FIA concludes analysis of Scuderia Ferrari Power Unit reaches settlement with Ferrari

[Lesky]

The FIA announces that, after thorough technical investigations, it has concluded its analysis of the operation of the Scuderia Ferrari Formula 1 Power Unit and reached a settlement with the team. The specifics of the agreement will remain between the parties.

The FIA and Scuderia Ferrari have agreed to a number of technical commitments that will improve the monitoring of all Formula 1 Power Units for forthcoming championship seasons as well as assist the FIA in other regulatory duties in Formula 1 and in its research activities on carbon emissions and sustainable fuels.

https://www.fia.com/news/fia-concludes-analysis-scuderia-ferrari-formula-1-power-unit?fbclid=IwAR1uEnzMP0K81Lcq7IYPyCapttVytwkzVYU0 amuIHA4zctst9243HILGnzw
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Wow, talk abut igniting the fire :-E

[wisepie]

Perhaps our cars are painted red for a reason other than it being the Italian racing colour........embarrassment, yet again!:-E:-??

[Lesky]

This is a disaster, I mean, it basicly confirms to all non-Ferrari fans that the post-summer sudden emergence of Ferrari were cheating. And then after the technical directive we were nowhere, and this season it appears the engine is not state of the art either. Ferrari lost both on track and its reputation now :-( Really sad. I would rather have played it fair than this, a few poles and 2 wins is nothing compared to the price.

[Lesky]

The FIA just made a mockery of the sport regardless what they found out, who will punish them?

[jgonzalesm6]

The FIA just made a mockery of the sport regardless what they found out, who will punish them?


How long have you been watching F1???


F1 teams have been "cheating" since the start of F1. I'm all for it BTW re: finding loopholes or "cheating"

If you ain't finding them, you're not trying hard enough.

[Lesky]

How long have you been watching F1???


F1 teams have been "cheating" since the start of F1. I'm all for it BTW re: finding loopholes or "cheating"

If you ain't finding them, you're not trying hard enough.

What Ferrari allegedly did was hiding a breach of rules. DAS for example is not hiding anything, big difference. FIA should put all cards on the table, Ferrari comes across as cheaters and liars - its a slaughter house on neutral forums! All that talk from Binotto about Ferrari immediately switching to get more downforce and losing all power just after the technical directive made...

[jgonzalesm6]

What Ferrari allegedly did was hiding a breach of rules. DAS for example is not hiding anything, big difference. FIA should put all cards on the table, Ferrari comes across as cheaters and liars - its a slaughter house on neutral forums! All that talk from Binotto about Ferrari immediately switching to get more downforce and losing all power just after the technical directive made...


DAS (Mercedes) - wait till Oz, let's see if one of the teams "complains" to the Stewards about it.

Cheats in F1

2006 MonacoGP - Schumi stopped his car at La Rascasse.

2002 AustrianGP - Todt told Rubens to move over for Schumi for the win. Crowd boo-ed Schumi.

2005 San Marino - BAR banned for the next 2 races.

2009 Australian GP - Hamilton - Trulli "liegate"

2007 F1 season - "Spygate"

1994 F1 season - "traction control"

2010 GermanGP - team orders banned from F1

2009 F1 season - Brawn F1 "double decker diffuser"

2008 SingaporeGP - Piquet "ordered" to crash his car so Alonso got ahead of the safety car.

2017 F1 season - Mercedes and RedBull's FRIC system got banned



this is just a few and more "recent" "cheats" in F1.

[chinmay]

At least we now know that Ferrari's engine department does contain some bright minds. If Mercedes knew it, they would have done it too. To bypass the rules without getting caught easily is the work of clever minds.

[jgonzalesm6]

At least we now know that Ferrari's engine department does contain some bright minds. If Mercedes knew it, they would have done it too. To bypass the rules without getting caught easily is the work of clever minds.

+1

[ferrari1.8t]

DAS (Mercedes) - wait till Oz, let's see if one of the teams "complains" to the Stewards about it.

Cheats in F1

2006 MonacoGP - Schumi stopped his car at La Rascasse.

2002 AustrianGP - Todt told Rubens to move over for Schumi for the win. Crowd boo-ed Schumi.

2005 San Marino - BAR banned for the next 2 races.

2009 Australian GP - Hamilton - Trulli "liegate"

2007 F1 season - "Spygate"

1994 F1 season - "traction control"

2010 GermanGP - team orders banned from F1

2009 F1 season - Brawn F1 "double decker diffuser"

2008 SingaporeGP - Piquet "ordered" to crash his car so Alonso got ahead of the safety car.

2017 F1 season - Mercedes and RedBull's FRIC system got banned



this is just a few and more "recent" "cheats" in F1.

Add illegal secret tire test to your list - 0 repercussions for Merc with that one.

[tifosi1993]

Well done to Ferrari for trying. I hope they continue to explore the boundaries of the rule book and remain as aggressive as ever.

If rival teams and fans think we're cheating then so be it, let them cry as much as they want.

[tifosi1993]

Perhaps our cars are painted red for a reason other than it being the Italian racing colour........embarrassment, yet again!:-E:-??

There's nothing to be embarrassed about.

[FerrariF60]

There's nothing to be embarrassed about.

leave him alone....he's truly a troll....or a Merc fan....lololol

[alfa84]

No car have ever win without exploring the loopholes. Cheating is only when you get caught. Mercedes was the firt team to win pole positions with fuel from the turbo, then they invented oil burning. +1 to Ferrari, they won and didn't get caught

[Liscia]

How long have you been watching F1???


F1 teams have been "cheating" since the start of F1. I'm all for it BTW re: finding loopholes or "cheating"

If you ain't finding them, you're not trying hard enough.

[Liscia]

EXACTAMENTE!

[bondilad]

Considering what Ferrari had to put up with regarding our PU, like the FIA reveiling about our double battery system, having to run extra sensors, everyone trying to destabilise our team, im really glad for Ferrari for doing what they did.

They brought us 7 consecutive poles. I hope they bring something similar again this year and let others scratch their heads for a while.

[Brembo]

There's nothing to be embarrassed about.

The red is also due to the embarrassment from every interview Biotto gives! If Ferrari wins a race he will turn bright red knowing he said it wouldn't happen for a while , their just not ready.

[vcs316]

The red is also due to the embarrassment from every interview Biotto gives! If Ferrari wins a race he will turn bright red knowing he said it wouldn't happen for a while , their just not ready.

Wow, the amount of hate you have for Ferrari management, its drivers and the team is truly an embarrassment.

[nani_s23]

Wow, the amount of hate you have for Ferrari management, its drivers and the team is truly an embarrassment.

:clap

[Ferrarichamp]

Add illegal secret tire test to your list - 0 repercussions for Merc with that one.

yep, that's a big one because we all know how important tyres are in F1 performance. The double standards in this sport are quite spectacular.

[Kyss4k]

I don't care about if it's embarrassing or not, what matters though is, that it confirms that our engine was a beast because of this and the loss of speed since the US GP was not thanks to the added downforce. That means our engine is no longer special compared to Mercedes and we lost our only sizable advantage.

[ferenc_k]

I don't care about if it's embarrassing or not, what matters though is, that it confirms that our engine was a beast because of this and the loss of speed since the US GP was not thanks to the added downforce. That means our engine is no longer special compared to Mercedes and we lost our only sizable advantage.

We do not know what the engine for this season provides and what will do later. We just do not know.

Otherwise I really do not mind any settlement or even "cheating". Ferrari was trying to do something against the Mercedes domination. They failed, but at least tried. I am comfortable with it.

[wisepie]

Perhaps our cars are painted red for a reason other than it being the Italian racing colour........embarrassment, yet again!:-E:-??

Just to clarify my comment above, I am 100% a Ferrari tifoso (not a Merc troll which I find insulting) but still find it hard to swallow that we will be perceived as cheaters, not for the first time. All teams have tried to be inventive over the years, and surely IF the transgression had been that influential to our performance, why have the FIA allowed such a settlement, presumably a big fine for the team? It also might explain why our performance dropped off again towards the end of the 2019 season and our testing times for 2020 have been less than electrifying! I'm not sure whether to believe anything Binotto says now.:roll

[Kingdom Hearts]

You can say goodbye to any title this year.

[Tifoso Svedese]

FIA cheating/abusing power to help Mercedes again, nothing new.

[paolo lalli]

Ferrari were voted best engine manufactures in the world in 2019.There f1 engine was that good that it tormented all other teams to the point of having it investigated and then wound back.If Ferraris 2019 engine principle was in the 2020 chassis the Ferrari would totally dominate and blow mercedes of the park, ruining the Lewis Hamilton party for 7 titles and matching Micheal Schumacher. Ferrari are innovators the rest just copy and when they can't or don't know how they run to the fia.2021 will be a messy year Ferrari could just walk away if they walk f1 will be a distant memory as mercedes will walk also, leaving Dr Death Marko and red bull as the f1 town clowns.

