2021 Mexican Grand Prix - Race Thread

[tifosi1993]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FDiyKDTXEAIeqZk?format=png&name=orig

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FDiyx5nXMAEj0HD?format=jpg&name=orig

[Gilles]

I therefore bet P4 to P7 without incident, hope to see great drivers

[tifosi1993]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FDmbe_rXoAMsfYq?format=jpg&name=orig

[Gilles]

Both drivers starting on the dirty side of the track

[wisepie]

I therefore bet P4 to P7 without incident, hope to see great drivers

That's the key, without incidents! Just hope and pray we can get through turn 1 in one piece and see where the land lies from there. No predictions coming from me, but more points than Mclaren would make my day. Forza Charles and Carlos.

[Rob]

Go ask again, sorry. Is there gold reliable stream please?

[Gilles]

Go ask again, sorry. Is there gold reliable stream please?

https://scuderiafans.com/live-video-watch-the-2021-mexico-city-gp-at-autodromo-hermanos-rodriguez/

https://www12.formula1streams.com/mexican-grand-prix/

Have yet to try the first one
Using the second one for a while now (with android, i then select f1livegp or mazystream. Some adds, have to reload regularly, some temporary resolution restrictions with the first one). Not gold, sorry

[jgonzalesm6]

Go ask again, sorry. Is there gold reliable stream please?

streameast.live.com

or

https://cricfree.live/livetv/skyf1.php

[jgonzalesm6]

Toto Wolff said to Sky Germany that there was a talk with Michael Masi this morning and that a similar start situation like in 2019 (Seb vs Lewis, forcing someone off the track on the straight) would result into a penalty this time.

[jgonzalesm6]

F1 has set a new rule. Celebs are allowed on the grid but no bodyguards or bouncers since the run-in with Martin Brundle.

[Greig]

Felipe baby :-)

[stefa]

:ferrarifl

[stefa]

Nice

[tifosi1993]

Very good start for us. Charles P5, Sainz P7.

[DJTaurus]

W t f did max did from the outside. Unbelievable control braking early and diving into the corner. Mercs tried with Bottas to hold max back and lost…..

[stefa]

Why SC?!?!?!?

Oh I see

[stefa]

McLarens are way down the order

[jgonzalesm6]

Bottas now 18th after being hit by Ricciardo.

[SilverSpeed]

Lets take WCC 3rd position now please!

[stefa]

Gio 6th

[tifosi1993]

SC in this lap

[stefa]

CS 6th

[stefa]

That Alpha Tauri is fast

[stefa]

It seams that CS is faster than CL

[ntukza]

What's going on with Leclerc???

[jgonzalesm6]

That Alpha Tauri is fast

yep with Gasly behind the wheel.

[stefa]

I just hope MV don't use all the life of his tyres too soon

[stefa]

yep with Gasly behind the wheel.

:furious

[elnano14]

Gio is closer to Sainz than Leclerc to Gasly...

[Tifoso Svedese]

Humiliating performance. I guess the elevation turned the downforce generated into Hungary levels. Otherwise there can be no explanations for this fiasco of being outran by frigging Gasly at a track full of chicanes and hairpins.

[stefa]

I wander is anyone taking seriously this LH moaning about tires every race?!

[DJTaurus]

I wander is anyone taking seriously this LH moaning about tires every race?!

Probably the first time he is not lying. Perez closing in.

What i am curious of is what they did use at the Q3 yesterday. What magic button. Cause red bulls are clearly faster on this GP.

[tifosi1993]

Charles is now closing in on Gasly. Again showing his incredible race craft. Carlos is also keeping up with Charles.

[stefa]

Probably the first time he is not lying. Perez closing in.

What i am curious of is what they did use at the Q3 yesterday. What magic button. Cause red bulls are clearly faster on this GP.

I do hope he gets him!

[stefa]

We don't have anything to respond to Alpha Tauri

[elnano14]

Gap between Gasly and Leclerc is now 4.5s ...

[stefa]

Perez cannot keep up with LH

[DIEK]

Hamilton crying.

[tifosi1993]

Gap between Gasly and Leclerc is now 4.5s ...

3.8 now

[stefa]

Hamilton crying.

What's new?!

[patrese86]

The car is just too draggy

[DIEK]

What's new?!

https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/lew.jpg

"This guys are too fast for us..." :roll

[Tifoso Svedese]

I don't really understand how Alpha Tauri are tripping over themselves to sabotage Red Bull this weekend :-ZZ

[DJTaurus]

What are they doing with Perez ??

[ntukza]

Gasly is simply faster than us. Unbelievable.

[stefa]

Nope! We cannot do anything against that Alpha Tauri

[elnano14]

Sainz with soft tyres can get both Leclerc and Gasly in the end

[tifosi1993]

Ferrari unnecessarily leaving Sainz out. Come now, Pit him.

