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Thread: Ferrari to test 2012 parts at remaining races

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    Ferrari to test 2012 parts at remaining races

    Stefano Domenicali has revealed that Ferrari will attempt to get a head start on winter testing over the remaining four races of the season, but insists the main objective is still to win races.

    Ferrari is no longer in the running for the constructors' championship and Fernando Alonso dropped out of contention for the drivers' crown in Singapore.

    The team has won just one race this season and has vowed to improve in 2012 with a "more aggressive" car. But with just three pre-season tests next year instead of four, there will be pressure on teams to produce a car that works straight out of the box, and Domenicali has revealed that Ferrari is using the remaining races this year to test new concepts for 2012.

    "Definitely in terms of testing various setups and parts, we basically use the Fridays to test and to bring forward as much as possible the development of the new car," he told Ferrari.TV. "That is the line we will be taking and I think it is also what our competitors will be doing."

    The rules will remain largely unchanged over the winter, with the biggest tweak being a ban on exhaust-blown diffusers. The use of exhaust gases to increase rear downforce has not been a strong point for Ferrari this year and its only victory came at Silverstone when a partial ban was enforced. Domenicali hopes the full-scale ban will help his team in 2012, but said the race is now on to find the best interpretation of the new rules.

    "Naturally, the hope is that our engineers will be capable of closing down the gap [to Red Bull]," he added. "Definitely the effect of the exhausts on the car performance will be smaller compared to this year. But even if it is less, we must maximise what we get from it and on this front, back at home, work is going on to find the best interpretation of this modification which is, let's say, the most significant rule change for next year."

    Domenicali believes exhausts and understanding the new Pirelli tyres have been the two biggest battle grounds this year and admitted he was surprised by how competitive Ferrari had been at Suzuka after a tough string of races.

    "I think this year's world championship has been a bit of an eye opener for everyone, because the combination of the effect of the exhausts and the behaviour of the tyres is an element that the engineers are trying to understand race after race," Domenicali said. "Clearly, it's fair to say that this performance level here, so close to the top guys, was not something we had been expecting, given the characteristics we have been used to seeing so far. I repeat, this means we will tackle the next four races with the same determination, because I believe it's right that we set our sights at least on one more win before the end of the year. It's a result we must absolutely try and bring home."

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    It's kind of worrying that they still do not have a grasp on how the car is going to perform from one race to the next, suggests they have not really solved anything with the chassis.
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    FERRARI TEST IN KOREA .... 2012

    Among the new techniques that will be brought to the next race, for all the car next year, also includes the innovative front wing and a change
    The second-place Fernando Alonso at the Japanese Grand Prix "is a great boost for morale," said the Spaniard as the Ferrari . But where and what is gained? Certainly not by the circumstances, because aside from the "safety car " - which has not been beneficial to the Red, in fact - was, the Suzuka race "clean."

    But even by the developments , because the Ferrari of the fact that Hungary was , changed only slightly depending on wing loading . The latest innovations , which would be used to Spa-Francorchamps and Monza, did not work . The final configuration of discharge those - that of Belgium - was tested, almost for the sake, at Suzuka and then set aside . Next Sunday, the Grand Prix of Korea , we will see a renewed Ferrari . But it is not changes this year , but the studies to the next . It starts from the wing front , which - as stated h greek Nicolas Tombazis engineer , a specialist aero - aero works on different criteria . This new appendix is being built at Maranello, and should be shipped in time for the practice of the Korean race . Another item concerns the change : it should have a unique structure , designed according to aerodynamics and therefore compact device .

    source: http://www.auto.it/autosprint/formul...ova+...il+2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    It's kind of worrying that they still do not have a grasp on how the car is going to perform from one race to the next, suggests they have not really solved anything with the chassis.
    yep. seems along with the f-duct last year, they cant get these big toys their competitiors make working completely properly. at least it is getting banned, but if they cannot copy as well, then they should try to make their own i guess. but they know that better than me.


