Vettel is leaving Ferrari

**Hornet** · 14th May 2020, 15:27

Just as with Alonso, I wasn't a fan of Vettel until he joined Ferrari. I guess its easier to appreciate a driver when they are driving for our team.
It's unfortunate we couldn't watch a either of them winning a title with Ferrari. At least for Vettel, I do believed he genuinely wanted to win a title with Ferrari, like what Schumi did.
I wish him all the best.

Secretly I was actually wondering if we could have a chance to see how Lewis would do in a Ferrari. As much as we can't stand his character, his talent cannot be doubted.
Coming to Ferrari and win the title would be the thing that prove beyond doubt he's one of the greats.

Anyway, welcome to Sainz. I do hope he change my opinion of him, and can be as competitive as Charles

**Hornet** · 14th May 2020, 15:58

Originally Posted by FerrariF60

As for McLaren, did you actually see the offer? Thought so...just a bunch of media making stuff up...face it, Vettels days in F1 are DONE....an over rated and overpaid driver....without Newey,s rockets that he enjoyed at r d bull he’s nothing....can’t race worth $#@& if he’s5th or lower....he was used to qualify on pole and disappear into sunset...that is NOT what I consider a great driver....

We could say the same about Schumi and Rory Bryne too if we want to play it that way.
Bryne was there building the cars in which Schumi's achieved his success.

At the end of the day, we need a great driver and a great engineer to achieve these kind of success. It doesn't take anything away from the other person, because they both plays different role.

**totox** · 14th May 2020, 16:22

Originally Posted by FerrariF60

Hmmm, why u gotta be so negative? First and foremost Charles has proven himself in the team by havin a great year last season and not to mention the outstanding F2 season he had b4 he came to F1 where he wiped the floor not just his teammate there but the whole grid, where ALL cars are spec cars and ONLY the driver matters....so personally I consider him a really good driver with really good race craft skills which are only gonna get better as he matures

So having Sainz as a teammate is going to be a good thing, surely he’s not on the same level as Charles, but who knows, we’ve never has Sainz in a competitive car to see what he’s capable of...I think Ferrari made a good sensible decision signing him on.

First he has to prove if he has the temple and attitude to be a team leader and be capable of handle the extreme pressure the press and fans will put on his shoulders. Then we will see if he can give us a championship. It's not be negative it's been realistic.

**alfa84** · 14th May 2020, 16:30

Welcome to Sainz!
For sure he is a lot more hungrier tha Vet.
It seems Ferrari is betting anything on Lec and providing him that tranquility he needs.
My only doubt is that would be Sainz better than Botas?

**SS454** · 14th May 2020, 16:46

Welcome Carlos Sainz.

I think Ferrari made a mistake and took the safe choice. A true #1 and #2 pairing has been proven to work and I don't disagree with it, but I also think having 2 very fast drivers that push each other can get the most out of each driver. I think Danny Ric would have been good enough to give Charles a little edginess, but also fair enough not to cause friction. This is assuming Ricciardo even wanted to sign with Ferrari. He may go down as the driver to make even worse decisions than Alonso.

**wisepie** · 14th May 2020, 16:47

Lando will be very upset losing his bromance partner, and for 2021 we will have two Charlies in our team. Hope that doesn't prove to be an omen, Charlie being an English expression for someone who does something silly. But I wish them luck together and hope that Charles can handle the pressure of his new status, I'm pretty sure he will.

**SilverSpeed** · 14th May 2020, 16:51

Welcome Sainz!

**Liscia** · 14th May 2020, 17:21

Buena suerte Carlos Sainz! Forza Ferrari!!!

**Tifoso** · 14th May 2020, 17:21

Originally Posted by Greig

Alonso please....

For a couple of seasons might just be the best option.
I think Ricciardo could be a great choice, too. For the most part, he just shuts up and drives.

EDIT: Sainz it is, then.

**Cevertmyhero** · 14th May 2020, 17:35

Originally Posted by SilverSpeed

Welcome Sainz!

Welcome indeed. However I wish we had gone for Ricciardo instead. Nothing against Sainz but I think Daniel could mount a title charge and I don't see that in Sainz current!y.

**bkircher** · 14th May 2020, 17:38

He will be the Rubens to Charles.

**Stormsearcher** · 14th May 2020, 18:25

The best part about the turn of events over the last few days is we dont (may not) have to deal with vettels fanboys anymore.

I dont know if Seb couldnt take the pressure or Ferrari simply didnt want to pay him as much. Whatever the reason, prbly work out best for both parties.
I dont think sainz will trouble Charles too much. He might well be a great no.2 for the team. Which is what we actually want anyways. If we wanted 2 alphas, we would have gone after Alonso or Hamilton.

Anyways, 2021 should be interesting. Will look forward to it. 2020 is done IMO. Cant see more than 10 races happening, and they cant call that a season.

**Tifoso** · 14th May 2020, 18:41

The originally had, what? 6-8 races.
If they get 10 or 8 in, it’s a season.