[Greig]

Red Bull ruined Perez's race then?

[stefa]

That is a mountain to climb for Perez to take LH

[tifosi1993]

Sainz with soft tyres can get both Leclerc and Gasly in the end

No way. He will pit for the hards. Softs aren't a race tyre, they are only good for qualifying.

[DJTaurus]

Mercs for the first time under pressure after so many years of cruising and playing with magic buttons.

[DJTaurus]

Very quick PStop for Sainz.

[jgonzalesm6]

Mercs for the first time under pressure after so many years of cruising and playing with magic buttons.

+1

[tifosi1993]

Two very good pit stops. Well done Pit Crew. :thumb

[stefa]

Anyway this will be a great haul of points against McLaren :-D

[PURE PASSION]

Just 1+ tenth slower then Gas but faster then the others (Mclaren) and of course not even mentioning the frontrunner!!!!
I expected something better but anyway now all we care is the points from McLaren and there we are pretty good!!!

[tifosi1993]

Other manufacturers should be paying attention to Honda's turbo charger. It's best in the field.

[stefa]

Unfortunately I don't see Perez catching LH today

[elnano14]

Looking into the lap times, we're losing too much to Gasly in S2 and S3

[jgonzalesm6]

Other manufacturers should be paying attention to Honda's turbo charger. It's best in the field.

It was engineered by the guys that do the turbines for the HondaJet.

[PURE PASSION]

It looks like Lec has lost pace quite a bit!!!

[PURE PASSION]

Are we gonna have a fight Lec - Sai ??????

[ntukza]

To be honest, if Sainz catches Leclerc I wouldn't mind if Leclerc just lets him through. He would deserve it.

[stefa]

Are we gonna have a fight Lec - Sai ??????

CL is constantly slower than CS

[patrese86]

Just let Sainz past Charles if he's quicker then he's quicker. We should be right up there in sectors 2 and 3. Bizzare.

[stefa]

CL tires are gone!!!!

[jgonzalesm6]

Team orders from Ferrari???

[DJTaurus]

I don’t understand why red bull didn’t go for the undercut with Perez over Hamilton.

[stefa]

Perez just 2.8 sec behind LH

[stefa]

Team orders from Ferrari???

Reasonable!

[ntukza]

CL tires are gone!!!!

In which case the team should have pitted him for fresh rubber 5-10 laps ago.

[jgonzalesm6]

Swap-a-roo for Ferrari.

[ntukza]

CL tires are gone!!!!

In which case the team should have pitted him for fresh rubber 5-10 laps ago.

[DJTaurus]

Guys i ve been telling you since day one. Carlos is steady improving race by race year by year. You still don’t take him seriously. He is the real underdog.

[tifosi1993]

Totally pointless team order. Sainz is not going to lap a second/lap faster than Gasly and overtake him on track. We're ahead of Mclaren here, that's what out goal should be.

But it's Ferrari's "genius" pit wall we're talking about here.

[jgonzalesm6]

C'mon Checo....pounce Lewis.

[stefa]

Finally LH has to work and not to cruise around the championship!

[tifosi1993]

Guys i ve been telling you since day one. Carlos is steady improving race by race year by year. You still don’t take him seriously. He is the real underdog.

This is his 8th year in F1. He's pretty much a veteran now. He should be doing the job that he's doing right now.

[Tifoso Svedese]

Looks like the Netflix clowns are doing the camerawork right now...

[stefa]

Damn it! Perez need that little more!

[stefa]

Unfortunately Perez cannot!

[jgonzalesm6]

Max Verstappen is closing on Leclerc and soon will lap everyone up until P6

[stefa]

What is happening with MV?! Last lap was horrible!

[stefa]

Ferrari swap again

[tifosi1993]

So Carlos does a 1:29.344 to let Charles through. As I've said, that was a totally pointless team order.

[stefa]

We outscored McLaren greatly!

[PURE PASSION]

All in all good points against McLaren. Nothing more,nothing less!!!!

[stefa]

Still don't understand, based on what some people here had optimism that we are going to do great?! Don't get me wrong, with this car 5th and 6th is more than max!

[Tifoso Svedese]

Disastrous performance, embarassingly slow, but at least a 17-point net swing in the constructors' and the woke loser falling further adrift.

[tifosi1993]

P5 and P6. Well done.

We had no answer to Honda. They have the best energy harvesting unit in F1. AT's pace is the biggest testament of Honda's awesome energy management.

[elnano14]

Still don't understand, based on what some people here had optimism that we are going to do great?! Don't get me wrong, with this car 5th and 6th is more than max!

Hmm, maybe based on Monaco and Baku ?

[ntukza]

Ferrari swap again


So Carlos does a 1:29.344 to let Charles through. As I've said, that was a totally pointless team order.

