If the pivot on the wing is allowed to stand, a whole new can of worms will be opened. Imagine pivots on the floor? On the rear wing?
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If the pivot on the wing is allowed to stand, a whole new can of worms will be opened. Imagine pivots on the floor? On the rear wing?
Ya... pivots on the floor are a no go.. Ferrari tried that already.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jose-Lorca Fan
I have just one question. Why them? Isn't about time for Ferrari to come with something that will scare competitors and make them protest? Hopefully that interesting upgrade Flavio was writing about (if it was him) will be just that.
Agree. Ferrari is playing too conservatively but my understanding about a pivotal wing is simply a movable aero device which should be banned straight away. Or is that not somewhere in the rules?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyss4k
Here we go again it always seems to be mclaren and red b**** cheating, what the **** are the scrutineers doing, i hope ferrari will protest. So if the mclaren front wing is flexing or pivoting you would of thought between Spa and Monza someone would have noticed. At Spa if i remember correctly mclaren talked a lot about there new rear wing maybe that was to stop us looking at there flexi pivi strechy front wing.
**Please mind the language** :-)
Because when Ferrari do it, their fancy tricks get protested and banned straight away.
That is what Ferrari are doing to other teams. It is as if Ferrari cannot win...
No. Sorry guys the last part is wrong I got in a McLaren rage. I will read my comment before posting next time. Our updates did not work well coupled with McLaren cheating so the truth was somewhrre inbetween what I said. Apologies to the member who said my comment was wrong in so many ways as wellQuote:
Originally Posted by Ken
Apologies accepted, it's a good thing you retracted your comments. For a minute there I couldn't believe what I was reading lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by mark p
Your apology accepted and I removed the posts as they were OT.Quote:
Originally Posted by mark p
Why not? Yeah we did have flexi floor couple years ago and got banned. Now teams are pushing the rules way past the spirit of the rules, so why not. If they can do that, we can do the floor again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Bob
Took the words out of my mouth mate. Also Mclaren and RBR would protest about having points we scored with "devices" to help win "cheat" taken away. FIA got do alot more than give them slapped wrists.Quote:
Originally Posted by scuderiafan
According to german "Auto Motor und Sport" FIA has already tested FWs from Maccas and RB... Where's smoke there is always fire...
Translation:
"After leaked in Singapore was that twist at the two teams front wing under load, the FIA ordered on Thursday (4.10.) In Suzuka on a new wing test. The teams had been duly warned. When the wing trick has brought something, you will probably only see it on the track. The test took place behind closed doors. Where the FIA has usually its measurement platform, the shutters remained closed until Thursday afternoon. Reason: The FIA conducts tests new wing. Once leaked, the twist with at least two teams, the front wing, the world governing body located in Suzuka on a new front wing test. The suspicion has it that the blades can be rotated about its transverse axis. This can with the standard stress test can not be checked. At two points in this 690 mm to the right and left of the central axis of the vehicle and 695 mm is pressed before the front wheels to the wing tips. Since last season, the standard test has been tightened. Since then, the wing tips do not bend more towards the road. However, the engineers have long dreamed other tricks. Turn the whole wing to its suspension point. Normally the central portion of the wing, each with two bolt is screwed to the pylons. Thus, the wing will not budge. McLaren and Red Bull are to have their wings recently locked only with one screw. That would allow the wing to twist with the appropriate pressure on the horizontal axis. Thus the underbody would be flows better, increasing the output in the rear.
Compared with the previous tests, now the procedure has been changed slightly. The load is 125 millimeters closer to the front on the wing tips. Had the wings on the front end can move, would result in a distortion of the test. Since the teams were warned in Singapore already, should the investigation has not yielded much. According to McLaren to have passed the new FIA test at Suzuka, without making any improvements to the wings. However, the statement of the engineers are enjoying in such sensitive matters with care. The result is probably to be viewed only on the racetrack.
If the effect is so great really like it, thought the competition, should the blue and chrome-colored cars are slowed noticeably. An accurate picture of the wings could be fans and experts on Thursday not to make way. Neither Red Bull nor McLaren presented their wings in front of the garage, as they always do otherwise."
http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/f...l-5820804.html
First photos from Suzuka:
http://img1.auto-motor-und-sport.de/...acb-634443.jpg
:HmmQuote:
Originally Posted by Dino
Interesting picture.
This picture is from 2011 Hungaroring weekend, so really nothing new:
http://xounderground.files.wordpress...011/08/fwh.jpg
EDIT: click left mouse button and open in new window for bigger img.
EDIT2:
This is what I saw at f1technical after the Spa weekend:
http://kepfeltoltes.hu/120901/flex_w...toltes.hu_.jpg
Sent the tweeted the first picture you posted wacc to Scarbs...
Craig Scarborough @ScarbsF1
@robertallum1 I think that picture speaks for itself.
Rob... are we looking at what appears to be a gap at the back of bottom of both the struts on the front wing...?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob
Is that where they are getting the flexibility to get the rotation..?
yes mate, think that is.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tobes
:thumbQuote:
Originally Posted by Rob
Yes. That's definitely it. The back of the wing moves down under load, generating more downforce. That's essentially what RBR were doing with theirs before...which was banned.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ste
it makes the surface area of the wing bigger.
We saw something similar on the McLaren car (2011 or 2010) where in Valencia we saw a gap opening. I thought after that it was already banned. :Hmm
If the back of the wing is moving down, then from all my Aero experience it reduces down force but more importantly also reduces drag particularly the higher the speed the better the effect ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ste
Makes sense to me. :thumbQuote:
Originally Posted by Ken
I was looking and reading it all wrong d'oh, thinking the front moves down. But, yeah back going down makes alot more sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken
It works like Ken says.The higher the speed the less wing angle.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken
Any photos of Mclaren at Monza straight?
Quote:
FIA revises F1 flexi wing test to stop teams using trick designs
By Jonathan Noble Thursday, October 4th 2012, 11:05 GMT
The FIA has moved to ensure that no teams are using trick designs to get around flexi wing restrictions in Formula 1.
On the back of suggestions that McLaren and Red Bull Racing could have been using a concept that allowed their front wings to pass deflection tests but rotate backwards on their axis at high speed for a straight-line speed boost, the governing body has revised its procedures for the Japanese GP.
Sources have confirmed that for the Suzuka weekend, the FIA has moved where a test load is applied to the wing.
Before this weekend, a 100N (approximately 102kg) load test was applied to an area of the front wing 800 mm forward of the front wheel centreline, and 795mm from the car centre line. The wings are allowed to deflect just 20mm.
Aware of the possibility that some teams could be using designs that passed the old tests but still rotated at high speed, the FIA tweaked its testing so that the area being tested is now in an area 150mm further out.
This new test should ensure that any attempt by teams to utilise the rotating wing principle would be exposed.
AUTOSPORT understands that all teams passed the tests that were conducted at Suzuka.
However, it is unclear whether or not modifications had been made from previous designs that some teams had been running, as the outfits were pre-warned about the new tests.
McLaren team principal Martin Whitmarsh had said ahead of the weekend that he did not expect there would be any problems for his team with the new tests.
"I think the regulations require the wings to be rigid, but of course no wing or aerodynamic surface is infinitely rigid," he explained.
"From time to time questions and disputes arise between teams, who feel that other teams are too flexible or whatever. I don't envisage any particular problems for McLaren in that regard, and consequently I don't think that it is anything that will harm us."
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/103056
Found this picture of Lewis in Singapore this year, look at the front wing angle and the support pillars and the wing meets.....
http://www.flickr.com/photos/purplem...4938/lightbox/
I would like to know, how can FIA be sure that the wings that pass the test on thursdays are the same that are being raced. Do they use FIA stickers to mark the parts? Teams sometimes use more than 1 wing during qualy or race.
Edited for grammar