**FerrariF60** · 14th May 2020, 18:55

Originally Posted by Stormsearcher

The best part about the turn of events over the last few days is we dont (may not) have to deal with vettels fanboys anymore.

I dont know if Seb couldnt take the pressure or Ferrari simply didnt want to pay him as much. Whatever the reason, prbly work out best for both parties.
I dont think sainz will trouble Charles too much. He might well be a great no.2 for the team. Which is what we actually want anyways. If we wanted 2 alphas, we would have gone after Alonso or Hamilton.

Anyways, 2021 should be interesting. Will look forward to it. 2020 is done IMO. Cant see more than 10 races happening, and they cant call that a season.

What??? Back in the day, like ions ago we had 12 races or so....or I could be wrong but something to that nature any
We’re just getting spoiled with 21+ races in a calendar....not that I mind it, not at all....lol

**FerrariF60** · 14th May 2020, 18:56

Originally Posted by Tifoso

The originally had, what? 6-8 races.
If they get 10 or 8 in, it’s a season.

I’ll take it, better then none

**512 TR** · 14th May 2020, 20:21

Originally Posted by WS6TransAm01

I would be okay with "dumbed down power units" if they were NA V12s again lol

If the package would be as fast as they are now, no problem. But that's probably not doable and therefor it becomes a non-discussion. Dumbing down for me is making cars 3-6 seconds slower.

**jgonzalesm6** · 14th May 2020, 20:52

Originally Posted by 512 TR

If the package would be as fast as they are now, no problem. But that's probably not doable and therefor it becomes a non-discussion. Dumbing down for me is making cars 3-6 seconds slower.

How do you figure????

I realize manufactureres are not going back to V-12's or, my favorite V-10's,.......such is the state of the global green deal.

Stick a 3ltr V-10 in a 2017 or 2018 F1 car and the times would be the same if not better. There are still tracks today, not alot, that still retain 2004 records.

**FerrariF60** · 14th May 2020, 21:01

Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6

How do you figure????

I realize manufactureres are not going back to V-12's or, my favorite V-10's,.......such is the state of the global green deal.

Stick a 3ltr V-10 in a 2017 or 2018 F1 car and the times would be the same if not better. There are still tracks today, not alot, that still retain 2004 records.

you do realize that the current power units as they call it...ice, mguh, mguk....blah, blah....are 1000+ HP........show me a v10 normally aspirated that was ever making that kind of power
that's why these cars with today's engines are smashing all lap records...

**SS454** · 14th May 2020, 21:36

Originally Posted by FerrariF60

you do realize that the current power units as they call it...ice, mguh, mguk....blah, blah....are 1000+ HP........show me a v10 normally aspirated that was ever making that kind of power
that's why these cars with today's engines are smashing all lap records...

I'm not sure they are 1000+ bhp, but I have heard some say that, so who knows. I tend to think they are closer to 950-975ish. The V10s of 2005 were right up around 950 hp as well. The current hybrid engines make sooooo much more torque though, and through 8 gears. Horsepower to the wheels is probably very very similar between the best V10 and the current V6s as the drivetrain surely is built much stronger to hold the torque as well as the traction through the huge rear tires.

Most of the track records (qualifying) are beaten by modern F1 cars because of the tires and the fact they run on minimum fuel loads. Take 15 laps of fuel out of the F2004 and the gab closes by 1 to 1.5 seconds. Race pace the F2004 is still the fastest as it can use all 900+ hp every lap and has much lighter fuel loads during the race. And lets not forget the F2004 was 134 kg lighter! That's a huge difference.

Put a 950 hp V10 in a 2020 car and drop the minimum weight by 100 kg and and I bet the cars would have a faster race pace. Perhaps not in qualifying, but that is possible too.

**Silent Bob** · 14th May 2020, 21:48

Not to mention that those V10's were revving in the neighborhood of 20-21k rpm in qualy form. 15 years of technological development, we could have been seeing engines regularly hitting 24-25k with well over 1000hp. That would have sounded amazing. Even just bring back V8's with Kers and get rid of all the other MG's. Cap them at something around 2.5 liters, let them sing at 22-24k rpm. Sweet. Add refueling, let teams choose their race tires.... voila! F1.

Back to topic. Welcome Saints. Hope we get some great results and see Leclerc crowned king.

**jgonzalesm6** · 14th May 2020, 21:48

Originally Posted by FerrariF60

you do realize that the current power units as they call it...ice, mguh, mguk....blah, blah....are 1000+ HP........show me a v10 normally aspirated that was ever making that kind of power
that's why these cars with today's engines are smashing all lap records...

That's not the only reason they are "smashing" (2 to 3 seconds.....really???) records because of the hp.

the 2017 and 2018 cars have 1) wider, stickier, slick tires 2) wider chassis 3) wider floor 4) wider front wing with 42 cascade elements in total 5) wider rear diffuser 6) wider rear wing 7) DRS...used during qualifying in DRS zones which gives the car a 10 to 12mph advantage 8) and aero up the wazoo.