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    It could be useful for 2012

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    It's kind of worrying that they still do not have a grasp on how the car is going to perform from one race to the next, suggests they have not really solved anything with the chassis.
    From: Ferrari says only small improvements needed to fight for 2012 F1 title
    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Stefano is right, we are not far away, wow effect cars are rarely all that good and seem to suggest you have ran out of idea's and throw it on, thinking about the chin-wing, Williams walruss nose.

    Red Bull does not say wow to me, what we need is a racing car wow or not

    I think chassis updates are a pretty major revision and would mean that there is a lot of work to do. So which is it?

    My thoughts are that if the "bolt on" updates that are being tested work, then those updates in-conjunction with revisions in the technical regulations for next year give Ferrari a good starting point for development through the winter without having to tear-down and build a completely new chassis. The biggest challenge I see for Ferrari is getting the ENTIRE range of Pirellis to work with the car, but as Pirelli continues to learn more about constructing F1 tyres I'm sure the characteristics of the compounds will also change to some degree.

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    Which is it? I am not sure Ferrari know considering the mixed comments, not sure why you took my comments from another thread posted before this one though?

    I still agree we are not far away from having a winning car certainly this year, but I would still be worried if they did not know why it was winning or going to perform
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Which is it? I am not sure Ferrari know considering the mixed comments, not sure why you took my comments from another thread posted before this one though?

    I still agree we are not far away from having a winning car certainly this year, but I would still be worried if they did not know why it was winning or going to perform
    I, too, have a good feeling for 2012. We aren't all that far off, and the Maronellites will work their rear ends off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    Which is it? I am not sure Ferrari know considering the mixed comments, not sure why you took my comments from another thread posted before this one though?

    I still agree we are not far away from having a winning car certainly this year, but I would still be worried if they did not know why it was winning or going to perform

    I mentioned the other comment, because I had read both threads one right after the other, and I felt it was contradictory, to say a car is not far from being a consistent winner yet it has mysterious, unsolved chassis issues.

    If it were, say a rear wing issues for example, I'd agree since it is pretty simple to update and fix. If it is in fact a chassis problem that has been Ferrari's hindrance so far, then those changes require a major rethink of the car's design and construction.

    So I guess what I was getting at is do you think Ferrari's issues are something that is going to require a chassis redesign/update or do you think they should they continue to look for speed in other areas of the car (without addressing the chassis problems, since that would mean Ferrari is not quite as close as they say) to overcome the gap to the Mclaren and RB?

    I'd rather see an updated chassis which fixes the current car's flaws rather than trying to work around a problem.
    Last edited by mm154; 11th October 2011 at 00:44. Reason: spelling

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greig View Post
    It's kind of worrying that they still do not have a grasp on how the car is going to perform from one race to the next, suggests they have not really solved anything with the chassis.
    I totally agree, the car was not right from day one, I was sitting on the Grand stand on the last corner going onto the pit straight in Albert Park and let me tell you I knew from the first practice lap that RBR had us ! the ferrari was going sideways around the corner... we need to rethink our aproach...

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    H'mm.. our car was not so good at Singapore and not too bad at Japan. The RB and McLyins were quick at both venues so still a bit of work to be done to get some consistency, never mind speed. The performance difference suggests the team doesn't really know the car, and at the tail end of the season, that's a worry.

    If the 2012 car design is going to be aggressive, suggesting some more extreme design elements, then I don't see much value in testing parts on the 2011 car, presumably which is quite different, except to show the opposition what we're planning. I don't want to sound pessimistic but...

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    Testing new parts on 2011 car suggests that we wont see much extreme changes on our 2012 car. If true than its not a good starting point in my oppinion but I wish I am completely wrong :)

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    I think there was some news report not too long ago stating that Ferrari will be changing their suspension system next year to pull rod. If its true, then I think that's quite a big change especially to the rear section design.

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    Quote Originally Posted by medeni73 View Post
    Testing new parts on 2011 car suggests that we wont see much extreme changes on our 2012 car. If true than its not a good starting point in my oppinion but I wish I am completely wrong :)
    Yeah... sounds exactly the opposite of what the team was saying how the car will be completely different.

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    they have never said it would be completely different. that would be idiotic, and the closest thing we have seen like that id this year's Virgin car.

    they have said that the new car will look different, and have a different concept, but this one will still be in essence a base.