[tifosi1993]

leave him alone....he's truly a troll....or a Merc fan....lololol

Umm...What!?

If you think @wisepie is a Merc fan or a troll, then you're very very wrong.

[SS454]

Having an engine seized is pretty bad and I think it's clear Ferrari were cheating. F1 and Motorsports in general is about finding loop holes and bending the rules, playing in the grey, whatever. But this was enough to force Ferrari to change their design, which supposedly has reduced power compared to last year. Even if it's a 20 hp drop, that is significant. If Merc has found 5-10 horsepower and is more efficient and driveable, well that's going to be a pretty big gap.

I personally find it hard to believe Mercedes hasn't been bending the rules in their engine department for some time. They have had some big advantages over Renault, Ferrari, and Honda for years. Ferrari had to cheat just to catch up. There are only so many places to find power with restricted fuel flow regulations.

[tifosi1993]

Just to clarify my comment above, I am 100% a Ferrari tifoso (not a Merc troll which I find insulting) but still find it hard to swallow that we will be perceived as cheaters, not for the first time. All teams have tried to be inventive over the years, and surely IF the transgression had been that influential to our performance, why have the FIA allowed such a settlement, presumably a big fine for the team? It also might explain why our performance dropped off again towards the end of the 2019 season and our testing times for 2020 have been less than electrifying! I'm not sure whether to believe anything Binotto says now.:roll

Here's my simple take: what Ferrari did was technically legal, but against the spirit of the regulations. The "settlement" is Ferrari agreeing with FIA not to use it again.
I think some of us need to calm down and stop making mountain out of a molehill. Our PU wasn't illegal, otherwise the FIA would have said so. It very well may have been in the grey area and disclosing that secret would mean disclosing the technical aspects of the PU.

[paolo lalli]

Well said simple and to the point.

[TTRSMAD]

I think Ferrari were sandbagging during this test not to show their hand. Trap speed is not the end all be all. Remember Vettel with Red Bull almost never had the best top speed but the car was amazing in the corners because of the blown diffuser.

They might not be faster than Mercedes but they need to keep them guessing not for them to move resources to the 2021 project.

If Mercedes knows the exact performance of our car, they can access how much time for us to catch them and divert the teams of engineers to next year. Its a game of cat and mouse.

[paolo lalli]

Ferrari did a deal with the fia that equals a settlement. What Ferrari had was not right nor wrong but the fia in confidence with Ferrari have shut it down.,basicly it was that clever they showed the fia.In return the pu secret remains.The problem is that nosy teams will not just go away and will stop at nothing in finding out the loop hole that was shut down.Bad luck I say the Ferrari engine will match mercedes in strait line speed come business day.

[tifosi1993]

Having an engine seized is pretty bad and I think it's clear Ferrari were cheating. F1 and Motorsports in general is about finding loop holes and bending the rules, playing in the grey, whatever. But this was enough to force Ferrari to change their design, which supposedly has reduced power compared to last year. Even if it's a 20 hp drop, that is significant. If Merc has found 5-10 horsepower and is more efficient and driveable, well that's going to be a pretty big gap.

I personally find it hard to believe Mercedes hasn't been bending the rules in their engine department for some time. They have had some big advantages over Renault, Ferrari, and Honda for years. Ferrari had to cheat just to catch up. There are only so many places to find power with restricted fuel flow regulations.

And where's your evidence of Ferrari PU lacking power compared to other manufacturers. I mean Brazil was prime example, Mercedes had considerable pace advantage over Ferrari at that race and Bottas, even with 2 DRS zone couldn't overtake Charles. Abu Dhabi was another example, where Leclerc blasted past Verstappen at the start of the GP. Sure later Verstappen got past Leclerc, with DRS, but that was mainly due to Ferrari chewing up its tyres and giving away 6-7 tenths per lap in the last sector.

And I have followed the second test quite closely, both Alfa and Haas had reached the highest top speed. And Leclerc, during his race sim, was consistently reaching 290+ at the main straight. (297 was highest without DRS)
And when he overtook Kvyat and Raikkonen at the early phase of his race sim with DRS, his top speed was 320 kph, which was 15-17 kph more than what he achieved during his qualy sim run with DRS.

So overall, there's absolutely no conclusive data out there that suggest, last year's or this year's Ferrari PU lacks power.

(ps. I should add that Ferrari PU's main advantage wasn't it's top speed, it was more about the sheer acceleration/boost it achieved at specific speed)

[Smintlemon]

And where's your evidence of Ferrari PU lacking power compared to other manufacturers. I mean Brazil was prime example, Mercedes had considerable pace advantage over Ferrari at that race and Bottas, even with 2 DRS zone couldn't overtake Charles. Abu Dhabi was another example, where Leclerc blasted past Verstappen at the start of the GP. Sure later Verstappen got past Leclerc, with DRS, but that was mainly due to Ferrari chewing up its tyres and giving away 6-7 tenths per lap in the last sector.

And I have followed the second test quite closely, both Alfa and Haas had reached the highest top speed. And Leclerc, during his race sim, was consistently reaching 290+ at the main straight. (297 was highest without DRS)
And when he overtook Kvyat and Raikkonen at the early phase of his race sim with DRS, his top speed was 320 kph, which was 15-17 kph more than what he achieved during his qualy sim run with DRS.

So overall, there's absolutely no conclusive data out there that suggest, last year's or this year's Ferrari PU lacks power.

(ps. I should add that Ferrari PU's main advantage wasn't it's top speed, it was more about the sheer acceleration/boost it achieved at specific speed)


https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-ferrari-accordo-fia-sui-motori-una-vittoria-di-binotto/4703563/

[Smintlemon]

Let's find out what emerges from the press release issued yesterday by the FIA ​​on the surprise agreement signed with Ferrari. It is not so much the sponge blow on the past as the role change that concerns the present and the future of the Scuderia in the relationship with the legislator. Mercedes and Red Bull did not like it. Not at all ...


The press release issued by the FIA ​​late yesterday afternoon had the effect of a bomb. The team leaders had already left the Barcelona paddock when the news spread. The FIA ​​has declared the "war" on the Ferrari engine closed, which has sparked many controversies especially at the end of last year.


A very confidential agreement, the contents of which will remain secret outside the parties, was signed after the International Federation sanctioned the closure of the investigation into the Cavallino's power unit. The evil ones claim that the sponge stroke served to cover a controversial and controversial phase of last year.


We wanted to draw a line on the past to build a new relationship from scratch, based on collaboration between the parties.


"The FIA ​​and Scuderia Ferrari have agreed on a series of technical commitments - it was written in the press release - which will improve the monitoring of all the power units in the next championships, as well as supporting the Federation in other regulatory aspects in Formula 1 and in its activities of research on reducing carbon emissions and introducing sustainable fuels ".


And those who think badly immediately hinted that it happened as when a government asks for help from a hacker to prevent his computer systems from being violated.


We do not share this vision, because the Scuderia will be in the front row in the study of the 2025 F1 engine that could become the laboratory for the Automotive in the transition phase that the world of auto traction will have to endure while waiting for an electrical network capable to satisfy green mobility with zero emissions.


There is also the idea of ​​relaunching the diesel, coming out of the demonization that was made by the case that had hit the VW. The F1 could look to a power unit with a higher prevalence of the hybrid and it is not said that alternative fuels can be studied to reduce emissions.


But the FIA-Ferrari agreement that made Mercedes and Red Bull and more, open up an important window also on the present. Mattia Binotto did not hesitate to "postpone" the performance of the SF1000 ("I would give a rating of less than 6") to lash the team right now that together with Louis Camilleri has won a political game that will have a great weight on the 2020 season.


For the first time, Ferrari has adopted the same tactic on the engine that James Allison played for the approval of the DAS. The Cavallino technicians wrote a series of letters to Nicholas Tombazis on the use of the power unit and the intercooler in which all the doubts regarding the interpretations of the gray areas of the regulation were clarified and obtaining all the authorizations to start a season without the continuous ballet of controversy that characterized the last world championship.


It is not the first point scored by the Camilleri-Binotto couple, given that last year the Cavallino team had reached an economic agreement with FOM for the renewal of the Agreement of Concordia 2021-25, securing 38% of the prizes fixed. Found the square with Liberty, it was necessary to do it also with the FIA.


The Scuderia, therefore, intends to confirm the motor supremacy despite the Federation has intensified the checks with the introduction of a second flow meter to check the instantaneous consumption of petrol in real time.


