Page 7 of 24 FirstFirst 123456789101112131415161718192021 ... LastLast
Results 181 to 210 of 705

Thread: 2020 Pre-season Testing Thread

  1. #181
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    USA!
    Posts
    3,164
    Quote Originally Posted by stefa View Post
    Shady....
    dude... more shade than a 100 year old oak.

  2. #182
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    2,089
    Quote Originally Posted by WS6TransAm01 View Post
    10.2.3 'No adjustment may be made to any suspension system while the car is in motion.'

    Someone please explain to me how FIA let's this fly? Why do we even bother watching anymore if the fix is in?
    A clear violation of the rules. It could even be protested that it is a moveable aero device given the mass damper got banned on those grounds years ago.

    There could be significant benefits to the device. Adjusting the toe will have an impact on tire wear and tire temperatures. Merc can run an aggressive toe setup for a very sharp turn in and good steering in low speed corners in particular, and then straighten the tires out which will be more stable during braking. Also we know Mercedes have had a steering geometry that would lower the front of the car when the wheels get turned. This potentially could amplify that effect. Then there is the small aero effect too. With the wheels toed in or out the tires are set at an angle to the airflow and might affect how the air flows around them. This might be particularly noticeable if the tires are toed out as this would be fighting the flow path of outwash of the outter edge of the front wing.

  3. #183
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Kitchener, CANADA
    Posts
    9,913
    Quote Originally Posted by WS6TransAm01 View Post
    10.2.3 'No adjustment may be made to any suspension system while the car is in motion.'

    Someone please explain to me how FIA let's this fly? Why do we even bother watching anymore if the fix is in?
    ferrari should protest about this and threaten to PULL OUT OF F1.....oh, wait....if they do FIA will take it as a joke and ignore it
    So 2023 started off bad, but managed to claw back some lap time come end of the year. Lets hope SF24 will give us tifosi something to smile about.

  4. #184
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    hong kong
    Posts
    1,519
    ERS issue for bottas. won't run again.

    https://twitter.com/ChrisMedlandF1/s...201713667?s=20

  5. #185
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Kitchener, CANADA
    Posts
    9,913
    Quote Originally Posted by Vettel165 View Post
    Car looks stable in low speed corners, which was our weakness last year.

    http://scuderiafans.com/watch-onboar...9jcP3COgN36K_M

    What I would love to see is more laps!
    of course it looks stable when you drive slow and to a delta.....wait and see until we do some flying laps with low fuel as we havent'; done any yet.....then we'll see how stable our car is
    So 2023 started off bad, but managed to claw back some lap time come end of the year. Lets hope SF24 will give us tifosi something to smile about.

  6. #186
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Slovenia, Maribor
    Posts
    923
    Quote Originally Posted by FerrariF60 View Post
    of course it looks stable when you drive slow and to a delta.....wait and see until we do some flying laps with low fuel as we havent'; done any yet.....then we'll see how stable our car is
    Agree. Hope we sandbag a lot until Australia, and than suprise everyone with a pole position!

  7. #187
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Kitchener, CANADA
    Posts
    9,913
    Quote Originally Posted by Vettel165 View Post
    agree. Hope we sandbagg a lot until Australia, and than suprise everyone with a pole position!
    i would love that as much as any ferrari fan out on this forum....but we have to do some flying laps SOON, just to see how the car behaves when everything is turned up....we shouldn't wait until Australia just in case we need to fix/rectify something
    So 2023 started off bad, but managed to claw back some lap time come end of the year. Lets hope SF24 will give us tifosi something to smile about.

  8. #188
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    430
    It look like the steering come Foward and then the tires/ wheels goes in!
    What is that a benefit?


    "Big things have small beginings"
    "Perseverence is power"

  9. #189
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    India
    Posts
    11,173
    Quote Originally Posted by stefa View Post
    Maybe they are looking at it and therefore trying to understand it at some higher level
    Even that is not working at the moment.

    Seeing mercs DAS innovative solution, I would just say fantastic work by Mercs.
    Also I heard that mercs bringing up new innovative suspension upgrade.