Agree. Totally unnecessary and another example of poor driver management. I favour Leclerc over Sainz but this was very unfair. Sainz earned P5 through a better strategy and good driving. He was faster than Charles so he should have stayed in front. If the team had allowed them to race in the first place chances are Sainz would have passed Charles, so this swap at the end is really unnecessary.

[Lesky]

Red Bull handed Merc the 2nd place by not doing the undercut with Perez, why not let Lewis have to overtake Perez on track? Imagine Lewis having to be careful to not collide with Perez at any cost. Weird stuff from Red Bull. Overtaking a Merc with that engine is impossible.

And then of course butler Bottas having to pit 4 times to take away Max FL point, this is why points should be awarded all the way through the field.

[tifosi1993]

Disastrous performance, embarassingly slow, but at least a 17-point net swing in the constructors' and the woke loser falling further adrift.

Woke or not I'm enjoying Mercedes's current predicament. As many have here said it before, Ferrari had the car in 2017-2018, but not the driver.

[KimiBot]

Mercs for the first time under pressure after so many years of cruising and playing with magic buttons.

:thumb

[stefa]

Hmm, maybe based on Monaco and Baku ?

I would just say that those ware strangely off! Nothing to be measured with.

[Tifoso Svedese]

Charles would've been able to stay ahead. It's very hard to overtake a similar car on a track like that.

[jgonzalesm6]

Lap 71 of 71 results

https://twitter.com/F1/status/1457449153601093635/photo/1

[stefa]

Red Bull handed Merc the 2nd place by not doing the undercut with Perez, why not let Lewis have to overtake Perez on track? Imagine Lewis having to be careful to not collide with Perez at any cost. Weird stuff from Red Bull. Overtaking a Merc with that engine is impossible.

And then of course butler Bottas having to pit 4 times to take away Max FL point, this is why points should be awarded all the way through the field.

Yes! Strangely!

[alfaromeo]

Good results but 1 lap behind verstapen is very big for Ferrari. And agin problem with white tires… I just hope that keep 3 rd in championship and work for 2022 …

[PURE PASSION]

Hmm, maybe based on Monaco and Baku ?

And that we expected to have lesser deflect from the ice part compare to Merc and Honda, and with the new hybrid system we expected to be closer. But as it looked we couldn't work/manage the tires !!!!

[Lesky]

Yes! Strangely!

If Max manages to win this title (which I still dont think) it will be one the greatest achievements in modern F1. He has been helped by Perez one time all season long, so basicly he is running a one man show against the most dominant team in F1 history in this engine decisive era.

[tifosi1993]

Agree. Totally unnecessary and another example of poor driver management. I favour Leclerc over Sainz but this was very unfair. Sainz earned P5 through a better strategy and good driving. He was faster than Charles so he should have stayed in front. If the team had allowed them to race in the first place chances are Sainz would have passed Charles, so this swap at the end is really unnecessary.

It was pointless because Ferrari would've finished P5 and P6 regardless. So both Charles and Carlos needed to manage their engine and car, since they had no challenge from the behind. And it's not that easy to overtake here. Carlos would've lost performance by staying in Charles's dirty air and eventually his tyres would've gone away.

[tifosi1993]

Charles would've been able to stay ahead. It's very hard to overtake a similar car on a track like that.

+1

[ferrari1.8t]

Lewis looks deflated and defeated :-D

We are well off the pace of the Red Bull and Merc, but happy to see us making gains with our package overall and against McLaren. Forza Ferrari

[patrese86]

A good points haul today and a positive result compared to McLaren. However we seem to be struggling with performance at altitude compared to the Alpha Tauri's. Not sure in Brazil that we will be able to find the performance we need.

[springfield]

Red Bull handed Merc the 2nd place by not doing the undercut with Perez, why not let Lewis have to overtake Perez on track? Imagine Lewis having to be careful to not collide with Perez at any cost. Weird stuff from Red Bull. Overtaking a Merc with that engine is impossible.

And then of course butler Bottas having to pit 4 times to take away Max FL point, this is why points should be awarded all the way through the field.

They wanted to pit first , but Lewis drove first into the pits, so they changed tactics. I guess RB pit crew came out too soon and Merc guys could cover it.

[jgonzalesm6]

Lewis looks deflated and defeated :-D

When there's parity among the competition, the 7x WDC title holder is'nt so great.


We are well off the pace of the Red Bull and Merc, but happy to see us making gains with our package overall and against McLaren. Forza Ferrari

agreed

[paolo lalli]

Max will dethrone hamilton.

[ntukza]

It was pointless because Ferrari would've finished P5 and P6 regardless. So both Charles and Carlos needed to manage their engine and car, since they had no challenge from the behind. And it's not that easy to overtake here. Carlos would've lost performance by staying in Charles's dirty air and eventually his tyres would've gone away.