    In Stefano Domenicali, we have a team boss who has proved to be a leader. - Luca diMontezemelo

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    This is from yesterday on the Ferrari website...

    Domenicali arrives tonight in Maranello, where he will meet up with Technical Director Pat Fry, as they both tackle a couple of days work on the design of the 2012 car before jumping on a plane once more, this time heading for Korea.
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    its going to be a long offseason.. i enjoy reading all this speculation... forza ferrari..

    i am not having high hopes for next year especially since we have not made strides ahead this year. My hope is that there is something fundametally wrong with the car this year that can be fixed with a new design for next.
    otherwise it doesnt look like small updates will change this thing around.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ferrari4life View Post
    its going to be a long offseason.. i enjoy reading all this speculation... forza ferrari..

    i am not having high hopes for next year especially since we have not made strides ahead this year. My hope is that there is something fundametally wrong with the car this year that can be fixed with a new design for next.
    otherwise it doesnt look like small updates will change this thing around.
    we are heading in the right direction for next year. This years car good platform, but as we know weak in the tyre warm up. Next years will not be having this problem
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    I believe Pirelli will have totally all new compounds for next year...

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    James Allen has an interesting article:
    http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2011/1...th-wow-factor/

    Ferrari chief designer Nikolas Tombazis has promised a more aggressive car from the Scuderia next season, as it looks to close the gap to the pace setting Red Bull.

    Over the winter of 2010/11 Ferrari went too conservative under the technical leadership of Aldo Costa, leaving some ideas untested in a generally risk averse strategy. McLaren went the opposite way with initially calamitous consequences, of the kind Costa was trying to avoid, but they changed direction before the first race and got the car on track. However they, like Ferrari, have been playing catch up all year.

    Meanwhile Red Bull had the best aerodynamics package, building on the pre-double diffuser design concept it launched in 2009 and improving all areas of the car. It has also been able to exploit the Pirelli tyres better than the opposition, particularly in qualifying. And with the pace of the car and front row grid slots, it has been able to make the race strategies work out pretty much every time.

    For 2012 then, Tombazis has opened up some more aggressive avenues of design and development which had been closed off by Costa. “A more aggressive approach has come about as the result of the analysis we carried out of the defeats we suffered over the past few years. We realised we had been a bit too conservative and had closed our minds to some strands of development. For the new car we have sanctioned and more aggressive working method on the aerodynamic front,” he said, explaining that some long lead time parts are already in production for the 2012 car.

    The rules don’t change much for next year apart from one key area – the blown diffusers will be banned and this will lose the cars a significant amount of downforce. Adapting and overcoming in that area will be the key to success in 2012.

    Tombazis says that the team will experiment with some new solutions aimed at the 2012 design during the remaining races of this year, for example they plan to test out a new front wing with a different functionality to the current one.

    “We have to try to learn as much as possible straight away,” says Tombazis. “Obviously we hope that these solutions will also be positive for these races.

    “I think that visually, the new car is fairly different to its predecessor but if it has a wow factor, as our team principal Stefano Domenicali thought, when he first saw the model, then I hope the wow factor will also be evident from the results. We have set ourselves ambitious targets, which we intend to maintain and so, on this front, I am quite optimistic.”

    Meanwhile influential Italian sports daily La Gazzetta dello Sport reports today that the senior management at Ferrari are “irritated” by race engineer Rob Smedley’s choice of words over the radio to Felipe Massa, where he called on him to “destroy” Lewis Hamilton’s race.

    Many fans feel that this story is a mountain being made out of a molehill by the British tabloid press to support their man Lewis Hamilton, who is facing criticism from other drivers. And there may be some truth to that.

    However Gazzetta reports that the bosses at Ferrari may not feel inclined to forgive him a second time, after he landed them in front of the FIA World Council over the team orders issue at Hockenheim last year. Ferrari was exonerated on that occasion and the rules banning team orders were dropped from the F1 Sporting Regulations.

    Smedley is highly regarded by other teams’ technical directors and would have a choice of UK based jobs were he to leave Ferrari.
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