    I fear we don’t stand any chance this season.

  10. #190
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Location
    Tirana, al
    Posts
    114
    We are pushing F1 into transformers cars, and for what? Just to save the tires. I cant see the point of this.
    Anyway with all the knowledge Ferrari have, it shouldn't be hard to copy

  11. #191
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Kitchener, CANADA
    Posts
    9,913
    Quote Originally Posted by alfa84 View Post
    We are pushing F1 into transformers cars, and for what? Just to save the tires. I cant see the point of this.
    Anyway with all the knowledge Ferrari have, it shouldn't be hard to copy
    One thing is to copy it, and another is to work as it’s intended on another car
    Anything can be copied, but it has to work with your cars aero....
    So 2023 started off bad, but managed to claw back some lap time come end of the year. Lets hope SF24 will give us tifosi something to smile about.

  12. #192
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    2,089
    Quote Originally Posted by FerrariF60 View Post
    One thing is to copy it, and another is to work as it’s intended on another car
    Anything can be copied, but it has to work with your cars aero....
    I don't think it would be that hard to copy the mechanical function. But it would likely take months of testing to make it work with the aero and mechanical dynamics of one's specific car.

  13. #193
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Czech Republic
    Posts
    7,508
    Oh my God. Please no, God please no...

    "If he can't do it with Ferrari, well, he can't do it." - John Surtees

  14. #194
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    239
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyss4k View Post
    Oh my God. Please no, God please no...
    lol a bit dramatic, no?

  15. #195
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Czech Republic
    Posts
    7,508
    Quote Originally Posted by h3ro View Post
    lol a bit dramatic, no?
    Just got back from work after not being able to see anything from the tests and all I see i 3 pages talking just about some new Mercedes trick with steering... so I figured... or is it just minor thing?

    "If he can't do it with Ferrari, well, he can't do it." - John Surtees

  16. #196
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Kitchener, CANADA
    Posts
    9,913
    Maybe all this hype about their DAS system Merc has is just a mask of other innovative bits and tricks they might have on the car just to keep the media as well as other teams busy with it (even though they prolly know it’s not legal) and maybe the other things they might have on the car will give them more performance

    Who knows, I don’t trust those sneaky Merc guys
    So 2023 started off bad, but managed to claw back some lap time come end of the year. Lets hope SF24 will give us tifosi something to smile about.

  17. #197
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Christchurch,UK
    Posts
    4,957
    Quote Originally Posted by Vettel165 View Post
    Car looks stable in low speed corners, which was our weakness last year.

    http://scuderiafans.com/watch-onboar...9jcP3COgN36K_M

    What I would love to see is more laps!
    Watching Seb's laps on Sky TV, the car looked a bit twitchy to me, rather than stable, I couldn't access the onboard for some reason. And that Merc DAS may be innovative but is it truly safe or legal? Surprised that the pink Merc hasn't been allowed to copy it already! Ferrari had better be sandbagging or we may be in for yet another disappointing season.

  18. #198
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Czech Republic
    Posts
    7,508
    Quote Originally Posted by FerrariF60 View Post
    Maybe all this hype about their DAS system Merc has is just a mask of other innovative bits and tricks they might have on the car just to keep the media as well as other teams busy with it (even though they prolly know it’s not legal) and maybe the other things they might have on the car will give them more performance

    Who knows, I don’t trust those sneaky Merc guys
    Do we have something inovative too being seen so far or is it just Mercs?

    "If he can't do it with Ferrari, well, he can't do it." - John Surtees

  19. #199
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Corpus Christi Tx
    Posts
    11,046
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyss4k View Post
    Do we have something inovative too being seen so far or is it just Mercs?

    It's just Mercs
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  20. #200
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Corpus Christi Tx
    Posts
    11,046
    Update:

    [Autobild] Red Bull thinks the DAS system is not legal:

    Helmut Marko: "If you actively change the toe of the wheels while driving, the contact surface of the tyres changes. And thus - even if in a very, very low range - the ground clearance."

