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Thread: Binotto resigns

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Other way round according to Italian media.....
    https://f1i.com/news/430772-ferraris...dt-return.html

    Well, it says that Elkann wanted him and he changed his mind.

  2. #62
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    I am happy that this Binotto era is over. Many here is saying that he is great with this and that, but first BinottoFerrari was (almost) worst ever build in Maranello.
    Binotto was a big catastrophe and now Ferrari can start build new team again, we do a have a good drivers.

    It is just Karma, how did he get his job and results followed.

  3. #63
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    If I could've chosen one I'd gone for Rueda out before Binotto, but hopefully this means the replacement will finish that job. That and an actual red car would make it a good Christmas haul. The only reason Binotto hung on for so long was that Leclerc managed to score close to 20 poles in these inferior tyre-munching aero-deficient cars in the past four years. In a DRS-free refuelling F1, it would've been good enough to fight for the '19 and '22 titles but in the endurance DRS game Binotto's reign produced sitting ducks.

  4. #64
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    The team just step back a few years with this decision. Binnoto was not perfect, but brought stability to the team, raising innovation on the engineering side by giving freedom of thinking out the box to SF Engineers, and although the engine is not as reliable as we need it, the power is there and apparently is not yet fully unleashed. Problem with Ferrari is the political wars within the team, the constant struggle for power and the need of Elkhan to try to take some credit of (possible) future success. This team is ruled by egos, not by brains. Todt took 6 years to bring the team to success with people like Rory Birne, Ross Braun , Mattia and Schumacher. With Mattia, we were going steadily uphill, but now I think we are going downhill again. For those who praise Binnoto leaving, you will probably regretting it if we are not competitive in terms of strategy making. But remember this: if we have a strong car in 2023, it will be because of Binnoto's work. With Binnoto departure, we may sorted out strategy wise, but just brought more pressure and instability to the team. And possibly hurt the team development in the future. How come some say that our car is bad, when we where the only ones to follow a specific aero design, that everybody said it was a flop, and in fact it was not? People in here think results come fast, but it takes years to get where RB is, and they are one of the most stable teams on the grid ...

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galvonero View Post
    The team just step back a few years with this decision. Binnoto was not perfect, but brought stability to the team, raising innovation on the engineering side by giving freedom of thinking out the box to SF Engineers, and although the engine is not as reliable as we need it, the power is there and apparently is not yet fully unleashed. Problem with Ferrari is the political wars within the team, the constant struggle for power and the need of Elkhan to try to take some credit of (possible) future success. This team is ruled by egos, not by brains. Todt took 6 years to bring the team to success with people like Rory Birne, Ross Braun , Mattia and Schumacher. With Mattia, we were going steadily uphill, but now I think we are going downhill again. For those who praise Binnoto leaving, you will probably regretting it if we are not competitive in terms of strategy making. But remember this: if we have a strong car in 2023, it will be because of Binnoto's work. With Binnoto departure, we may sorted out strategy wise, but just brought more pressure and instability to the team. And possibly hurt the team development in the future. How come some say that our car is bad, when we where the only ones to follow a specific aero design, that everybody said it was a flop, and in fact it was not? People in here think results come fast, but it takes years to get where RB is, and they are one of the most stable teams on the grid ...
    If we have a good car 2023, the reason will be a great team effort. Binotto was a part of this, but Ferrari has great engineers. We lacked accountability, and you don’t see this with RB. We weren’t able to develop our car, and there will be changes to our philosophy. Todt did what needed to be done, backing your No.1 driver at all cost. RB does the same, Binotto didn’t.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by brucewayne View Post
    If we have a good car 2023, the reason will be a great team effort. Binotto was a part of this, but Ferrari has great engineers. We lacked accountability, and you don’t see this with RB. We weren’t able to develop our car, and there will be changes to our philosophy. Todt did what needed to be done, backing your No.1 driver at all cost. RB does the same, Binotto didn’t.
    From when he started @ F-1 Max refused to be a #2 driver at all costs, Charles @ Ferrari refused to be #2 driver to Seb. I'm sure Carlos is thinking that way esp. now that Mick is out of the way as far as replacing him.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by brucewayne View Post
    If we have a good car 2023, the reason will be a great team effort. Binotto was a part of this, but Ferrari has great engineers. We lacked accountability, and you don’t see this with RB. We weren’t able to develop our car, and there will be changes to our philosophy. Todt did what needed to be done, backing your No.1 driver at all cost. RB does the same, Binotto didn’t.
    True, but who managed to create an environment inside the team that the great engineers we have could show their potential? Does anyone believe that grilling engineers and team leaders will do anything good? And regarding accountability, Charles has referred that it was being done, but internally, behind closed doors. But that doesn't sell newspapers...

