Brake by Wire

[killer]

If my understanding is correct, F1 drivers need to slam on the brakes and then gradually ease off to make them work properly. Does the brake-by-wire system eliminate this and make braking intuitive again--that is, apply the appropriate pressure as needed?

[SS454]

traditional braking has always been apply as much pedal pressure as possible without locking a wheel. Brake by wire is electrical actuators controlling the brakes. I am not sure what regulations the FIA enforces with the brake by wire system, but it would it could allow for some interesting ways to control the braking pressures. I believe there will be little difference in feel to the driver, as they already have learned a certain feel to the brakes over the years, to change that could be difficult.

[killer]

I believe there will be little difference in feel to the driver, as they already have learned a certain feel to the brakes over the years, to change that could be difficult.

Yeah that's what I was thinking: thought they had to re-learn how to brake.

Maybe a benefit is brake adjustments without mechanical intervention?

[brembo man]

Only the rear brakes are controlled electronically "By wire". I believe Lewis will have an advantage more than anyone else seeing he's the brake king.

[ManFromMilan]

I believe Lewis will have an advantage more than anyone else seeing he's the brake king.




No, that king would be Kamui Kobayashi. Though i am not sure that it would help him much in a Caterham.

[GrndLkNatv]

Look up degressive braking, all F1 drivers have to use it and this brake by wire won't be that big of an adjustment.


traditional braking has always been apply as much pedal pressure as possible without locking a wheel. Brake by wire is electrical actuators controlling the brakes. I am not sure what regulations the FIA enforces with the brake by wire system, but it would it could allow for some interesting ways to control the braking pressures. I believe there will be little difference in feel to the driver, as they already have learned a certain feel to the brakes over the years, to change that could be difficult.

[Tobes]

traditional braking has always been apply as much pedal pressure as possible without locking a wheel. Brake by wire is electrical actuators controlling the brakes. I am not sure what regulations the FIA enforces with the brake by wire system, but it would it could allow for some interesting ways to control the braking pressures. I believe there will be little difference in feel to the driver, as they already have learned a certain feel to the brakes over the years, to change that could be difficult.

I agree, I think the difference to the driver will be minimal assuming the system operates correctly, although my understanding (I read somewhere but can't find now) is that because of the new energy recovery units, the braking of the rear wheels is now completely controlled by the ECU, it is the ECU that decides what percentage of braking energy is required from each part, dependant on various factors like if the batteries needing more or less charge or alterations to brake bias, so the ECU decides what %age of the wheel retardation can come from what system, like 50% from the energy recovery system (what are we calling that now... MGUK or something?) 30% from the hydraulic system and 20% from engine braking, I believe (but could be wrong) that these %'s are variable and are controlled solely by the ECU, if the driver depresses the brake pedal 60% the ECU applies only 60% brake pressure, i'm guessing as there is no mechanical connection from the pedal to the brakes (only to the ECU) that the pedal will have some form of resistance to feel like a normal brake pedal, I think stamping on the brakes can still cause the fronts or rears to lock as 100% of braking pressure is still 100%, unless there is an antilock braking system, I think too sudden wheel retardation from any system will still lock the brakes...

At least that is my current understanding, but as I said, i'm not 100% sure all that is correct... :-)

[GrndLkNatv]

I think it's the same look and feel as the simulator, which they have put numerous hours in.. There is resistance in the SIM just like a normal brake pedal even though it's all electronic.

http://www.evoteksimulator.com/#home



I agree, I think the difference to the driver will be minimal assuming the system operates correctly, although my understanding (I read somewhere but can't find now) is that because of the new energy recovery units, the braking of the rear wheels is now completely controlled by the ECU, it is the ECU that decides what percentage of braking energy is required from each part, dependant on various factors like if the batteries needing more or less charge or alterations to brake bias, so the ECU decides what %age of the wheel retardation can come from what system, like 50% from the energy recovery system (what are we calling that now... MGUK or something?) 30% from the hydraulic system and 20% from engine braking, I believe (but could be wrong) that these %'s are variable and are controlled solely by the ECU, if the driver depresses the brake pedal 60% the ECU applies only 60% brake pressure, i'm guessing as there is no mechanical connection from the pedal to the brakes (only to the ECU) that the pedal will have some form of resistance to feel like a normal brake pedal, I think stamping on the brakes can still cause the fronts or rears to lock as 100% of braking pressure is still 100%, unless there is an antilock braking system, I think too sudden wheel retardation from any system will still lock the brakes...

At least that is my current understanding, but as I said, i'm not 100% sure all that is correct... :-)

[Winter]

The feel should be pretty much the same. Isn't it electronically only on the rear brakes and front, where most of the stopping force is, stays as it has been before?

Here's how James Allen expains it:
http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2014/02/what-does-brake-by-wire-mean-in-these-new-f1-cars-and-how-does-it-affect-the-drivers/

[killer]

...because of the new energy recovery units, the braking of the rear wheels is now completely controlled by the ECU, it is the ECU that decides what percentage of braking energy is required from each part, dependant on various factors like if the batteries needing more or less charge or alterations to brake bias, so the ECU decides what %age of the wheel retardation can come from what system, like 50% from the energy recovery system (what are we calling that now... MGUK or something?) 30% from the hydraulic system and 20% from engine braking, I believe (but could be wrong) that these %'s are variable and are controlled solely by the ECU...

...and having the FIA regulate ECUs is the safeguard against manipulating the system to effectively run a traction control system (if possible), no?



...if the driver depresses the brake pedal 60% the ECU applies only 60% brake pressure, i'm guessing as there is no mechanical connection from the pedal to the brakes (only to the ECU) that the pedal will have some form of resistance to feel like a normal brake pedal, I think stamping on the brakes can still cause the fronts or rears to lock as 100% of braking pressure is still 100%, unless there is an antilock braking system, I think too sudden wheel retardation from any system will still lock the brakes...

Maybe a pressure + time threshold that will initiate a lockup? Seems ironic that smart brakes are developed only to be taught how to malfunction. :-) ABS is banned, right?


At least that is my current understanding, but as I said, i'm not 100% sure all that is correct... :-)

More than enough for me to learn more about it. Thanks. :cheers