V-10's during qualifying mode made 940hp....at best....but we are talking about a smaller car with grooved and narrower tires back in 2004.

**jgonzalesm6** · 14th May 2020, 21:49

Originally Posted by SS454

I'm not sure they are 1000+ bhp, but I have heard some say that, so who knows. I tend to think they are closer to 950-975ish. The V10s of 2005 were right up around 950 hp as well. The current hybrid engines make sooooo much more torque though, and through 8 gears. Horsepower to the wheels is probably very very similar between the best V10 and the current V6s as the drivetrain surely is built much stronger to hold the torque as well as the traction through the huge rear tires.

Most of the track records (qualifying) are beaten by modern F1 cars because of the tires and the fact they run on minimum fuel loads. Take 15 laps of fuel out of the F2004 and the gab closes by 1 to 1.5 seconds. Race pace the F2004 is still the fastest as it can use all 900+ hp every lap and has much lighter fuel loads during the race. And lets not forget the F2004 was 134 kg lighter! That's a huge difference.

Put a 950 hp V10 in a 2020 car and drop the minimum weight by 100 kg and and I bet the cars would have a faster race pace. Perhaps not in qualifying, but that is possible too.

+1

**FerrariF60** · 14th May 2020, 21:52

Originally Posted by SS454

I'm not sure they are 1000+ bhp, but I have heard some say that, so who knows. I tend to think they are closer to 950-975ish. The V10s of 2005 were right up around 950 hp as well. The current hybrid engines make sooooo much more torque though, and through 8 gears. Horsepower to the wheels is probably very very similar between the best V10 and the current V6s as the drivetrain surely is built much stronger to hold the torque as well as the traction through the huge rear tires.

Most of the track records (qualifying) are beaten by modern F1 cars because of the tires and the fact they run on minimum fuel loads. Take 15 laps of fuel out of the F2004 and the gab closes by 1 to 1.5 seconds. Race pace the F2004 is still the fastest as it can use all 900+ hp every lap and has much lighter fuel loads during the race. And lets not forget the F2004 was 134 kg lighter! That's a huge difference.

Put a 950 hp V10 in a 2020 car and drop the minimum weight by 100 kg and and I bet the cars would have a faster race pace. Perhaps not in qualifying, but that is possible too.

ok, you make a fair point there about the weight in the old vs. new cars as well as qualifying back then was with a lot more fuel as they started wiht whatever fuel they had vs. running on fumes the way they do it nowadays in quali....

don't get me wrong, i'd love to see the V10's resurface again as i used to love the sound of them every time i went to Montreal.....man still gives me goose bumps every time i think about 2004 Canadian GP as i was there....those screaming 19,000RPM V10's were just extremely LOUD.......oh, those were the GOOD OLD DAYS.....i'm glad i lived to see and hear F1 cars through the 80's and 90's.....and even 2000's as those V8's weren't too shabby either....

**Lec16** · 14th May 2020, 23:17

Originally Posted by f150italia

Nobody even in ferrari forum will speak about how good the mercedes car in hybrid era.Because,the British and American fans wants to project Hamilton as a hero and the Alonso fans wants to belittle Vettel.Mercedes wants to overhype Hamilton's abilities because,they know Hamilton is like a celebrity in their primary markets.They will do whatever it takes to make him a wdc by signing a lesser second driver and sacrifice him during GP's will make him as a roadblock to other contenders.

You are right that there is bias in the media, but it is everywhere and every country.

The rest is delusion, your driver will retire and was a lesser driver than Hamilton. A driver that never stayed to avenge his defeats can't be compared to a battle machine as LH.

Anyway, there is one more season to go and nobody knows what really will happen.

**Stormsearcher** · 15th May 2020, 04:32

Originally Posted by Tifoso

The originally had, what? 6-8 races.
If they get 10 or 8 in, it’s a season.

Ah. well. technically yes. But it doesnt have the same ring to it.
Kinda like having a best of 3 set match (tennis) for a Grand Slam. Its still a match and will prbly be a great one, but doesnt carry the same weight.

**Stormsearcher** · 15th May 2020, 04:33

[QUOTE=FerrariF60;1025359..I’ll take it, better then none[/QUOTE]

haha. make no mistake about it, i will take it too!!

**nani_s23** · 15th May 2020, 05:22

I think we can open a new thread “Welcome Sainz”....!!

All the best to him. Now Leclerc got every support that he wanted, pressure will be huge from media & Tifosi. Let’s see how he handles it.
All the best to him & team.

**DJTaurus** · 15th May 2020, 05:40

You haven’t seen F1 Netflix show if you think that Sainz will accept being number 2. When he came in F1 most were saying that didn’t deserve it and it was because of his father. This guy was each year constantly improving and proved that everyone was wrong. If you think that because he is calm and not making mistakes, he will settle for number 2 and just follow orders like Bottas you are wrong. He clearly has ambitions to succeed and at the end of the day don’t forget that he is Mediterranean too.