Massa vs Pirelli

[zorro666]

I am 100% convinced that Fellipe struggles with the tyres!
There is no other logical explanation.
Yes, Fernando is the best out there but still it makes no sense.
The sooner Fellipe gets to grips with the tyres the sooner he will be back at his best.
Forza Ferrari!

[996 GT1 Lover]

Massa has seemed to struggle since the introduction of the Pirellis and the changes to the aerodynamics of the cars (starting in 2009), as well as since coming back from his accident.

[Hornet]

Massa does seems to be struggling with the lifespan of the tires. In qualifying, Massa did ok, which I think shows that he's able to extract the single lap performance out of it. However over the long run, the tire just degrades too quickly on his car.

[Omegablue]

I remember back in 2010, I read that Massa's style risked the most from these new tyres. Hopefully in these weeks before China, the team fine tunes his car to solve that.

[meh123]

Interestingly, this was the guy who said Pirelli's suited him better than BS...

From this :

http://www.sportsvibe.co.uk/news/motor-sport-7174/massa-backs-pirelli-over-bridgestone/ (http://www.sportsvibe.co.uk/news/motor-sport-7174/massa-backs-pirelli-over-bridgestone/)

http://www.f1sa.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=27486:f1--pirelli-tyres-make-felipe-massa-super-confident-for-2011-formula-1-season&catid=1:f1&Itemid=157


to this:

http://formula-one.speedtv.com/article/f1-felipe-massa-frustrated-by-prime-tire-performance/


1) Is enough attention being given to massa's tire problem in the Ferrari simulator?
2) Are Ferraris friday practice session being aimed to get the best out of the tires on the fuel loads?

[Ferrarichamp]

well, the pirelli's have been in use for over a year, so...

[sav_pap]

Hope he recovers soon.I can't stand seeing a ferrari struggling in the midfield anymore.:-s

[rocks.ral]

it cannot be about the tyres... Massa always went back and forth about them but since he had his best times on bridgestones, he has no arguments over which is better than the other.. ferrari can do all they want but Massa needs to put his foot down and go at it..

[Kingdom Hearts]

It's not an excuse anymore, he should have adapted to them or change the way he drives. For the first months it was an OK excuse, not anymore, he is a professional driver, he should work with his driving style and the way he set-up the car, he has all the info from Alonso, I'm pretty sure that he can draw some conclusions from that data, even if they are different drivers.

[Jacquesvw]

It's not an excuse anymore, he should have adapted to them or change the way he drives. For the first months it was an OK excuse, not anymore, he is a professional driver, he should work with his driving style and the way he set-up the car, he has all the info from Alonso, I'm pretty sure that he can draw some conclusions from that data, even if they are different drivers.

+1

[Hornet]

it cannot be about the tyres... Massa always went back and forth about them but since he had his best times on bridgestones, he has no arguments over which is better than the other.. ferrari can do all they want but Massa needs to put his foot down and go at it..

Well, I think its obvious that Massa is having problem with tire degradation. In both Australia and Malaysia, he has had more pit stop than Alonso.

When we look at his qualifying result in Malaysia, he isn't that far from Alonso. But in race trim, he's able to hold his own at first during the opening stages, but after that his tire quickly falls off than that's when he starts losing places. And there's really nothing much Massa or Ferrari can do after that. If we bring him in for 5 pit stop, he's going to waste too much time with pit stop that he ends up at the back. So they had to stretch as far as they can go and the result is the other cars starts passing him on track after the tires are gone.

[Suzie]

It's as well Massa IS at Ferrari, otherwise what on earth would everyone start threads about :roll

[sav_pap]

Testing ban is the most ridiculous thing ever happened in F1. In the name of cost cutting.
Big teams and drivers has suffered most. But not only. Safety has involved in F1, very much, lately.
But is it safer for a pilot to race to the limit with a car he doesn't know 100%? i.e. a rookie, or a pilot in his first year in a team.
Safety and Cost Cutting don't always match!

[FrankAlfa]

Massa's tire degradation is more of his style of driving than anything else. If he changed his style of driving to be smoother through turns he would have less excessive heat and graining. Alonso has worked to modify his style and Massa must do the same if he wants to stay in Formula One, let alone stay on the Ferrari Team!

Ciao.

Forza Ferrari!!!!

[Ken]

Testing ban is the most ridiculous thing ever happened in F1. In the name of cost cutting.
Big teams and drivers has suffered most. But not only. Safety has involved in F1, very much, lately.
But is it safer for a pilot to race to the limit with a car he doesn't know 100%? i.e. a rookie, or a pilot in his first year in a team.
Safety and Cost Cutting don't always match!

Totally agree the testing ban should be lifted or changed to give the teams and drivers more time :thumb

[F1NAC]

i think Massa is struggling generally with slicks

[Nova]

I am going to go far out and predict that Massa wins a race this year.
Chew on that one...:-D

[mark p]

He will get big points maybe a podium in china.