Yeah fair enough. If I were Sainz though I would have still wanted be given a chance - maybe 2 or 3 laps and then I'd accept the situation for what it is.

[Gilles]

Still don't understand, based on what some people here had optimism that we are going to do great?! Don't get me wrong, with this car 5th and 6th is more than max!

Binotto and also the drivers said that we would be competitive. They were wrong (and maybe the simulator work was wrong). Instead of that, the car was in the superior hierachie average, but not competitive at all

[aroutis]

Binotto and also the drivers said that we would be competitive. They were wrong (and maybe the simulator work was wrong). Instead of that, the car was in the superior hierachie average, but not competitive at all

If by competitive they meant FTW , no
If by competitive they meant better than McLaren, then they were right.

[jgonzalesm6]

It was pointless because Ferrari would've finished P5 and P6 regardless. So both Charles and Carlos needed to manage their engine and car, since they had no challenge from the behind. And it's not that easy to overtake here. Carlos would've lost performance by staying in Charles's dirty air and eventually his tyres would've gone away.

I think the Ferrari pitwall were pressured to make the switch after Sainz radioed that Leclerc was making mistakes. The Ferrari pitwall needs to have a backbone and show confidence to the drivers.

[Alonsomaniac]

I think it's quite simple: Charles was not able to challenge Gasly. Carlos thought he was faster and that he might be able to pass Gasly. It would mean more points for the team. So they gave him the chance to try. When it turned out that he could do no more than Charles could, they gave Charles the position back. By doing so, there will be no unnessesary tension between the drivers.

[SS454]

It's unfortunate some people hyped up Ferrari's PU upgrade to the point they would actually challenge for wins, especially at Mexico. Using the results of races like Turkey as a guide to suggest the Ferrari was able to keep up with Max and Hamilton. Back to reality and people are depressed

Gasly and AlphaTauri's performance was unexpected, but Ferrari had a good day as they put up big points over McLaren. Plus the Ferrari again looked quite a bit better than McLaren which is their goal.

[PURE PASSION]

It's unfortunate some people hyped up Ferrari's PU upgrade to the point they would actually challenge for wins, especially at Mexico. Using the results of races like Turkey as a guide to suggest the Ferrari was able to keep up with Max and Hamilton. Back to reality and people are depressed

Gasly and AlphaTauri's performance was unexpected, but Ferrari had a good day as they put up big points over McLaren. Plus the Ferrari again looked quite a bit better than McLaren which is their goal.

NOBODY talked about wins and fighting for the top places!!!
Just expected a bit better performance.
Something like to be about 0,5 and P5 in Qualtly. And finish 5-6 about 30 sec behind .Something like to be a bit better of what Gasly did. That is what I was expecting. Point wise we end up just 2-4 points worst then what maximum we where expecting. But on pure performance ,yes I was expecting something more but just what i explained !!! NOTHING MORE!!!!

[Alonsomaniac]

Don't expect overnight miracles. We are fighting for third place in the WCC this year and in the beginning it did not look as if we would be able to challenge McLaren at all. Now Ferrari is able to do that, with both drivers. Don't look at Mercedes or RBR yet, that is something for next season maybe. But the goal, third in the championship, is now becoming realistic. And that is what we wanted and thought to be very difficult.
Both Charles and Carlos perform well and the car is getting better. Forza Ferrari!

[SS454]

NOBODY talked about wins and fighting for the top places!!!
Just expected a bit better performance.
Something like to be about 0,5 and P5 in Qualtly. And finish 5-6 about 30 sec behind .Something like to be a bit better of what Gasly did. That is what I was expecting. Point wise we end up just 2-4 points worst then what maximum we where expecting. But on pure performance ,yes I was expecting something more but just what i explained !!! NOTHING MORE!!!!

Most definitely there was people claiming Ferrari could keep up with Red Bull and Mercedes, and there was some thinking Ferrari had a decent shot at a win in Mexico.

I think 5th and 6th are the targets each race. If everything goes straight forward, Max, Ham, Bot, Per is your top 4. So technically they finished the best they should have on paper going into the race.

[FerrariF60]

Finally LH has to work and not to cruise around the championship!

yup, like he did from 2017 until 2020.....fake and FREE WDC's......

[SS454]

yup, like he did from 2017 until 2020.....fake and FREE WDC's......

2017 and 2018 Lewis had to work for half a season and then it was back to domination. 2019 was dominant until Ferrari got their car sorted with their legal illegal PU that Lewis complained about so much the FIA disassembled Ferrari's entire PU. 2020 was one of, if not his most dominant seasons. Lewis's last fight over a season was against Rosberg in 2016, and he lost.