And we would not be surprised at all if the power unit that was mounted on the SF1000 in the Barcelona tests was only an "embryonic" form of the 065 that maybe we will see later.


Of course we cannot expect "... a second of engine" as Toto Wolff said provocatively, after Brackley's technicians have pointed out to him with the GPS surveys the low maximum speeds of the Red, but the Cavallino fans can hope for a noticeable reduction in the gap of the SF1000 from the silver arrow.


Binotto knows he has an ace to play and has seen how Mercedes is struggling to hold the game in the delicate field of the power unit (5 engines broken in its test sessions), so it pushes Maranello technicians to evolve quickly the Red.


The SF1000 was not born badly because it is already better than the SF90, but perhaps David Sanchez, head of the aerodynamics, had exaggerated last year in search of speed at the speed trap, while now he has focused too much on cornering, finding himself with a exaggerated resistance to advance which creates a sort of "wall" on the straight.


The increased engine power will partially reduce the negative effects, but Ferrari has immediately launched the design of an SF1000 B that p

[jgonzalesm6]

Here's my simple take: what Ferrari did was technically legal, but against the spirit of the regulations. The "settlement" is Ferrari agreeing with FIA not to use it again.
I think some of us need to calm down and stop making mountain out of a molehill. Our PU wasn't illegal, otherwise the FIA would have said so. It very well may have been in the grey area and disclosing that secret would mean disclosing the technical aspects of the PU.


Ferrari did a deal with the fia that equals a settlement. What Ferrari had was not right nor wrong but the fia in confidence with Ferrari have shut it down.,basicly it was that clever they showed the fia.In return the pu secret remains.The problem is that nosy teams will not just go away and will stop at nothing in finding out the loop hole that was shut down.Bad luck I say the Ferrari engine will match mercedes in strait line speed come business day.

Jean Todt is President of the FIA.

Nicolas Todt (son of Jean Todt) manages Charles Leclerc (Ferrari)

Jean Todt use to work with Brawn, Bryne, during the Schumacher years with Ferrari during their dominance.

This "settlement" with Ferrari and the FIA and that "it remain between the parties" is deeper and somewhat "personal" between Todt and Ferrari.

[SS454]

And where's your evidence of Ferrari PU lacking power compared to other manufacturers. I mean Brazil was prime example, Mercedes had considerable pace advantage over Ferrari at that race and Bottas, even with 2 DRS zone couldn't overtake Charles. Abu Dhabi was another example, where Leclerc blasted past Verstappen at the start of the GP. Sure later Verstappen got past Leclerc, with DRS, but that was mainly due to Ferrari chewing up its tyres and giving away 6-7 tenths per lap in the last sector.

And I have followed the second test quite closely, both Alfa and Haas had reached the highest top speed. And Leclerc, during his race sim, was consistently reaching 290+ at the main straight. (297 was highest without DRS)
And when he overtook Kvyat and Raikkonen at the early phase of his race sim with DRS, his top speed was 320 kph, which was 15-17 kph more than what he achieved during his qualy sim run with DRS.

So overall, there's absolutely no conclusive data out there that suggest, last year's or this year's Ferrari PU lacks power.

(ps. I should add that Ferrari PU's main advantage wasn't it's top speed, it was more about the sheer acceleration/boost it achieved at specific speed)

Ferrari slower in the speed traps in relation to others (how much sand bagging is going on, who knows), and Binotto saying 2020 engine is less power than 2019. Mercedes saying they have more power this year. If this is all true, then that is a big concern.

[Brembo]

Wow, the amount of hate you have for Ferrari management, its drivers and the team is truly an embarrassment.

I'm OK with Charles and I believe he can win with a car that's up there. No one is worse than Binotto as far as talking bad about Ferrari's future. Imagine showing up for work and your boss tells you, " Were gonna lose!" The amount of hate you have for some folks here is :rotfl is an embarrassment , namely that Brembo name!:lol You should stick to posting pages of info from the many F-1 sights that most fans already read but you get an E for effort! The word hate is all over you , calm down!! Your liable to get other members to go along with you on the hatred although for the most part most members are too smart to fall into that " Hate " that you profess . Charles , Max. Lewis will make this year great to follow!! I.m also watching and hoping Gio can get to Ferrari in the near future. The best to you always.

[FerrariF60]

Ferrari slower in the speed traps in relation to others (how much sand bagging is going on, who knows), and Binotto saying 2020 engine is less power than 2019. Mercedes saying they have more power this year. If this is all true, then that is a big concern.

the merc may have more power then 2019.....but how reliable is it?? merc already had 5 failures across the board.....

and as far as binotto's comments about 2020 engine having less power.....it's all head games mate and a poker face....that's all....

i can't wait for the season to start adn one of our boys will grab POLE....

[darkchild]

Damn, not good. Motorsport - Total reports whistleblowers told FIA/other teams what is happening.

[Alakshendra]

Can anyone explain is this positive or negative, i am a bit confused about below article

http://scuderiafans.com/ferrari-the-fia-agreement-on-engines-is-considered-a-strategic-victory-for-mattia-binotto/

[stefa]

Jean Todt is President of the FIA.

Nicolas Todt (son of Jean Todt) manages Charles Leclerc (Ferrari)

Jean Todt use to work with Brawn, Bryne, during the Schumacher years with Ferrari during their dominance.

This "settlement" with Ferrari and the FIA and that "it remain between the parties" is deeper and somewhat "personal" between Todt and Ferrari.

I remember when JT left Ferrari and become FIA president, and I was thinking this is great! It is ex Ferrari employ and it will bring only good in the future as it is "our" man in the high castle. For the record I was not expecting JT will push Ferrari and always have one eye closed if Ferrari is doing something in gray area or even not legal, but to have some old love for the reds. But I was deceived. He is haveing some big grunge over Ferrari, for the reasons not known to me....

[jgonzalesm6]

I remember when JT left Ferrari and become FIA president, and I was thinking this is great! It is ex Ferrari employ and it will bring only good in the future as it is "our" man in the high castle. For the record I was not expecting JT will push Ferrari and always have one eye closed if Ferrari is doing something in gray area or even not legal, but to have some old love for the reds. But I was deceived. He is haveing some big grunge over Ferrari, for the reasons not known to me....

We got "lucky" with the settlement. Had it been anyone else other than JT, the penalty would have been alot harsher and possibly more transparent IMO.

JT is president of the FIA, so he has to find a "middle-ground" with Ferrari regarding how he deals with Ferrari and how it transcends to the media and public regarding the findings of the 2019 engine.

[nani_s23]

We got "lucky" with the settlement. Had it been anyone else other than JT, the penalty would have been alot harsher and possibly more transparent IMO.

JT is president of the FIA, so he has to find a "middle-ground" with Ferrari regarding how he deals with Ferrari and how it transcends to the media and public regarding the findings of the 2019 engine.

In turn ferrari is giving all the liberty to FIA. They are getting much revenue due to ferrari existence in the sport, if not no one would have watched F1.

[bondilad]

It is highly possible the FIA couldn't prove that Ferrari did any thing wrong last year and just want to bury this issue and move on. After all, the engineers at teams are a lot clever than the ones at FIA.

[wisepie]

Umm...What!?

If you think @wisepie is a Merc fan or a troll, then you're very very wrong.

Thank you for your vote of confidence, tifosi, and having been a tifoso of Ferrari since 1967 without ever giving up, winning or losing, to suggest that I would support Mercedes and Hamilton is outrageous!;-)

[ferenc_k]

It is highly possible the FIA couldn't prove that Ferrari did any thing wrong last year and just want to bury this issue and move on. After all, the engineers at teams are a lot clever than the ones at FIA.

This.

They (FIA) could face a long legal battle possibly if not 10000% provable.
This is why this agreement is reached.

[Kingdom Hearts]

It is highly possible the FIA couldn't prove that Ferrari did any thing wrong last year and just want to bury this issue and move on. After all, the engineers at teams are a lot clever than the ones at FIA.

Ferrari did nothing wrong but yet they are happy with this undisclosed agreement and having to endure the public shame. IF you read all the info out there, is clear that Ferrari did something against the rules. Even Binotto said this year engine is worse than last year.

[SilverSpeed]

Damn, not good. Motorsport - Total reports whistleblowers told FIA/other teams what is happening.

Yeah a dutch F1 news site also said some Ferrari employees told the FIA some stuff.
Sack those people, you don't see this stuff happening with Mercedes or Ted Bull.

[Kyss4k]

I am now reading, that Ferrari confirmed the engine is not as powerfull, as the engine from last season...

[jgonzalesm6]

Damn, not good. Motorsport - Total reports whistleblowers told FIA/other teams what is happening.