  8. #68
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    Sweet jesus ...

    If one can acknowledge the simple truth that Binotto was not a good TP (ergo a new TP needed to be put in his shoes) then one needs to acknowledge that Binotto would never return to a previous post so the writing was on the wall.
    So the question to be answered to the nay sayers of this is, would it be better for Ferrari to go yet another year like in 2022 , with (probably) a very fast car at the beginning which will gradually lose pace as time goes by and the worst pit crew from the three top teams , whereas our TP will make us look idiots by saying "everything is perfect, we made the right choices", while at the same time Leclerc finally gets started on Valium,
    OR
    Ferrari instigates change, gets a TP that actually is .. A TP , and gets a technical director who is a TD, breaks the bank and changes things around at the pit wall and finally starts to work things around towards improving things that for Binotto were ... well, fine but for everyone else were pathetic?

    When you have a clear answer , then you know why Binotto had to go.
    "If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari" - Gilles Villeneuve

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by aroutis View Post
    Sweet jesus ...

    If one can acknowledge the simple truth that Binotto was not a good TP (ergo a new TP needed to be put in his shoes) then one needs to acknowledge that Binotto would never return to a previous post so the writing was on the wall.
    So the question to be answered to the nay sayers of this is, would it be better for Ferrari to go yet another year like in 2022 , with (probably) a very fast car at the beginning which will gradually lose pace as time goes by and the worst pit crew from the three top teams , whereas our TP will make us look idiots by saying "everything is perfect, we made the right choices", while at the same time Leclerc finally gets started on Valium,
    OR
    Ferrari instigates change, gets a TP that actually is .. A TP , and gets a technical director who is a TD, breaks the bank and changes things around at the pit wall and finally starts to work things around towards improving things that for Binotto were ... well, fine but for everyone else were pathetic?

    When you have a clear answer , then you know why Binotto had to go.
    You have been saying this since Domenicalli....changing TP over and over is sure working out for Ferrari....
    Forza Ferrari

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    You have been saying this since Domenicalli....changing TP over and over is sure working out for Ferrari....
    The reason why it hasn't worked out and why they keep having to replace is because they keep choosing bad TPs.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by WS6TransAm01 View Post
    The reason why it hasn't worked out and why they keep having to replace is because they keep choosing bad TPs.
    Not sure that is entirely true but we will rebuild again for the next 4 years then rinse and repeat....

    Maybe the issue is a bit higher up.
    Forza Ferrari

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    You have been saying this since Domenicalli....changing TP over and over is sure working out for Ferrari....
    How did waiting 7 seasons for Domenicalli to get Ferrari together enough for Alonso to win a title work out?

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Not sure that is entirely true but we will rebuild again for the next 4 years then rinse and repeat....

    Maybe the issue is a bit higher up.
    We are not rebuilding, as the fundamentals are set. Now it's time to make the next steps.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by WS6TransAm01 View Post
    The reason why it hasn't worked out and why they keep having to replace is because they keep choosing bad TPs.
    All TP's since Todt-Brawn were given the job for idiotic reasons. Arrivabene never had any business being a TP, Domenicalli and Binotto were promoted simply because they had been with the team for a long time.

    When Vettel was signed by Ferrari, they should've done everything possible to bring Horner along with him, just as Brawn came with Schumi.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Not sure that is entirely true but we will rebuild again for the next 4 years then rinse and repeat....

    Maybe the issue is a bit higher up.
    It could be, like I said, someone keeps picking the wrong people to be TPs

    Quote Originally Posted by RossTheBoss View Post
    All TP's since Todt-Brawn were given the job for idiotic reasons. Arrivabene never had any business being a TP, Domenicalli and Binotto were promoted simply because they had been with the team for a long time.

    When Vettel was signed by Ferrari, they should've done everything possible to bring Horner along with him, just as Brawn came with Schumi.
    I understand promoting from within, but you have to really investigate your staff to see if they are capable of doing the job. Promoting from within just for the sake of it can lead to ruin. Sometimes you have to bring in outside talent.

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by RossTheBoss View Post
    How did waiting 7 seasons for Domenicalli to get Ferrari together enough for Alonso to win a title work out?
    The issue with the Domenicalli era was the beaurocracy and lack of outside the box thinking which was rectified under Binotto. Binotto had his issues with strategy and the political side of F1, but he was nowhere as bad as Domenicalli...
    Rest in Peace Leza, you were a true warrior...