[FerrariF60]

2017 and 2018 Lewis had to work for half a season and then it was back to domination. 2019 was dominant until Ferrari got their car sorted with their legal illegal PU that Lewis complained about so much the FIA disassembled Ferrari's entire PU. 2020 was one of, if not his most dominant seasons. Lewis's last fight over a season was against Rosberg in 2016, and he lost.

merc had by far the best engine from 2014 onwards............ferrari was only better in 19 midseason when they, well pushed the envelope TOO extremes with the engine.
they were only giving us false hope in 17 18 so to make it more interesting a bit....then Merc turned up the engines and...bye, bye....

this season the Merc has a real issue/threat with the honda engine.....honda is making them go in an uncomfortable state where they really push the engine and making them NOT as realiable as they were.....ONLY WISH IT WAS FERRARI THAT DID THAT....maybe next year??? we can only hope

[20000rpm]

Still don't understand, based on what some people here had optimism that we are going to do great?! Don't get me wrong, with this car 5th and 6th is more than max!


Most definitely there was people claiming Ferrari could keep up with Red Bull and Mercedes, and there was some thinking Ferrari had a decent shot at a win in Mexico.

I think 5th and 6th are the targets each race. If everything goes straight forward, Max, Ham, Bot, Per is your top 4. So technically they finished the best they should have on paper going into the race.

Bingo!!! Some people over-read into the timings and data and come with ultra-realistic assumptions that we are near to RB, Max and blah blah. There are so many factors at play on the tract to determine the competitiveness. A car being competitive generally, can be less competitive due to, for instance, wind direction, track temps, amongst others. Analysis over 1-2 races after an update is never going to give you a full idea about how you fare in the competition.
Our target was to be 3rd in WCC and we are inching closer towards it.
The first top four slots are already occupied and they can keep juggling amongst themselves under normal race. We have slots from fifth onwards and we are achieving it. We should be happy with that.

[ntukza]

I think it's quite simple: Charles was not able to challenge Gasly. Carlos thought he was faster and that he might be able to pass Gasly. It would mean more points for the team. So they gave him the chance to try. When it turned out that he could do no more than Charles could, they gave Charles the position back. By doing so, there will be no unnessesary tension between the drivers.

Yes but my argument is that Carlos really was quicker than Charles, so he was right. He didn't challenge Gasly but he was much further up the road from Charles. I submit that the speed and tyre delta between the two of them would have enabled Carlos to pass anyway. It would have been a bit messy and damaging to their race, so the team order made it cleaner, but in any case Carlos would have passed so he deserved to stay ahead even without catching Gasly.

[Toothlessrage*]

Yes but my argument is that Carlos really was quicker than Charles, so he was right. He didn't challenge Gasly but he was much further up the road from Charles. I submit that the speed and tyre delta between the two of them would have enabled Carlos to pass anyway. It would have been a bit messy and damaging to their race, so the team order made it cleaner, but in any case Carlos would have passed so he deserved to stay ahead even without catching Gasly.

What you're saying does make sense in the scenario where the machine is competitive and that they would be fighting for the championship.
Right now, the SF is trying to build a solid base with good team dynamics to last well into the future.

In short for this race, Charles was slower. But, not significantly slower. Sainz was faster. But, not significantly faster.
There must've been other factors that we might not know.
SF played it safe with the strategy primarily concentrating on
scoring because there was much to lose. In terms of; points, driver stability/morale, team stability/morale, and so on.
Also, IMHO; the team/Binnoto feels that Sainz is more mature and less reckless than Charles.

[stefa]

http://www.thescuderia.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=7880&stc=1
http://www.thescuderia.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=7881&stc=1

[stefa]

Always somebody else fault...

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/hamilton-bottas-left-the-door-open-to-verstappen-in-f1-mexico-gp-start/6757524/

[samboozik]

Always somebody else fault...

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/hamilton-bottas-left-the-door-open-to-verstappen-in-f1-mexico-gp-start/6757524/

Well this year Bottas is not helping him so he's feeling the heat big time, and I'm really enjoying it.

[PURE PASSION]

Always somebody else fault...

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/hamilton-bottas-left-the-door-open-to-verstappen-in-f1-mexico-gp-start/6757524/

The King,NEVER!!!!!!!:-D

[Riccardog]

hearing croft whinging about the backmarkers not helping ham, was nauseating, but a. davidson interview with toto, ending with... commiserations on finishing second, was vomit enducing!
F1 has become a british formula sadly......

[20000rpm]

hearing croft whinging about the backmarkers not helping ham, was nauseating, but a. davidson interview with toto, ending with... commiserations on finishing second, was vomit enducing!
F1 has become a british formula sadly......

Wished we had AI or some feature to shut crofty's idiotic commentary during the race. Sky won't do it, but some other streams could look into it.