Yeah a dutch F1 news site also said some Ferrari employees told the FIA some stuff.
Sack those people, you don't see this stuff happening with Mercedes or Ted Bull.

Post a link??


I am now reading, that Ferrari confirmed the engine is not as powerfull, as the engine from last season...

yep. Autosport posted an article as well.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/148501/ferrari-2020-engine-not-as-strong-against-rivals

[RM-Ferrari]

:-s

http://scuderiafans.com/someone-inside-ferrari-leaked-the-information-about-the-power-unit-leo-turrini/

[jgonzalesm6]

:-s

http://scuderiafans.com/someone-inside-ferrari-leaked-the-information-about-the-power-unit-leo-turrini/


Okay.....thanks

Turrini :-E :Hmm

I'm gonna wait and pass judgement till more "reputable" sources post this "news."

[TTRSMAD]

If this is true, they better find this mole before he gives more of Ferrari secrets. This reminds me of the Mclaren spygate but to the FIA. Why are people so disloyal? Money?

[jgonzalesm6]

If this is true, they better find this mole before he gives more of Ferrari secrets. This reminds me of the Mclaren spygate but to the FIA. Why are people so disloyal? Money?

IF the story is true, could be a disgruntled employee maybe??

[paolo lalli]

Italians are famous turning on each other when some one gets punted.Aways a rort is not a rort if you are part of the rort.Appears that some disgruntled ex employee has spilled his guts and sunk the ship.

[tifosi1993]

Now there's a rumor going on that the so called "whistleblower" didn't go to the FIA directly, instead reported to a rival team. If that's true then it is a textbook corporate espionage, aka spygate 2.0.

[zamlatuljko]

Now there's a rumor going on that the so called "whistleblower" didn't go to the FIA directly, instead reported to a rival team. If that's true then it is a textbook corporate espionage, aka spygate 2.0.

He stated, that Ferrari has a whistleblower in its team, which provided the infos about the power unit. The problem is, that the whistleblower reported to a different team, not to the fia directly! This could have very big consequences for the team which received the informations. The only teams that come to question are Mercedes and Red Bull.

Is this the start of spygate 2.0? If Mercedes is again involved in a spy scandal, like in 2007 with McLaren, could this be the end for the Mercedes F1 program?

RB got the information from Mercedes. I remember AMuS writing something about that in the past. Mercedes were the ones working this whole thing out, they just let RB do the complain in public for some reason

So possible scenario
Merc have spy in ferrari but didnt want to intervene so they decide to pass info to rb and proffesional sheet stirrer pr from RB...

[Greig]

Not sure it would be the same as spygate if the other team just directly told the FIA, not quite the same as what McLaren did.

Must be someone quite high up that gave the info.

[jgonzalesm6]

Not sure it would be the same as spygate if the other team just directly told the FIA, not quite the same as what McLaren did.

Must be someone quite high up that gave the info.

Spygate: McLaren didn't steal anything in 2007; it was Ferrari employee Nigel Stepney who stole the Ferrari information. Ferrari employee Stepney then gave the stolen information to McLaren; their fine was for possessing stolen Ferrari information. They didn't ask Stepney to steal it; he stole it first, then shopped it around, and McLaren employee Mike Coughlan took him up, figuring he could use the Ferrari information to enhance his position within McLaren.

[Greig]

Spygate: McLaren didn't steal anything in 2007; it was Ferrari employee Nigel Stepney who stole the Ferrari information. Ferrari employee Stepney then gave the stolen information to McLaren; their fine was for possessing stolen Ferrari information. They didn't ask Stepney to steal it; he stole it first, then shopped it around, and McLaren employee Mike Coughlan took him up, figuring he could use the Ferrari information to enhance his position within McLaren.

I know what spygate was thanks, McLaren used the stolen information. That is not the case here.

[Super M]

Things are heating up i see........Lets see if this does happen :Hmm

http://scuderiafans.com/mercedes-wants-fia-to-reveal-ferrari-engine-details/?fbclid=IwAR3zmtA51n-9UaP5tdGVH3KuGhE-m0pPr2Vs4Jmg9Rv9BgFQctpk1IrA-O8

[paolo lalli]

Fia has a wolf on its door steps.The wolf is not happy.0

[Greig]

Imagine the FIA done this deal with Merc or Red Bull lol can only imagine the forum posts...those same people seem happy enough that FIA are covering up for us though :-D

[Super M]

Imagine the FIA done this deal with Merc or Red Bull lol can only imagine the forum posts...those same people seem happy enough that FIA are covering up for us though :-D


What i would like to know, Did we cheat or not ? ( Somehow i don't think we'll be privy to that info )

If the same was said about another team, then i bet your bottom dollar we'd want to know what the agreements were, yes ?

I just hope that we're clean and we won't be seen in the pits or media as " possible cheats " because of this agreement

[TTRSMAD]

Now why would Mercedes try an expose Ferrari last year when they won both championships? Some kind of tug of war behind the scenes. Mercedes trying to find out about our engine lay out.

Ferrari is not a open book for other teams to see. Mercedes wants to destroy Ferrari so it can be the favorite of the FIA.

[Ferrarichamp]

Imagine the FIA done this deal with Merc or Red Bull lol can only imagine the forum posts...those same people seem happy enough that FIA are covering up for us though :-D

I'm pretty sure the FIA have covered up a lot for Mercedes over the years. Secret tyre testing is probably the tip of the iceberg.

[Greig]

This has frustrated seven of their rival teams (McLaren, Mercedes, Racing Point, Red Bull, Renault, AlphaTauri and Williams) who want answers. The septet, which did not include Ferrari engine customers Haas and Alfa Romeo, released a joint statement on Wednesday morning.

“We, the undersigned teams, were surprised and shocked by the FIA’s statement of Friday 28 February regarding the conclusion of its investigation into the Scuderia Ferrari Formula 1 Power Unit,” it read. “An international sporting regulator has the responsibility to act with the highest standards of governance, integrity and transparency.

“After months of investigations that were undertaken by the FIA only following queries raised by other teams, we strongly object to the FIA reaching a confidential settlement agreement with Ferrari to conclude this matter. Therefore, we hereby state publicly our shared commitment to pursue full and proper disclosure in this matter, to ensure that our sport treats all competitors fairly and equally. We do so on behalf of the fans, the participants and the stakeholders of Formula One.

“In addition, we reserve our rights to seek legal redress, within the FIA’s due process and before the competent courts.”

[Greig]

I'm pretty sure the FIA have covered up a lot for Mercedes over the years. Secret tyre testing is probably the tip of the iceberg.

Pretty sure we have never seen such a deal being done, I can't ever recall such a thing happening. To me it looks like we cheated but the FIA did not want to call out one of the biggest teams for the good of the sport.

But we can off course just pretend the FIA covers up for others....

[tifosi1993]

I can see why other teams lodged protest, there need to be some transparency regarding the Ferrari power unit, it is quite a big deal after all.

But still I refuse to believe that a team like Ferrari deliberately cheated with the fuel flow system, I think they just found out a grey area on the rule book regarding the fuel flow sensors and applied it to the power unit.

[Kyss4k]

I can see why other teams lodged protest, there need to be some transparency regarding the Ferrari power unit, it is quite a big deal after all.

But still I refuse to believe that a team like Ferrari deliberately cheated with the fuel flow system, I think they just found out a grey area on the rule book regarding the fuel flow sensors and applied it to the power unit.

The way Binotto is still saying we lost the top speed due to the aerodynamic upgrades, even though it's quite clear to everyone (even the other teams) that that's not the case and the reason is that the engine has been changed is not filling me with confidence...

[tifosi1993]

Now why would Mercedes try an expose Ferrari last year when they won both championships? Some kind of tug of war behind the scenes. Mercedes trying to find out about our engine lay out.

Ferrari is not a open book for other teams to see. Mercedes wants to destroy Ferrari so it can be the favorite of the FIA.

It's not about "exposing Ferrari", it's about transparency. And every other team bar Ferrari and it's customers teams have lodged protest and threatening to go to the court, I can see why they are angry.
If the roles were reversed and if it was Mercedes instead of Ferrari, pretty much everyone here right now would be crying about Mercedes being cheaters and so on...

[tifosi1993]

The way Binotto is still saying we lost the top speed due to the aerodynamic upgrades, even though it's quite clear to everyone (even the other teams) that that's not the case and the reason is that the engine has been changed is not filling me with confidence...

Well....you, me and everyone else will soon find out our true performance. If the Ferrari PU ends up behind not only Mercedes but other manufacturers as well, then it's safe to say they've been doing something naughty with the fuel flow sensors and tried to hush it up by reaching a settlement with the FIA.

But I've followed the timings quite closely during the pre season testing, and from what I saw, I'm not worried about our engine performance.

[PURE PASSION]

This thing is very bad for both other teams (they rightly request transparency on the matter because it leaves so many question marks about Ferrari's legality)and Ferrari because for the same reasons it hurts teams image a lot (it's not a small thing half of f1 world to call you cheater ).
The big question is why F1 treated the hall situation like this in the 1st place???!!! For sure they couldn't expect other teams to expect it easily!!!!???????

[Nick Singer]

Too much to hope this will hasten the demise of this once great formula.

The pinnacle of motorsport should be pretty much 'no holds barred', not the predictable, saccharine media-luvviefest that it's become, dripping in political correctness and virtue-signalling - oh, and vacuous 'celebrities', whose interest in motorsport lasts until the last vol-au-vent and glass of bubbly has disappeared and the cameras have gone..

Let the media work itself into a frenzy over the joke that is Formula E.

[Ferrarichamp]

Pretty sure we have never seen such a deal being done, I can't ever recall such a thing happening. To me it looks like we cheated but the FIA did not want to call out one of the biggest teams for the good of the sport.

But we can off course just pretend the FIA covers up for others....

Mercedes cheated with illegal tyre testing, that much we know, it's not pretending. As I recall, all they got was a slap on the wrist. It's only logical to assume that if they cheat with tyre testing, chances are high that they also cheat in other departments. The FIA are not dumb, they know this.

[Lesky]

Ferrari rivals ‘strongly object’ to FIA settlement

Ferrari’s rivals are threatening legal action over the FIA’s undisclosed agreement with the Scuderia regarding last year’s engine controversy.

Last year Ferrari’s rivals questioned the legality of the Scuderia’s power unit.

This led to several Technical Directives being issued by the FIA relating to fuel flow.

The teams were also informed that an extra sensor would be used in 2020.

The matter rumbled on without any decisive ruling from motorsport’s governing body on whether Ferrari’s engine was legal or not.

The FIA swept it all under the carpet last week when it announced a settlement with Ferrari.

hat that settlement related to and why the FIA agreed to it have not been disclosed.

Ferrari’s rivals are livid and have threatened legal action.

Seven of the 10 teams; McLaren, Mercedes, Racing Point, Red Bull, Renault, AlphaTauri and Williams; have written to the FIA demanding an explanation.

The letter read:

“We, the undersigned teams, were surprised and shocked by the FIA’s statement of Friday 28 February regarding the conclusion of its investigation into the Scuderia Ferrari Formula 1 Power Unit.

“An international sporting regulator has the responsibility to act with the highest standards of governance, integrity and transparency.

“After months of investigations that were undertaken by the FIA only following queries raised by other teams, we strongly object to the FIA reaching a confidential settlement agreement with Ferrari to conclude this matter.

“Therefore, we hereby state publicly our shared commitment to pursue full and proper disclosure in this matter, to ensure that our sport treats all competitors fairly and equally. We do so on behalf of the fans, the participants and the stakeholders of Formula One.

“In addition, we reserve our rights to seek legal redress, within the FIA’s due process and before the competent courts.”

[Lesky]

The other teams should have lodged an official protest, that would have saved us a lot of this nonsense...protest to the FIA instead of mouthing off accusations in the media! If there would have been an official protest from other teams, the FIA would have been required to announce the results officially, so this situation could not have happened.

[ferrari1.8t]

This whole situation is contradictory. If the FIA were in our pocket as rival fans and teams seem to believe, why would they send out that press release? According to the article below, none of the teams were aware of the investigation. Thus, if the FIA wanted to save face, why release anything? They could have just as easily kept quiet. If they really had Ferrari's interests in mind they wouldn't have said anything. I think its the opposite, the release came to stir this controversy against Ferrari. Think about it; did the FIA really believe the rival teams would accept the release and move on? That is hard to believe. This was deliberate, another attempt to undermine and devalue Ferrari's presence in F1.

With that said, I am disappointed if Ferrari did cheat. As bad as I want us to win a championship, not in this manner. I am hoping for another release from either Ferrari or the FIA exonerating us from any wrong doing. Like we found a grey area or loophole that the FIA didn't like, but it wasn't technically cheating. Fingers crossed.

https://www.espn.com/f1/story/_/id/28826857/the-fia-investigation-ferrari-raised-more-questions-answers

[nani_s23]

Good heat going into this season.

Now this has become Ferrari VS rest of all team & FIA.

In my view, this is to destabilise Ferrari history & revenue in F1.
Ferrari should be politically strong enough to counter this act from bunch of fools (F1 teams).

Haas already threatened to leave F1, if they don’t find good results this season. They haven’t signed any agreement on future participation in F1.
It’s time for Ferrari to push their forces & corner FIA. So that every team will shut their things, especially RB.

[Greig]

Mercedes cheated with illegal tyre testing, that much we know, it's not pretending. As I recall, all they got was a slap on the wrist. It's only logical to assume that if they cheat with tyre testing, chances are high that they also cheat in other departments. The FIA are not dumb, they know this.

As I said you can pretend all you like.

[SilverSpeed]

All other teams have put up the same news on their mainpage.
Pressure is mounting, this cannot be good for F1.

[From Treviso]

teams are always pushing greys areas, such as the flexing wings, etc - it's never cheating until it's blantly obvious or exceeds the legal parameters. There's a possibility that Ferrari were close but did not exceed any parameters, or it could even mean that exposing any legal innovation used by Ferrari would mean the team would lose its edge, as the others would be able to implement the feature. If they were caught red-handed, then FIA had a duty to disclose its findings. The last possibility: FIA have been intimidated by Ferrari's status and are not prepared to jeopardise the sport. As for the engine having less grunt than last year's? It would be easy for Ferari to use this statement to get the other manufacturers off its back - when the Ferrari will have a lower top speed advantage, then it will say "see, that is proof!" But we all know more aero means a lower top speed, so it plays into Ferrari's smoke screen excuse.

[SS454]

To me it sounds like Ferrari got caught cheating. Maybe it fell into the grey area, but in any case they were forced to change. The FIA handled it like crap, and I don't blame any of the teams for complaining.

However, I would like to see Mercedes, Honda, and Renault have their cars completely dismantled and inspected to ensure their cars are 100% legal. Mercedes did the oil burning deal, and I don't recall their engine's ever being seized by the FIA for a full inspection.

[Lesky]

What would have happened if Red Bull for example had protested officially and were wrong? Would Red Bull have suffered any consequences? (hypothetical question)

[paolo lalli]

Fi is about pushing the limits of rules and design ,let's say bend the rules but do not break them.All teams have this mentle platform in creating that edge that advantage.Now all of a sudden f1 is sterile .All teams meddling in this settlement saga should really take a good look in there own f1 closets. Mercedes being the biggest contradictors that exist.

[Ferrari312T4]

To me it sounds like Ferrari got caught cheating. Maybe it fell into the grey area, but in any case they were forced to change. The FIA handled it like crap, and I don't blame any of the teams for complaining.

However, I would like to see Mercedes, Honda, and Renault have their cars completely dismantled and inspected to ensure their cars are 100% legal. Mercedes did the oil burning deal, and I don't recall their engine's ever being seized by the FIA for a full inspection.

Indeed, I am tired of this Ferrari witch hunt, while Mercedes is being treated with velvet gloves all the time. They had some slaps on the wrist before. They should be the last to complain.

[FF1]

What I am worried is that other teams will mount pressure and Ferrari will get distracted and hamper their performance and in the meantime other teams will develop their car and be competitive

[Tony]

Not sure about the espionage thing, the source was Turrini and he even mentioned he didn't have solid evidence, more of a gut feeling.

[Silent Bob]

If the FIA was 100% sure Ferrari were deliberately cheating, then they would have come out and said it. They have never shied away or been timid about fining or punishing teams that have been caught cheating. As it stands, the only explanation is that the FIA is not 100% sure that what Ferrari were doing was illegal and are covering their tracks as well as ensuring Ferrari doesn't use the system further. I agree that this statement is so ambiguous that it makes Ferrari look bad because it doesn't exonerate them. A better detailed statement should be issued and the FIA should clarify this matter whether the outcome is good or bad for us.

[Nando]

Good article on the current situation....

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/fia-ferrari-settlement-rules/4716688/

[paolo lalli]

Dr Death Marko wants 2nd place taken away from Ferrari and given to redbull.

[FerrariF60]

Dr Death Marko wants 2nd place taken away from Ferrari and given to redbull.

HA, HA....good one Marko.....that'll never happen

[nani_s23]

Dr Death Marko wants 2nd place taken away from Ferrari and given to redbull.

Glad that he didn't ask his sister team to be in 3rd place.

[nani_s23]

From 2017 whenever ferrari started to build strong car, controversy is making around almost every season. 2017 (flexi wing) 2018 (Oil burning) 2019 (Dual Battery & Engine).
I appreciate that ferrari trying to find loop holes & getting out with something. On the other hand FIA were light hearted on Mercs & whenever controversy surrounds their team FIA comes out and says it as legal.
What happened to FRIIC suspension, by the time it was banned mercs won 3 titles. What would FIA say on this?
Now its DAS, they say its legal for this season & not for the next season what a comedy show ?

From past i've been saying the same thing, current ferrari management isn't strong enough to fight with FIA & defend their position.

[Ferrarichamp]

As I said you can pretend all you like.

And you can keep pretending all you like that Mercedes never got caught cheating while escaping punishment. Facts will remain facts.

[paolo lalli]

They got caught alright those richous *******.

[RicRac]

This whole thing is Embarrassing to say the least.. we actually need to know one thing and one thing only. Did Ferrari Cheat!!?! As a Fan of the sport and Ferrari my heart tells me no, but my head tells me yes

[trim reaper]

Breaking news on “planet f1” that toto triggered the complaint,think we all knew anyway but been confirmed,Helmut also wants $24 compensation and p2

[chinmay]

This whole thing is Embarrassing to say the least.. we actually need to know one thing and one thing only. Did Ferrari Cheat!!?! As a Fan of the sport and Ferrari my heart tells me no, but my head tells me yes

No, it is not embarrassing at all. Ferrari developed an innovative solution which completely baffled hybrid engine master Mercedes' Andy Cowell and co. Even FIA with all it's monitoring doesn't have a clue what Ferrari is doing, after their rigorous analysis, they couldn't prove that Ferrari cheated otherwise they would have said it clearly. They had their doubts but no conclusion which is why they had to do a settlement.

Ferrari engine department deserves a standing ovation. After a long long time, a team has come up with a solution which others can't even copy and also get rattled day in and day out.

[tifosi1993]

From 2017 whenever ferrari started to build strong car, controversy is making around almost every season. 2017 (flexi wing) 2018 (Oil burning) 2019 (Dual Battery & Engine).
I appreciate that ferrari trying to find loop holes & getting out with something. On the other hand FIA were light hearted on Mercs & whenever controversy surrounds their team FIA comes out and says it as legal.
What happened to FRIIC suspension, by the time it was banned mercs won 3 titles. What would FIA say on this?
Now its DAS, they say its legal for this season & not for the next season what a comedy show ?

From past i've been saying the same thing, current ferrari management isn't strong enough to fight with FIA & defend their position.

Pretty much on point. Ever since LDM's purge to make the team more 'italian', Ferrari have been nothing but a toothless tiger.
One of the prime example: 2011 blown diffuser fiasco. It was agreed that, starting from British GP the blown diffuser effect would get reduced by 90%, and there was no objection from any team whatsoever. But after Alonso dominated Silverstone and when both Red Bull and Mclaren got hammered, both of them cried to the FIA. And Ferrari, "for the good of the sport", decided to go back to the old blown diffuser system. Then there was the amount of rule breaking Red Bull did in 2012, I remember they were forced to change their illegal suspension system on Vettel's car under the parc ferme, but again Ferrari didn't protest, "for the good of the sport" obviously.

The old Todt-Brawn era ruthlessness came back when Sergio Marchionne took the helm. But unfortunately, his reign was short, and Ferrari under the current management, have gone back to the LDM-Domenicalli era "smile nice in font of the media" practice.

[Aziz]

Pretty much on point. Ever since LDM's purge to make the team more 'italian', Ferrari have been nothing but a toothless tiger.
One of the prime example: 2011 blown diffuser fiasco. It was agreed that, starting from British GP the blown diffuser effect would get reduced by 90%, and there was no objection from any team whatsoever. But after Alonso dominated Silverstone and when both Red Bull and Mclaren got hammered, both of them cried to the FIA. And Ferrari, "for the good of the sport", decided to go back to the old blown diffuser system. Then there was the amount of rule breaking Red Bull did in 2012, I remember they were forced to change their illegal suspension system on Vettel's car under the parc ferme, but again Ferrari didn't protest, "for the good of the sport" obviously.

The old Todt-Brawn era ruthlessness came back when Sergio Marchionne took the helm. But unfortunately, his reign was short, and Ferrari under the current management, have gone back to the LDM-Domenicalli era "smile nice in font of the media" practice.

Binotto has written to the employees of the Racing Department (he usually does). He thanked everyone for their efforts during testing, noting that the car won't be fast enough to challenge for victory in Australia yet,but he hopes that there will be a quick reaction from everyone......Motosport_IT

[nani_s23]

Pretty much on point. Ever since LDM's purge to make the team more 'italian', Ferrari have been nothing but a toothless tiger.
One of the prime example: 2011 blown diffuser fiasco. It was agreed that, starting from British GP the blown diffuser effect would get reduced by 90%, and there was no objection from any team whatsoever. But after Alonso dominated Silverstone and when both Red Bull and Mclaren got hammered, both of them cried to the FIA. And Ferrari, "for the good of the sport", decided to go back to the old blown diffuser system. Then there was the amount of rule breaking Red Bull did in 2012, I remember they were forced to change their illegal suspension system on Vettel's car under the parc ferme, but again Ferrari didn't protest, "for the good of the sport" obviously.

The old Todt-Brawn era ruthlessness came back when Sergio Marchionne took the helm. But unfortunately, his reign was short, and Ferrari under the current management, have gone back to the LDM-Domenicalli era "smile nice in font of the media" practice.

Yup LDM was ruthless in taking any kind of political stand.
I felt the same when SM took over from LDM. But after his sudden demise, ferrari management is short of such individuals.

[nani_s23]

Pretty much on point. Ever since LDM's purge to make the team more 'italian', Ferrari have been nothing but a toothless tiger.
One of the prime example: 2011 blown diffuser fiasco. It was agreed that, starting from British GP the blown diffuser effect would get reduced by 90%, and there was no objection from any team whatsoever. But after Alonso dominated Silverstone and when both Red Bull and Mclaren got hammered, both of them cried to the FIA. And Ferrari, "for the good of the sport", decided to go back to the old blown diffuser system. Then there was the amount of rule breaking Red Bull did in 2012, I remember they were forced to change their illegal suspension system on Vettel's car under the parc ferme, but again Ferrari didn't protest, "for the good of the sport" obviously.

The old Todt-Brawn era ruthlessness came back when Sergio Marchionne took the helm. But unfortunately, his reign was short, and Ferrari under the current management, have gone back to the LDM-Domenicalli era "smile nice in font of the media" practice.

Yup LDM was ruthless in taking any kind of political stand.
I felt the same when SM took over from LDM. But after his sudden demise, ferrari management is short of such individuals.

[itsme_marky]

FIA ‘couldn't prove' Ferrari breached the rules
http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/view/711898/FIA_8216couldn8217t_prove8217_Ferrari_breached_the _rules/

[tifosi1993]

FIA STATEMENT FOLLOWING COMMUNICATION FROM SEVEN FORMULA 1 TEAMS (https://www.fia.com/news/fia-statement-following-communication-seven-formula-1-teams)


"The extensive and thorough investigations undertaken during the 2019 season raised suspicions that the Scuderia Ferrari PU could be considered as not operating within the limits of the FIA regulations at all times. The Scuderia Ferrari firmly opposed the suspicions and reiterated that its PU always operated in compliance with the regulations.The FIA was not fully satisfied but decided that further action would not necessarily result in a conclusive case due to the complexity of the matter and the material impossibility to provide the unequivocal evidence of a breach."

So basically: They never found Ferrari guilty of cheating. They "think" Ferrari did something, but simply can't prove it.

Ferrari.....:roll

I think the Binotto and co. should've fought harder, they should've demanded from the FIA to prove that what they were doing was illegal. But they simply gave up, or should I say "reached settlement" knowing that there was no conclusive evidence of cheating.

[scudieros]

https://www.fia.com/news/fia-statement-following-communication-seven-formula-1-teams

[bondilad]

FIA STATEMENT FOLLOWING COMMUNICATION FROM SEVEN FORMULA 1 TEAMS (https://www.fia.com/news/fia-statement-following-communication-seven-formula-1-teams)



So basically: They never found Ferrari guilty of cheating. They "think" Ferrari did something, but simply can't prove it.

Ferrari.....:roll

I think the Binotto and co. should've fought harder, they should've demanded from the FIA to prove that what they were doing was illegal. But they simply gave up, or should I say "reached settlement" knowing that there was no conclusive evidence of cheating.

What bothers me is why Ferrari is allowing the FIA to drag it's name through mud and not trying to defend itself.