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by RossTheBoss View Post
    How did waiting 7 seasons for Domenicalli to get Ferrari together enough for Alonso to win a title work out?
    Guess you decided to pretend the WCC win in 2008 never happened then, how strange.
    Forza Ferrari

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by brucewayne View Post
    We are not rebuilding, as the fundamentals are set. Now it's time to make the next steps.
    So the new TP will do things the same as Binotto????

    Off course we rebuild once again.
    Forza Ferrari

  19. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by WS6TransAm01 View Post



    Sometimes you have to bring in outside talent.
    Newey, Horner, Seidl, and who knows who else. Ferrari have been trying to bring outside talent to include a hefty sum of cash BUT no one with that kind of talent wants to work in that Ferrari F1 environment.....it's toxic.
    It's not how start but how you finish.

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Guess you decided to pretend the WCC win in 2008 never happened then, how strange.
    That was the last of the Todt-Brawn fumes, not your boy. In fact, the WDC that year fell apart because Ferrari had no idea how to handle the pressures of a title without Todt or Brawn at the helm, and it showed to everybody with an ounce of insight.

  21. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony View Post
    The issue with the Domenicalli era was the beaurocracy and lack of outside the box thinking which was rectified under Binotto. Binotto had his issues with strategy and the political side of F1, but he was nowhere as bad as Domenicalli...
    Binotto is without a doubt the worst Ferrari TP of my life. Got caught with his pants down on technical directives twice, the fuel scandal that drug Ferrari through the mud, crappy in season development, strategy that made Ferrari the butt of jokes around the world. On and on it goes.

    He's the worst and deserved to go.

  22. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by RossTheBoss View Post
    That was the last of the Todt-Brawn fumes, not your boy. In fact, the WDC that year fell apart because Ferrari had no idea how to handle the pressures of a title without Todt or Brawn at the helm, and it showed to everybody with an ounce of insight.
    Stefano was TP in 2008, my boy??? no just strange you choose to ignore our last title....WDC fell apart no not really again your making things up.
    Forza Ferrari

  23. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    So the new TP will do things the same as Binotto????

    Off course we rebuild once again.
    Read again.

  24. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by brucewayne View Post
    Read again.
    Is the new TP going to do the same as Binotto? No they will do it their way.

    We rebuild once again.
    Forza Ferrari

  25. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Is the new TP going to do the same as Binotto? No they will do it their way.

    We rebuild once again.
    Read again. The new TP won’t do the same as Binotto. Complementary structure, focus on your top driver. Nevertheless we have the setup in our technical department already in place. Not that difficult.

  26. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgonzalesm6 View Post
    Newey, Horner, Seidl, and who knows who else. Ferrari have been trying to bring outside talent to include a hefty sum of cash BUT no one with that kind of talent wants to work in that Ferrari F1 environment.....it's toxic.
    Newey would never move to Italy, so there's that.

    Horner, Toto, and Seidli have total control over their race teams without any meddling from upper management. They have the freedom to craft what policies they believe are necessary to win, as well hire and fire people at their will. Todt and Brawn were this way as well. They demanded total control before they accepted their jobs at Ferrari. Hell, Brawn was the same way at Benetton, Honda, and Mercedes, and the results speak for themselves.

  27. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by brucewayne View Post
    Read again. The new TP won’t do the same as Binotto. Complementary structure, focus on your top driver. Nevertheless we have the setup in our technical department already in place. Not that difficult.
    So rebuild then, as I said duh.

    You seem to think a new guy will come in and just make Charles no1 and it will fix all our problems hahahahaha.
    Forza Ferrari

  28. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by RossTheBoss View Post
    Newey would never move to Italy, so there's that.

    Horner, Toto, and Seidli have total control over their race teams without any meddling from upper management. They have the freedom to craft what policies they believe are necessary to win, as well hire and fire people at their will. Todt and Brawn were this way as well. They demanded total control before they accepted their jobs at Ferrari. Hell, Brawn was the same way at Benetton, Honda, and Mercedes, and the results speak for themselves.
    LOL Horner has Marko and Todt had Di Montezemolo. Brawn never was TP at Benetton, maybe try Briatore.

    More made up fantasy from you.
    Forza Ferrari

  29. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    So rebuild then, as I said duh.

    You seem to think a new guy will come in and just make Charles no1 and it will fix all our problems hahahahaha.
    And you think still going with the same TP will bring us glory. Nope, it seems you do like to see Ferrari fail. Making the faster driver your No.1 driver will be an important step.

  30. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by brucewayne View Post
    And you think still going with the same TP will bring us glory. Nope, it seems you do like to see Ferrari fail. Making the faster driver your No.1 driver will be an important step.
    I think we will once again have to rebuild with a new TP, seems like you think nothing will really change so we will stay where we are if you are right.....seems like u like to fail then.
    Forza Ferrari

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