[Toothlessrage*]

URL: https://www.planetf1.com/news/ted-kravitz-lewis-hamilton-sergio-perez-context/

Kravitz: Hamilton was not being disrespectful to Perez

Sir Lewis / Sir Holier Than Thou: “It just shows how fast their car (RBR) was when Sergio was that close behind me and able to follow that closely.”

Kravitz: “It might have sounded disrespectful when Lewis Hamilton was saying, ‘we know Red Bull have a fast car when Checo Perez is pressuring me from behind. It might have sounded, you know, ‘hang on, Lewis, Checo’s alright’ – bear in mind that, for the whole of the season, Hamilton has been comfortably ahead of Checo Perez.
That goes towards Checo learning how to drive the car fast but also bear in mind that Lewis knows he kind of has the measure of Checo Perez on pure driver performance himself because they were team-mates way back when. So, I think maybe that’s it. I know Lewis does respect Checo enormously, so I just think if you did hear Lewis saying [that], I think he’s just putting into context the previous performance of the Red Bull in the hands of Perez, maybe not appreciating that Perez has made a step forward with his performance.”

[Tifoso Svedese]

I'm not going to drag Hammy for that, Checo is a plain average driver who lucked into a win last year and a top seat as a result of it. Either of our drivers would beat him with ease in the same car.

[SilverSpeed]

Other manufacturers should be paying attention to Honda's turbo charger. It's best in the field.

Because they have experience with aviation engine's and turbines etc.

[stefa]

Well this year Bottas is not helping him so he's feeling the heat big time, and I'm really enjoying it.

Me too! :thumb

[Brembo]

I'm not going to drag Hammy for that, Checo is a plain average driver who lucked into a win last year and a top seat as a result of it. Either of our drivers would beat him with ease in the same car.

Checo's win came from 18th place to the win and did it with one pit for tires. Russell got a top seat as a result of driving the top car with a good start only to finish 9th behind Bottas. That's below average driving especially for the zero points for 2 1/2 years with Merc power. Either of our drivers would have beat Russell in the same car pit stop and all. No other driver was able to out race Checo to the front and win that race. Neither Charles Carlos or Checo are plain average drivers. Had Lewis tried to cover both sides of the track when Max came around would for sure caused crash 3. What was he waiting for? Bottas may well have held back as pay back for getting kicked out of his seat for a zero driver. Meanwhile Ferrari needs a podium ASAP !

[SS454]

Always somebody else fault...

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/hamilton-bottas-left-the-door-open-to-verstappen-in-f1-mexico-gp-start/6757524/

I'm still waiting for Toto to blame Bottas for the wheel nut issue once again

[SS454]

URL: https://www.planetf1.com/news/ted-kravitz-lewis-hamilton-sergio-perez-context/

Kravitz: Hamilton was not being disrespectful to Perez

Sir Lewis / Sir Holier Than Thou: “It just shows how fast their car (RBR) was when Sergio was that close behind me and able to follow that closely.”

Kravitz: “It might have sounded disrespectful when Lewis Hamilton was saying, ‘we know Red Bull have a fast car when Checo Perez is pressuring me from behind. It might have sounded, you know, ‘hang on, Lewis, Checo’s alright’ – bear in mind that, for the whole of the season, Hamilton has been comfortably ahead of Checo Perez.
That goes towards Checo learning how to drive the car fast but also bear in mind that Lewis knows he kind of has the measure of Checo Perez on pure driver performance himself because they were team-mates way back when. So, I think maybe that’s it. I know Lewis does respect Checo enormously, so I just think if you did hear Lewis saying [that], I think he’s just putting into context the previous performance of the Red Bull in the hands of Perez, maybe not appreciating that Perez has made a step forward with his performance.”

A friend of mine said it's possible Hamilton was referring to Checo being in dirty air. This would make sense and has no disrespect at all, but when big time reporter Kravitz defends Lewis' comments in what we all heard as a low blow against Perez... come on.

[Gilles]

If by competitive they meant FTW , no
If by competitive they meant better than McLaren, then they were right.

Behind Merc and RB, but not by one lap. I think they are disappointed with the pace they got, like we are

[Gilles]

Bingo!!! Some people over-read into the timings and data and come with ultra-realistic assumptions that we are near to RB, Max and blah blah. There are so many factors at play on the tract to determine the competitiveness. A car being competitive generally, can be less competitive due to, for instance, wind direction, track temps, amongst others. Analysis over 1-2 races after an update is never going to give you a full idea about how you fare in the competition.
Our target was to be 3rd in WCC and we are inching closer towards it.
The first top four slots are already occupied and they can keep juggling amongst themselves under normal race. We have slots from fifth onwards and we are achieving it. We should be happy with that.