    Helmut Marko: "And this is prohibited because the system then corresponds to the operation of an active suspension which is not allowed."

    https://www.autobild.de/artikel/form...-16393363.html
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  21. #201
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    norCal
    Posts
    9,590
    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    Update:

    [Autobild] Red Bull thinks the DAS system is not legal:

    Helmut Marko: "If you actively change the toe of the wheels while driving, the contact surface of the tyres changes. And thus - even if in a very, very low range - the ground clearance."

    Helmut Marko: "And this is prohibited because the system then corresponds to the operation of an active suspension which is not allowed."

    https://www.autobild.de/artikel/form...-16393363.html
    Absolutely no question about it. No different than being able to run DRS the entire race. In the straight one format, into the curves another format (probably multiple formats).
    No way that FIA can allow this.

    -Lou(is)
    Forza
    Ferrari 16/15

    Totus Tuus


  22. #202
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Corpus Christi Tx
    Posts
    11,046
    Quote Originally Posted by Tifoso View Post
    Absolutely no question about it. No different than being able to run DRS the entire race. In the straight one format, into the curves another format (probably multiple formats).
    No way that FIA can allow this.
    Teams will have to protest this DAS system with Mercedes.

    Personally, given the time at the moment, I don't know what benefit in the times this DAS system will contribute to Mercedes....being that the Mercs always sandbaggs testing.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  23. #203
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Slovenia, Maribor
    Posts
    923
    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    Teams will have to protest this DAS system with Mercedes.

    Personally, given the time at the moment, I don't know what benefit in the times this DAS system will contribute to Mercedes....being that the Mercs always sandbaggs testing.
    Or maybe this is the trick made by Marcedes, that DAS system might be an eye-opening for everyone. It could well be the case that they are hiding something different, bigger than this maybe under the car. Only my opinion.

  24. #204
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Montevideo
    Posts
    548
    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    Update:

    [Autobild] Red Bull thinks the DAS system is not legal:

    Helmut Marko: "If you actively change the toe of the wheels while driving, the contact surface of the tyres changes. And thus - even if in a very, very low range - the ground clearance."

    Helmut Marko: "And this is prohibited because the system then corresponds to the operation of an active suspension which is not allowed."

    https://www.autobild.de/artikel/form...-16393363.html
    Unfortunately, I see nothing in the rules regarding suspension/steering that turns this illegal so the teams are desperately trying to get it banned based on other grounds, every time you steer you are actively changing front wheel toe due to the Akerman steering geometry.

  25. #205
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    32,234
    Very clever by Merc wonder what sort of gains it gives them, I imagine the FIA have said this is legal all through the development, is it safe though if the system was to fail?
    Forza Ferrari

  26. #206
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Corpus Christi Tx
    Posts
    11,046
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  27. #207
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Ontario
    Posts
    2,124
    They say it's legal because it works on steering and not on suspension, but if moving the toe that much has any affect at all on camber or caster then that becomes a suspension issue and then it becomes illegal. Not sure how they can separate the two. Also if it helps aero, the it becomes a movable aero device.

  28. #208
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    2,089
    If this gets deemed legal, then what is to stop a team from building some device that actively changes the camber? I pulled the steering wheel back, which activates a motor, that mechanically pushes or pulls the A arms inwards or outwards. It's steering and mechanical!

    Changing the alignment on the cars changes the front ride height. That is active suspension and a moveable aerodynamic device.

  29. #209
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Universe
    Posts
    584
    Why are some people thinking that it's only Merc that as innovation that could win a race, go and listen to the launch video again, Ferrari has something they will also unleash next week or in Melbourne. just mark my word.

  30. #210
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    rehoboth mass
    Posts
    193
    So just read sv comments on this matter with a long conversation at there lunch break he seems confident that if it passes scrutiny and seems to give a advantage that they would be designing and developing asap.seem if it's only making front tires toe in and back to neutral fine but if it's doing all that and lifting ride height and then u can bet red bull will be asking others to join in and protest and that's the end of that.this is testing no questions at being asked but come Australia fia will be going through that system inside and out

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •