is designed so that the tires do not get too hot. It is always difficult to break out of a concept. "

    https://translate.google.com/transla...s/&prev=search
    so it is tires after all, thanks

  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by KimiBot View Post
    so it is tires after all, thanks
    Well yes with the notion that Binotto has to make adjustments on a car that has a concept design under the Arrivabene era.

    2020 will be different with regards to car concept in dealing with these tires. Binotto will be solely responsible and can't blame a Arrivabene anymore.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  14. #104
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    Maybe not necessarily a change of TP, but with the line managers. Could be old loyalties and lingering wounds are still present. No way a team this big doesn't know each car's strategies, what's wrong with the car, or that LEC wasn't getting out of Q3.

    Ross isn't coming back, but perhaps some of the young people who worked with the team during those successful years? Chris Dyer, Luca Baldisserri?

  15. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by racingbradley View Post
    Must admit I thought Arrivabene was better than anyone since Jean Todt. He even managed to motivate Kimi and get the best out of him.
    Also Marchionne is missed.
    I agree with you. Ferrari had no choice, Binotto gave Ferrari an ultimatum. Ferrari had to choose: technical experience going to a rival team or Arrivabene (who has no technical know-how) gone. But to answer the question who Ferrari need? Forget Brawn, forget Newey and some other names from the past. Ferrari needs to believe in the filosofie that they created this year “essere ferrari”. Ferrari needs less panic and more the heads-down mentality like during Arrivabene-years. So what do they need? 1. Support from management. They have that from Camilleri. 2. They need to learn from strategy-errors like yesterday in Monaco with Leclerq. That I miss from Ferrari. 3. Less media talk about updates and what is coming. 4. Reinforcement and experienced technical people. I read Simone Resta is considered to return from alfa. We need to stay calm, so do the shareholders! But rumours from Maranello is that the shareholders are out of patience! There is rumour that some are going to pay for this disaster. And that is something ferrari also needs to improve: less influence from the shareholders. I rest my case, fellow-tifosi! Grazie a tutti and Forza Ferrari!

  16. #106
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    I Wonder how the merger of FIAT and RENAULT will affect their Formula One teams?
    .
    Changes aren't permanent........But change is.

  17. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by JHAMMER View Post
    I Wonder how the merger of FIAT and RENAULT will affect their Formula One teams?
    Fiat sucks along with Renault......a marriage made in heaven.

    It will not affect the other F1 teams.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  18. #108
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    I wish someone could explain how we can look invincible leading up to the first race only to find that the whole team is a complete shower after 6 races. God forbid this turns into 2014. Normally I would say I'm looking forward to next year, but I just think that that there is potential within the team / car to be unleashed sometime soon.
    "Okay,...Jean is smarter than you....... can you confirm you understood that message" Bernie on the phone to Max circa 2009

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  19. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fiondella View Post
    I wish someone could explain how we can look invincible leading up to the first race only to find that the whole team is a complete shower after 6 races. God forbid this turns into 2014. Normally I would say I'm looking forward to next year, but I just think that that there is potential within the team / car to be unleashed sometime soon.
    Our car looked good in testing because Merc knew they didn't need to even try. That's how far in front of the field they are. How????? What's the loophole???

    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    Well yes with the notion that Binotto has to make adjustments on a car that has a concept design under the Arrivabene era.

    2020 will be different with regards to car concept in dealing with these tires. Binotto will be solely responsible and can't blame a Arrivabene anymore.
    I'm afraid I don't buy that excuse jgonzalesm6 because Binotto was Chief Technical Officer or Technical director oif you like and Arrivabene lead the team.
    As far as I recall Maurizio came from a sales and marketing background and would have no say in the build of the car.
    So what I am trying to say is it will still be a Binotto built car so what's the problem????? Have I got my reasoning all wrong?????


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  20. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by racingbradley View Post



    I'm afraid I don't buy that excuse jgonzalesm6 because Binotto was Chief Technical Officer or Technical director oif you like and Arrivabene lead the team.
    As far as I recall Maurizio came from a sales and marketing background and would have no say in the build of the car.
    So what I am trying to say is it will still be a Binotto built car so what's the problem????? Have I got my reasoning all wrong?????
    They fought, MA and Binotto, in the 2nd half of the season of 2018. Binotto wanted the car one way and MA wanted the car another way. MA had influence of the 2019 car when it was being built in the beginning of 2018. Binotto more than likely wanted to go a different direction on the 2019 car with MA hovering over him. Binotto gave up on the 2019 car late in 2018 threatening to quit.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  21. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    They fought, MA and Binotto, in the 2nd half of the season of 2018. Binotto wanted the car one way and MA wanted the car another way. MA had influence of the 2019 car when it was being built in the beginning of 2018. Binotto more than likely wanted to go a different direction on the 2019 car with MA hovering over him. Binotto gave up on the 2019 car late in 2018 threatening to quit.
    I see racingbradley's point of view on this because I'd never assumed that Arrivabene had much input into the SF90, I don't believe he was that technically adept and would have thought that the design was almost entirely down to the engineer Binotto. I know they didn't see eye to eye and it caused Arrivabene's departure, but can it be confirmed that he did in fact have a say in the direction taken for this year's car?

  22. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by wisepie View Post
    I see racingbradley's point of view on this because I'd never assumed that Arrivabene had much input into the SF90, I don't believe he was that technically adept and would have thought that the design was almost entirely down to the engineer Binotto. I know they didn't see eye to eye and it caused Arrivabene's departure, but can it be confirmed that he did in fact have a say in the direction taken for this year's car?
    Agree with you Wisepie
    Seriously I cannot see how a non-technical person or someone with zero engineering know how would bother with the design of an F1 car.
    I would of thought Arrivabene's job was more of an organizational nature helping to organize and structure the team and make staff feel good about themselves. He was good at that.
    Don’t we miss the calm pit wall and that passionate show of emotion when the team did well. He valued both drivers and motivated a very laid back Kimi!!!!

    Unless jgonzalesm6 maybe you have some first-hand information which nullifies all of my guessing!!!


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  23. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by wisepie View Post
    I see racingbradley's point of view on this because I'd never assumed that Arrivabene had much input into the SF90, I don't believe he was that technically adept and would have thought that the design was almost entirely down to the engineer Binotto. I know they didn't see eye to eye and it caused Arrivabene's departure, but can it be confirmed that he did in fact have a say in the direction taken for this year's car?
    Binotto & Simon used to report MA. One heads engine dept & the other car design philosophy.
    May be the news of two different paths might be true what @jgonzales said. MA had SM support, after the departure MA lost the grip in management.
    This is where Mattia might have played his card with the new incoming Ferrari president.
    Remember while this is going on, Ferrari 2019 car is already in progress. As they prepare or accommodate resources after summer break.

    2019 car may be not fully idea of Mattia.
    "I've always believed that you should never, ever give up and you should always keep fighting even when there's only a slightest chance " : - Michael Schumacher

  24. #114
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    Ferrari: new technicians are fished after Marchionne's autarchy in Maranello

    The former president had promoted the second and third rows of the Reparto Corse to relaunch the Scuderia, while Mattia Binotto is focusing on new recruits coming from outside (in particular Red Bull Racing) to complete a puzzle with tiles covering the weak points of the team.

    Does the SF90's lack of performance begin to claim its victims within the Racing Department? Mattia Binotto is very adept at damming the objective difficulties of the Red Army because he promptly puts his face to explaining what is not working, but the team principal is working hard to strengthen the technical structure (sort of simulation) which, evidently, has shown more than a gap.

    In addition to the release of Giacomo Tortora from the Ferrari simulation department, the departure of Alessandro Cinelli, head of the aerodynamic performance assessment group, historic representative of the Maranello team for 17 years, is also recorded.

    The feeling is that the promotion of internal forces that had been wanted by Sergio Marchionne to release the ideas present within the Scuderia has come to an end: the volcanic former president had been able to find resources in the Racing Department that had been put on the sidelines by the management of the English Pat Fry and James Allison, technical directors who had brought their trusted people to Maranello.


    The most striking example was that of David Sanchez, an imaginative French aerodynamicist who had fallen into oblivion on the edge of the Scuderia and who was recovered at the time of Dirk De Beer's exit in 2016.

    Flanked by Enrico Cardile, the aerodynamicist who had taken care of the 488 GTE in Antonello Coletta's GT department, the transalpine launched a revolutionary construction philosophy with the flow conveyor mounted in front of the very backward bellows of the SF70H, which opened a trend of development then copied by all, Mercedes excluded.

    With Cardile promoted to the "coordinator" of the SF90 project in the role left by Simone Resta, Sanchez has taken another step forward and since February has been appointed head of the Cavallino aerodynamics.

    And then we understand why now Ferrari needs to reinforce its staff by fishing new technicians from the outside. Simone Resta can become a horse of return, but the name of the dt Alfa Romeo did not enthuse Binotto when journalists reminded him of it as a sign that he will not return as chief designer.

    In Maranello capable engineers are arriving, but no name of cry. These are top figures in their fields, able to give a new jolt to an environment that can never sit on their laurels. For example, we are talking about Marco Adurno, an Italian who had established a good reputation in Red Bull Technology as head of the group that dealt with data analysis and simulation.


    Following Peter Mlinaric arrived in Maranello almost a year ago always from Milton Keynes to give new impetus to the CFD department and new technologies. It should come as no surprise that the focus was on Red Bull, a team considered to be the master in the construction of single-seaters with a great downforce capable of compensating, at least in part due to the lack of power of the Renault engines, first, and Honda, today.

    Ferrari is therefore changing its skin: Mattia Binotto's Scuderia is being born in silence. He is putting every piece of the puzzle in his place and who knows if the Red one starts to win ...

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  25. #115
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    That was a great read jgonzalesm6 and very informative. Thank you for posting.
    My point is with all of the technical work in progress at Maranello I doubt Mattia has time for driver support.
    He needs someone to take over and manage personnel at the pit wall.
    I am not surprised about Pat Fry and James Allison who brought their trusted people to Maranello instead of looking at the talent within!!!
    Somehow I worry about Jock Clear mainly because he left Merc & Lewis for Maranello.


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  26. #116
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    From all available capable TPs Flavio is the one who has lead a team to WDC. And why not hire Alonso as sporting sirector?

  27. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by bonzo View Post
    From all available capable TPs Flavio is the one who has lead a team to WDC. And why not hire Alonso as sporting sirector?
    Flavio said this about Formula 1 back on 12 June 2014 he said: "I do not like this new Formula One. It's not our Formula 1." "He pointed a finger at cars that "do not make a noise", drivers having to "save fuel" and "fake overtaking". He added: "It is no longer a sport of gladiators, it is a sport of accountants."

    You'd be just as likely to get to Ross Brawn back at Ferrari then Flavio.

  28. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    Ferrari: new technicians are fished after Marchionne's autarchy in Maranello

    https://translate.google.com/transla...0/&prev=search
    Thanks. Reads like what I said regarding old wounds/loyalties and line managers. We'd better sit tight as this may take a while. I hope I am wrong.

  29. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPMFerrari View Post
    Flavio said this about Formula 1 back on 12 June 2014 he said: "I do not like this new Formula One. It's not our Formula 1." "He pointed a finger at cars that "do not make a noise", drivers having to "save fuel" and "fake overtaking". He added: "It is no longer a sport of gladiators, it is a sport of accountants."

    You'd be just as likely to get to Ross Brawn back at Ferrari then Flavio.
    If the money's good enough, perhaps he would reconsider.

    But I doubt Ferrari are even considering him.

  30. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPZ View Post
    If the money's good enough, perhaps he would reconsider.
    I don't think money would coax Flavio but love of the sport and Ferrari could!
    But he has already said he doesn't like the current F1 and who could blame him???
    I know I have often criticized him in the past on this forum but to be honest it was mainly his dress!!!!!
    As for his skills in getting the right people on board and motivating them he's good.
    Just look at Benetton 1994 & 1995 when he helped to steer a young Michael Schumacher to WDC in a car not far removed from where Renault are to-day.
    Personally I would have a problem with him re Singapore 2008. Could I put that to rest if he became operations manager or something like that well maybe………….if he let both drivers race


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