NOBODY talked about wins and fighting for the top places!!!
Just expected a bit better performance.
Something like to be about 0,5 and P5 in Qualtly. And finish 5-6 about 30 sec behind .Something like to be a bit better of what Gasly did. That is what I was expecting. Point wise we end up just 2-4 points worst then what maximum we where expecting. But on pure performance ,yes I was expecting something more but just what i explained !!! NOTHING MORE!!!!

:thumb

[Golfsmith]

F1 has become a british formula
Said that loooooong time ago.

[Gilles]

"Still don't understand, based on what some people here had optimism that we are going to do great?! Don't get me wrong, with this car 5th and 6th is more than max!"

Bingo!!! Some people over-read into the timings and data and come with ultra-realistic assumptions that we are near to RB, Max and blah blah. There are so many factors at play on the tract to determine the competitiveness. A car being competitive generally, can be less competitive due to, for instance, wind direction, track temps, amongst others. Analysis over 1-2 races after an update is never going to give you a full idea about how you fare in the competition.
Our target was to be 3rd in WCC and we are inching closer towards it.
The first top four slots are already occupied and they can keep juggling amongst themselves under normal race. We have slots from fifth onwards and we are achieving it. We should be happy with that.


I would just say that those ware strangely off! Nothing to be measured with.
Ridiculous!
I don't know what disappoints me the most, the race or maybe your attitude

[stefa]

"Still don't understand, based on what some people here had optimism that we are going to do great?! Don't get me wrong, with this car 5th and 6th is more than max!"



Ridiculous!
I don't know what disappoints me the most, the race or maybe your attitude

?! Care to elaborate?!? What about my attitude? That I am not that blindly optimistic?! Mate I am almost 50 years old and watching F1 almost 40 years, so I've seen Ferrari's ups and downs (and they ware many). So I stick to seeing is believing!

[Gilles]

?! Care to elaborate?!? What about my attitude? That I am not that blindly optimistic?! Mate I am almost 50 years old and watching F1 almost 40 years, so I've seen Ferrari's ups and downs (and they ware many). So I stick to seeing is believing!

Very impressed !
No time left to answer to you, but i will

[Gilles]

Still don't understand, based on what some people here had optimism that we are going to do great?! Don't get me wrong, with this car 5th and 6th is more than max!


I would just say that those ware strangely off! Nothing to be measured with.


It's unfortunate some people hyped up Ferrari's PU upgrade to the point they would actually challenge for wins, especially at Mexico. Using the results of races like Turkey as a guide to suggest the Ferrari was able to keep up with Max and Hamilton. Back to reality and people are depressed



Bingo!!! Some people over-read into the timings and data and come with ultra-realistic assumptions that we are near to RB, Max and blah blah. There are so many factors at play on the tract to determine the competitiveness. A car being competitive generally, can be less competitive due to, for instance, wind direction, track temps, amongst others. Analysis over 1-2 races after an update is never going to give you a full idea about how you fare in the competition.

--------------------------------------

Ridiculous!
I don't know what disappoints me the most, the race or maybe your attitude


?! Care to elaborate?!? What about my attitude? That I am not that blindly optimistic?! Mate I am almost 50 years old and watching F1 almost 40 years, so I've seen Ferrari's ups and downs (and they ware many). So I stick to seeing is believing!

Can you explain to me this sudden need for such a reckoning?
Maybe you are disappointed and find it legitimate to attack people who are more optimistic than you? On the form it is not really a sign of openness.
Basically, this is wrong. Tell us who are "some people", who said that Ferrari would win, or even that they would be at the level of RB and Mercedes? I am quiet for my part.
You will find very little in this direction and I would say that people have the right to exaggerate, to be wrong as well. If a 14 year old comes with candor and anthousiasm on this forum, you will disgrace him and he will leave

I'm sure you can understand

[SS454]

--------------------------------------




Can you explain to me this sudden need for such a reckoning?
Maybe you are disappointed and find it legitimate to attack people who are more optimistic than you? On the form it is not really a sign of openness.
Basically, this is wrong. Tell us who are "some people", who said that Ferrari would win, or even that they would be at the level of RB and Mercedes? I am quiet for my part.
You will find very little in this direction and I would say that people have the right to exaggerate, to be wrong as well. If a 14 year old comes with candor and anthousiasm on this forum, you will disgrace him and he will leave

I'm sure you can understand

Those that over hyped the Ferrari performance seemed to give false hope to people, perhaps a lot of people, perhaps you were one of those people. Post race I saw a lot of gloomy disappointing posts when Ferrari fans should be happy about a successful day. Ferrari were fast enough to get the net target of 5th and 6th which is great. The pitstops were good. They played the team game to maximize points. No driver was unfairly treated. Both drivers did a great job. It's sad when Ferrari have worked hard to improve the car and currently have achieved the goal of being better than McLaren, yet so many fans crap on that because they had completely unrealistic expectations of challenging for a win.