[MSForever]

Checkmate Toto and co)))

[RicRac]

What bothers me is why Ferrari is allowing the FIA to drag it's name through mud and not trying to defend itself.

This is why Ferrari needed a man like Sergio. A leader who took no bullsh!t!!!

[bondilad]

This is why Ferrari needed a man like Sergio. A leader who took no bullsh!t!!!

Definitely yes. He wouldn't put up with this nonsense.

[nani_s23]

FIA STATEMENT FOLLOWING COMMUNICATION FROM SEVEN FORMULA 1 TEAMS (https://www.fia.com/news/fia-statement-following-communication-seven-formula-1-teams)



So basically: They never found Ferrari guilty of cheating. They "think" Ferrari did something, but simply can't prove it.

Ferrari.....:roll

I think the Binotto and co. should've fought harder, they should've demanded from the FIA to prove that what they were doing was illegal. But they simply gave up, or should I say "reached settlement" knowing that there was no conclusive evidence of cheating.

Yup... Binotto was confident that they didn’t cross any limits. He should have defended it strongly before FIA.
Anyways all is well now.

Dr. Marko should shut his mouth now & shouldn’t keep with ferrari anymore.
Taxi team should fear their existence in F1

[tifosi1993]

What bothers me is why Ferrari is allowing the FIA to drag it's name through mud and not trying to defend itself.

The whole "friendly" attitude from Ferrari's upper management have been bothering me for a while, I have no idea what they're hoping to gain by being too friendly and submissive.

The FIA can't prove anything and didn't want Ferrari to take them to court, and since they have no evidence of Ferrari's wrongdoing, they will certainly lose. And Ferrari, instead of fighting tooth and nail, just gave up a rather huge advantage.

There's a reason why other teams haven't protested Ferrari's result, because they too know quite well that they can't prove anything without having direct access to technical aspects of Ferrari's PU. (The whole "Whistleblower" narrative is quite interesting in that regard)

[ferrari1.8t]

I love how social media is blowing up with Ferrai International Assistance, we haven’t won a title in 12 years - what kind of assistance we getting? Lol

[nhiepka]

I really admire Mr. Binoto, he is cool, not big mouth, stays calm like as the priest ^^ even if whatever who say.... That is very good for the team.

[Lesky]

Still innocent until proven guilty, or?

[paolo lalli]

It could mean that pu will be reintroduced shortly.Mercedes are desperate for the information.If it's not wrong then it's right .The fia have nothing.

[Tony]

Pretty much on point. Ever since LDM's purge to make the team more 'italian', Ferrari have been nothing but a toothless tiger.
One of the prime example: 2011 blown diffuser fiasco. It was agreed that, starting from British GP the blown diffuser effect would get reduced by 90%, and there was no objection from any team whatsoever. But after Alonso dominated Silverstone and when both Red Bull and Mclaren got hammered, both of them cried to the FIA. And Ferrari, "for the good of the sport", decided to go back to the old blown diffuser system. Then there was the amount of rule breaking Red Bull did in 2012, I remember they were forced to change their illegal suspension system on Vettel's car under the parc ferme, but again Ferrari didn't protest, "for the good of the sport" obviously.

The old Todt-Brawn era ruthlessness came back when Sergio Marchionne took the helm. But unfortunately, his reign was short, and Ferrari under the current management, have gone back to the LDM-Domenicalli era "smile nice in font of the media" practice.

Except that Marchione was a beast... God rest his soul...

[Lesky]

The Wolff is leading the pack in search of blood, that much is certain, the rest remain clouded in uncertainty at the moment! Still its possible the prancing horse will be eaten alive by the Wolff pack :-(

I dont see how Binotto will survive this, he will be trashed and put under insane pressure!

[Greig]

Why would we agree to any deal if we are 100% legal? Seems all very strange.

[Greig]

And you can keep pretending all you like that Mercedes never got caught cheating while escaping punishment. Facts will remain facts.

Such as? Please don't say tyre test, please don't say tyre test. You are gonna say tyre test right?

[Ferrari312T4]

Such as? Please don't say tyre test, please don't say tyre test. You are gonna say tyre test right?

Tire test, there I did it... :lol

[Ferrari312T4]

Perhaps it would have meant that our secrets will be public knowledge if it goes to court. By secrets I mean not cheating but how the engine works, operates etcetera.

[tifosi1993]

Of-course it is strange. And what is more strange is, if other teams feel agitated, so much so that 7 of them jointly issued an statement, then why don't they go to the court and protest against Ferrari's results? Dr. Marko is demanding 24 mil, then fine, go to the International Motorsport Council and protest against Ferrari.

But something tells me, none of them are going to do anything. All they want is a technical directive from the FIA, they want FIA to disclose Ferrari PU's technical information, they want to know how Ferrari achieved those super accelerations at specific power band.

And since the FIA have made it clear with their earlier statement that they don't have a conclusive case against Ferrari, that it was impossible for them to prove there has been a severe breach of the rule book, they can't disclose anything to the public.

[Ferrarichamp]

Such as? Please don't say tyre test, please don't say tyre test. You are gonna say tyre test right?

what tyre test? the pretend one? :lol

[Greig]

what tyre test? the pretend one? :lol

The one they got punished for.....so really do you have any times Merc cheated and got away with it?

[Ferrarichamp]

The one they got punished for.....so really do you have any times Merc cheated and got away with it?

how were they punished?

[tifosi1993]

what tyre test? the pretend one? :lol

It was just innocent miscommunication between Mercedes, FIA, and Pirelli. They never intended to use the current car, but due to some innocent mistake they just ended up with their current car!

And they did get severely punished for such innocent mistake, they were immensely hampered by missing the three-day young driver test.

[Greig]

how were they punished?

IIRC they had to miss a 3 day test?

[Ferrarichamp]

IIRC they had to miss a 3 day test?

wow, that was harsh.

[Greig]

wow, that was harsh.

So we can debate the penalty, but as you said the facts are facts that they did get a punishment. You claim they cheat and get away with it but can't name any times?

[Ferrarichamp]

So we can debate the penalty, but as you said the facts are facts that they did get a punishment. You claim they cheat and get away with it but can't name any times?

how is that punishment? they missed out on one test, but gained valuable data from their own secret testing.

[paolo lalli]

The fia should have left it alone.Now there is no confidence in the fia or the system.They should have disqualified Ferrari if they were cheating.Then all integrity would stand in a fully transparent system,but oh no they had play the can't prove anything card.What a bunch of morons seriously.

[Greig]

how is that punishment? they missed out on one test, but gained valuable data from their own secret testing.

Well they ran 3 days at Barcelona, and missed out on 3 days so I guess it kind of balanced out what they gained....but anyway back to the point, can you say when they cheated and got no punishment?

[Ferrarichamp]

Well they ran 3 days at Barcelona, and missed out on 3 days so I guess it kind of balanced out what they gained....but anyway back to the point, can you say when they cheated and got no punishment?

you just said it yourself, it balanced out what they gained, nothing more than that, so no real punishment.

[Greig]

you just said it yourself, it balanced out what they gained, nothing more than that, so no real punishment.

But they never got away with it, so can you say any other times?

[Ferrarichamp]

But they never got away with it, so can you say any other times?

Again, please explain how they were punished?

[Silent Bob]

We can look at the oil burning situation and compare it to what Ferrari is being accused of. Injecting or permitting oil to be added to the combustion chamber to be combusted for the purpose of increasing power is in essence, bypassing the fuel flow meter. Ferrari did not protest but they did perfect the system and their engine was competitive. The FIA did not say Mercs engine was illegal, it just kept tightening the oil burning limits. If all the teams had protested, should Mercs engine have been considered illegal? It might have considering now you have a second source of fuel.

The FIA should have stated that they could not find Ferrari's engine being illegal and then closed off any loopholes that might be giving them an advantage. That should have been the right way to do it.

[Greig]

Again, please explain how they were punished?

We can go round and round, they got a punishment from the FIA, you claim they cheat with no punishment, so tell when? I am gonna guess you can't so we will leave it there.

[Ferrarichamp]

We can go round and round, they got a punishment from the FIA, you claim they cheat with no punishment, so tell when? I am gonna guess you can't so we will leave it there.


By definition, the word 'punishment' implies some kind of loss...

They missed out on one test, but they had already gained data from previous secret testing as you know. So they lost nothing really as you said in post #135.
I agree we should leave it there as you obviously can't explain the punishment you claim Mercedes suffered.

[SS454]

It really is starting to look like a witch hunt. One that took place in 2019. The statement says the FIA were suspicious of Ferrari's engine performance. While they do have the right, and I agree with that right, but they decided to seize Ferrari's PU and tear it apart looking for any kind of contraband. I would like clarification what justification they can go to those extremes based on suspicion.

In 2014 in particular, but even up to about 2016, Mercedes had a HUGE PU performance advantage. Some where saying upwards of 75 hp. All the way up to 2018 Red Bull said they didn't have a "party mode" for qualifying. Why was there no suspicion towards Mercedes and why were they not completely stripped down and investigated?

[Greig]

By definition, the word 'punishment' implies some kind of loss...

They missed out on one test, but they had already gained data from previous secret testing as you know. So they lost nothing really as you said in post #135.
I agree we should leave it there as you obviously can't explain the punishment you claim Mercedes suffered.

Well in that case you would also have to agree they gained nothing from the secret tyre test so therefore did not cheat...or would that not work for you?

So anyway have you actually got any other time Merc have cheated and got away with it?

[totox]

Why would we agree to any deal if we are 100% legal? Seems all very strange.

Because to prove that you have to take the Pu to the court as evidence and show every aspect of your tech publicy to the teams and FIA to explain that none of the parts of the Pu was illegal. Other teams will never gonna stop asking clarification until they strip down our Pu entirely. I guess that is a good reason.

[totox]

In that way I guess ferrari preferred to pay a huge amount to cease in a ambiguous way all the investigation and keep their tech in private.

[totox]

At the same time is rather obvious that Ferrari were doing something in a very grey area of the rules, but if they stop doing it at the moment that FIA asked for it, it's fine. All teams search for grey areas and try to exploit it while they last.

[da_one]

The FIA wanted changes in Ferrari's engines because there are certain innovations there that are not in the Hybrid Turbo engine blueprint that Mercedes submitted to the FIA that became the basis for the engine rules. It's not cheating, it's just unfair to Mercedes and their golden boy Lewis. :wave

[Silent Bob]

Are we even sure Ferrari was given a penalty?

"The FIA and Scuderia Ferrari have agreed to a number of technical commitments that will improve the monitoring of all Formula 1 Power Units for forthcoming championship seasons as well as assist the FIA in other regulatory duties in Formula 1 and in its research activities on carbon emissions and sustainable fuels."

Could be Ferrari have now got themselves a better position in recommending tech for the new PU's? Would the FIA would want to partner with supposed 'cheats' to assist them in regulating and monitoring power units? Not sure, but it doesn't read like a punishment unless Ferrari has to bankroll a bunch of new initiatives.... still it gives Ferrari some insight they never had before.

[tifosi1993]

In that way I guess ferrari preferred to pay a huge amount to cease in a ambiguous way all the investigation and keep their tech in private.

From where you get the notion that Ferrari payed a huge amount? The settlement between Ferrari and FIA could be many things, it doesn't necessarily mean that Ferrari payed a huge sum. Especially considering the information we got yesterday: there is a material impossibility of proving any rule breaking, aka the FIA don't have a conclusive case against the Scuderia.

[paolo lalli]

Bring back the 2019 PU and engine there is nothing wrong or illegal about it.Mercedes were very nervous because if this was incorporated into this year's chassis then it would definitely be a huge rd block in Lewis Hamilton's record equalling titles.The way mercedes see it, it's now or never to equall Schumacher record and then ultimately beat it.Very very hard to see it ever happening again.

[brava]

Haha

https://twitter.com/scuderiferrari/status/1235630803360591878?s=21

[Ferrari312T4]

Seems like the teams want to take it to court. And if proven not guilty, I would like to see a huge sum of money payed by those teams for smearing our reputation. It's becoming a bit silly really.

[RM-Ferrari]

According to Motorsport Italy, the agreement between Ferrari and the FIA means the Maranello team provided full acces to the federal technicians on secrets affecting the gray areas

http://scuderiafans.com/how-ferraris-technology-will-help-the-fia-close-grey-areas-of-loopholes-in-the-engine/

[MSForever]

https://www.racefans.net/2020/03/06/why-the-fias-latest-response-wont-placate-ferraris-furious-rivals-in-engine-row/

[MSForever]

WMSC: “The Council expressed unanimous support for the FIA President and the FIA Technical Department in regard to the overall management of the case, and strongly opposed any comments that undermine the reputation and image of the FIA and the Formula One World Championship.” #F1

[paolo lalli]

Once a wolf always a wolf it's all about a ploy by him to oust The current fia president Gene Todd and to under mine the fia.The wolf is trying to weaken Ferrari and there veto ability. This is war that fool is doing this as pay back when Ferrari blocked the move of wolf becoming the ceo of formula 1.Well he has done no favours to mercedes in the process.Burn baby burn.

[bondilad]

So let's see what RB does now. I guess RB ****** off merc with DAS protest :-D

http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/view/712836/Mercedes_call_a_truce_with_Ferrari_over_engine_sag a/

[SS454]

While the FIA put themselves in this boat, kudos to Jean Todt for his response.

[paolo lalli]

Mercedes withdraw from engine saga.OVER TO YOU DR DEATH LETS SEE IF YOU HAVE THE COURAGE TO LEAD.

[Silent Bob]

Wonder what Elkhann has over the Merc boss? Compromising photos perhaps? Or maybe Ferrari know about a few tricks Merc are using.

[TTRSMAD]

Wonder what Elkhann has over the Merc boss? Compromising photos perhaps? Or maybe Ferrari know about a few tricks Merc are using.

Mercedes boss came to the understanding with the help of Elkhann, that their advantage in hybrid engine era in F1 by Mercedes was due to Ferrari not raising questions about how Mercedes had such advantage over everybody in 2014.

Don t forget that 2013 Mercedes won 1 race, 2014 they won 16 races. Ferrari got hustled with the hybrid rules and the Mercedes Boss knows it.

[Silent Bob]

Mercedes boss came to the understanding with the help of Elkhann, that their advantage in hybrid engine era in F1 by Mercedes was due to Ferrari not raising questions about how Mercedes had such advantage over everybody in 2014.

Don t forget that 2013 Mercedes won 1 race, 2014 they won 16 races. Ferrari got hustled with the hybrid rules and the Mercedes Boss knows it.

sarcasm

[da_one]

Mercedes: We demand to know what you've learned from the Ferrari engine!

FIA: Sure, but after that, we would no longer give you preferential treatment that you have been enjoying since 2014.

Mercedes: We withdraw our protest. Move along guys....

:wave

[JHAMMER]

https://www.gpupdate.net/nl/f1-nieuws/377493/red-bull-geeft-strijd-tegen-schikking-fia-ferrari-niet-op/

"Should the case ultimately lead to Ferrari's disqualification, that will make Red Bull a lot of money. The team then moves to second place in the constructors' championship. In that case, the employees also get a piece of the cake, says team boss Christian Horner."
"This whole thing has a bitter aftertaste for us. It's a lot of money, because the difference between second and third place in the championship is $ 20 million for us. Every employee has an additional bonus payment, so we can't leave it at what it is."

So the reason Redbull want to keep this going is $20 Million dollars?

"Every employee has an additional bonus payment, so we can't leave it at what it is."

Dietrich Mateschitz could pay them this with his pocket change, and if they believe that Ferrari cheated then maybe he should pay his employee's the bonus and say they earned it for coming in second in the championship.

This is not only about the money this is about embarrassing the FIA and Ferrari.

[SilverSpeed]

Flexi wings anyone?

[paolo lalli]

Well red bull need 24 million dollars if it were ever to accentuate.I doubt it very much.The legal fees would out weigh the gain for all teams involved.Or do red bull think they can find it and if we win we will not share this money with others any thing that DR DEATH Marko is involved with steer well clear it will add up to nothing.

[wisepie]

If we were found by the FIA to be breaking the rules and it was proven 100%, action should have been taken earlier, and this issue put to bed. F1 has enough problems to deal with with the on-going cancellation/postponement of races, I don't expect this season to actually happen, and even if it does it will be with so many compromises and a very hard job for our team to compete at full strength, legal or otherwise.:roll

[Gilles]

We already knew it, we will say that it is now confirmed:
Menabue: “They have never shown they have the balls”
“Ferrari has never shown it has the balls . In 2019 the engine was like the Mercedes one, Ferrari was punished, not them, if you are politically worth zero this happens. They have never done anything to assert themselves, even in Las Vegas you react to the fact that they are penalizing you or for an error on the track it's one thing if you suffer it's another. Ferrari is a sieve, as far as the leak is concerned, when the checks were carried out there was a mobile air intake, designed by Allison and prohibited, the commissioners went to check exactly that, how did they know? You couldn't see it, someone said it..."
In F1, the joke continues, as do the tortilla jokes elsewhere :)

[Tifoso]

Just not buying it. Ferrari is not going to roll over. They are F1 and everyone knows it. Including them. ;-)