[Agron]

I think Massa needs a faster, somewhat easier to drive car to perform at his best. Schumy and Alonso have been fast in qualy and race in every team they have driven, Kimi failed in the 2008 and 2009 Ferrari, Massa in the 2011 and 2012 Ferrari (in 2010 he had some good races), Button was very average in midfield cars while very good in the 2011 and 2012 McLaren, and Hamilton hasn't been that great in race pace in 2011 or 2012, and had some bad races in 2009 too; Massa has been not-so-fast, erratic or both everytime he didn't have a good car(just remember that time he spun 5 times in the wet in a single race). Very few drivers can extract every bit of speed from whatever car it is they drive, in this generation only Schumy (well, he is racing with this generation) and Alonso are at the top in adaptability, all others have a few flaws in this aspect, while they may match or even be better (I'm unconvinced on this but will include it for fairness sake) in other aspects than these two.
Of course, the brit press want to sell the image that Massa is destroyed and is the worst driver on the grid (a few years ago some said he was the fastest -not the best, just the fastest- driver in F1), because otherwise, what can they say about Alonso? and where does that leave the brit drivers driving for the brit team?
IMHO, it is all in the car (and tyres), that thing is not only ugly but slow and difficult to handle, and Massa simply can't drive it fast enough to contend with faster cars; very likely, most of the grid will do just as bad a job, if not worse, including some highly praised recently considered top drivers.

[Nova]

Shumi has really yet to show, in his 3rd year, in the Merc. I aint knokin him, just stating a fact.

[Ste]

Schumacher has been on it this year, a 4th and a 3rd in qualifying. Two incidents out of his hands in the races.

[Greig]

Mostly down to the f-duct :-)

[scuderiafan]

Mostly down to the f-duct :-)

Which could be ending soon.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/17588028

[Ste]

Hopefully it won't be banned. Stupid to ban innovation that's clearly within the regulations. Passive devices are allowed, so why RBR are continuing this crusade is beyond me. Maybe they should focus more effort on making their own.

[scuderiafan]

Hopefully it won't be banned. Stupid to ban innovation that's clearly within the regulations. Passive devices are allowed, so why RBR are continuing this crusade is beyond me. Maybe they should focus more effort on making their own.

Well, the reactive ride height was passive, but I guess that contravened other regulations.
But it is a grey area, as the driver does activate the DRS, so you could say it isn't passive. It is a difficult one, but there is too much opposition for it to stay legal I think. RedBull, Renault, and reportedly Ferrari are against it.

But to be on topic, I think China, Malaysia, Canada Quali, Silverstone last year showed that if the car is there, Felipe will be too. Call me crazy, but I don't think Button is that much better than felipe. I believe they are similar drivers in that when the car is working in harmony, they are very fast, but they will be off the pace if not.
The difference between these 2 is that Button has got the car, while Felipe doesn't. Hardly anybody may agree with me, but I bet hardly anybody thought that button was better than Felipe back before 2009.

[anupa2k]

How many more years is Felipe Massa going to take or requires to get grip on the Perelli tyres..
Now its 2nd year he must have got rid of all his issues...and he reported the same issues with bridgestone slicks in 2010 and when Perelli gaved sample tyres for testing at Abudabi in 2010then Felipe said that he suddenly felt good grip with Perilli...
Most of them say that he is not the Felipe that used to be in 2008 or before the crash at Hungary 2009...If we see in 2008 Ferrari was much stronger...but still lost the drivers championship..If the same car would have been driven by Fernando in 2008 i am dam sure he would have been won the 2008 WDC 2-3 races in spare...
Even i liked Felipe in 2008 but now i think that it was the car and not Felipe if we see he didn`t do any miracles in 2008 he was doing the same thing as Vettel did in 2011 driver the fastest car home safely...

[Klutch]

Well, the reactive ride height was passive, but I guess that contravened other regulations.
But it is a grey area, as the driver does activate the DRS, so you could say it isn't passive. It is a difficult one, but there is too much opposition for it to stay legal I think. RedBull, Renault, and reportedly Ferrari are against it.

But to be on topic, I think China, Malaysia, Canada Quali, Silverstone last year showed that if the car is there, Felipe will be too. Call me crazy, but I don't think Button is that much better than felipe. I believe they are similar drivers in that when the car is working in harmony, they are very fast, but they will be off the pace if not.
The difference between these 2 is that Button has got the car, while Felipe doesn't. Hardly anybody may agree with me, but I bet hardly anybody thought that button was better than Felipe back before 2009.
I agree.

[Agron]

Shumi has really yet to show, in his 3rd year, in the Merc. I aint knokin him, just stating a fact.Schumy is 43, and had been 3 years out of the sport. Nothing he does now invalidates what he did before, which is what I meant: he was adaptable, fast, ... The fact he can still compete with veteran F1 drivers in their prime under such disadvantages is unparalleled.