[Gilles]

Those that over hyped the Ferrari performance seemed to give false hope to people, perhaps a lot of people, perhaps you were one of those people. Post race I saw a lot of gloomy disappointing posts when Ferrari fans should be happy about a successful day. Ferrari were fast enough to get the net target of 5th and 6th which is great. The pitstops were good. They played the team game to maximize points. No driver was unfairly treated. Both drivers did a great job. It's sad when Ferrari have worked hard to improve the car and currently have achieved the goal of being better than McLaren, yet so many fans crap on that because they had completely unrealistic expectations of challenging for a win.

Thank you for giving your explanation. I don't know if everyone will, I doubt it to be honest
Indeed, it is clear that on the whole, I was targeted
However, I never said anything other than the reality (being able to challenge P4 in favorable track conditions, target a 0.5s+ improvement on PU side when this additional power come to limit our mean weakness, maybe like in Mexico)
Also, I agree with you on the analysis of people's disappointment
But precisely, one could expect, from people who have known F1 for years, that they know a minimum of understand what they read and also, relativize when they see an unreasonable post (or even contradict it)
Mexico City turned out to be unfavorable to our car, contrary to expectations initiated firstly by Binotto himself (did these people send him a protestation letter?), following by medias and also drivers (the most disturbing teaching of the weekend I think)
As you point out, the result was not catastrophic from an accounting point of view. Technically there was a problem and I will keep my analysis to myself
Nevertheless,I believe that with the old PU we would have done much worse, but that escapes the Cassandras of the forum
For me, the pb happens to be that I am interested in the technical aspect of F1 + exceptionally to Charles, little at the races, and it is not very compatible with some here
However, I saw some excellent technical analysis here, I would have liked to exchange on them, but without disturbing the members who are focused on the sporting aspect, and not so friendly
So I wish to the first good luck and also to those who take care of others : I really thank them
From now on I'll save my time for myself

[20000rpm]

Er... You were targetted for what?

[Jax]

i don't know about ya'll but hearing hamilton team radios after each defeat brings me pleasure :D

[stefa]

Er... You were targetted for what?

I would say little bit dramatic...

[stefa]

i don't know about ya'll but hearing hamilton team radios after each defeat brings me pleasure :D
:clap

[Gilles]

Er... You were targetted for what?

Did you read my post, the 145th ?
And tell me there is no reason why I should feel targeted!
I have been posting a lot of "optimistic" messages for a month ago, data, and other "blah blah"
I was also "strangely off" during the race
I don't have time for this nonsense and above all I don't need it

[Gilles]

I would say little bit dramatic...

It's always better than wondering, eh?

[20000rpm]

Did you read my post, the 145th ?

Yes, I did. And I don't recall in any of the posts where you claim "you were the target" mentions you in any manner. If people start claiming all anonymous posts onto themselves, this place would become a war ground.
Assumption is a very dangerous proposition.

[Gilles]

[QUOTE = 20000rpm; 1049945] Yes, I did. And I don't remember in any of the posts where you claim "you were the target" mentions you in any way. If people started to claim all the anonymous messages about themselves, this place would become a war ground.
The hypothesis is a very dangerous proposition. [/ QUOTE]
Sorry but I don't agree with you when you say "I'm not mentioned in any way"
As I said, I am the one who, by my activity here for a month, corresponds most and by far to the "few people" anonymous and "strangely off" initiated by Stépha and following in this way. SS454 had the elegance to explain itself, not Stepha. I still don't like this and I'm a bit angry. Before blaming my reaction, I would say that using "some people here" to blame anyone is dangerous. Don't turn the tables please. I will not continue to share with people if i fell i'm not respected

[Toothlessrage*]

[QUOTE = 20000rpm; 1049945] Yes, I did. And I don't remember in any of the posts where you claim "you were the target" mentions you in any way. If people started to claim all the anonymous messages about themselves, this place would become a war ground.
The hypothesis is a very dangerous proposition. [/ QUOTE]
Sorry but I don't agree with you when you say "I'm not mentioned in any way"
As I said, I am the one who, by my activity here for a month, corresponds most and by far to the "few people" anonymous and "strangely off" initiated by Stépha and following in this way. SS454 had the elegance to explain itself, not Stepha. I still don't like this and I'm a bit angry. Before blaming my reaction, I would say that using "some people here" to blame anyone is dangerous. Don't turn the tables please. I will not continue to share with people if i fell i'm not respected

Hey!

I enjoy the info. you share :)

[paolo lalli]

Chalk and cheese between 2 top teams over the rest.Ferrari best of the worst,no point in sugar coating the situation.I can not wait for this era to end.Max can still win title i don't see Lewis winning last three races.