Exotic engine maps to be banned from 2012

[Hermann]

In the last 24 hours it appears that a clarification has gone out from the FIA’s Charlie Whiting to all teams regarding exotic engine maps, to the effect that they aren’t allowed after the end of this 2011 season.

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2011/1...-to-designers/


Of course, teams could ask for 'reliability upgrades'.

[scuderiafan]

hope ross is happy now.

[Raz]

hope ross is happy now.

well.. if Merc get a 1-2 in Aus.. then maybe

[scuderiafan]

well.. if Merc get a 1-2 in Aus.. then maybe

lol hope not. maybe 3-4

[Greig]

Good news, and sensible approach to change the rules prior to the racing starting and not having the usual soap opera during the season But I am sure there will still be something appearing that causes a fuss. Interesting comments about the tractors front wing too

[Hornet]

I guess the engine reliability concern for Red Bull and Renault will magically disappear next year

[epiclyaddicted]

Interesting comments about the tractors front wing too

[Ste]

Good news, and sensible approach to change the rules prior to the racing starting and not having the usual soap opera during the season But I am sure there will still be something appearing that causes a fuss. Interesting comments about the tractors front wing too

[Tifosi]

Good news, and sensible approach to change the rules prior to the racing starting and not having the usual soap opera during the season But I am sure there will still be something appearing that causes a fuss. Interesting comments about the tractors front wing too

There's a good quiz question. What was the last year that no technical scandal errupted or technical rule clarification was required during the whole season?

Answers on a plain postcard (280 gsm non laminated) with no staples or folds please!

[Nova]

So, this means no throttle on the way the reno/rb have been using it? If thats the case, then that sort of shoots the exhaust thread thing to bits, dont it?
Didnt merc oppose this also?

[NJB13]

So, this means no throttle on the way the reno/rb have been using it? If thats the case, then that sort of shoots the exhaust thread thing to bits, dont it?

Not necessarily so. If RB can hide some sort of cheat for the start of the 2012 season, then, for the rest of the year, Horner would probably run the same line as this year - you can't enforce anything until the following year. Although I'd hope this time they wouldn't succeed.

[Greig]

Not necessarily so. If RB can hide some sort of cheat for the start of the 2012 season, then, for the rest of the year, Horner would probably run the same line as this year - you can't enforce anything until the following year. Although I'd hope this time they wouldn't succeed.

It's embarrassing reading your posts

[sagi58]

Not necessarily so. If RB can hide some sort of cheat for the start of the 2012 season, then, for the rest of the year, Horner would probably run the same line as this year - you can't enforce anything until the following year. Although I'd hope this time they wouldn't succeed.

He does have a point, if you look at the past few seasons, eh?

[peta_w]

It's embarrassing reading your posts

people entitle to have opnion and you need to learn polite.

[Greig]

He does have a point, if you look at the past few seasons, eh?

Give me some examples of other teams cheating then?

people entitle to have opnion and you need to learn polite.

Not when it's constant allegations against others cheating without foundation, embarrassing.

But as you say people are allowed to have an opinion and that is my opinion on his posts ever since Silverstone.

[Rob]

well.. if Merc get a 1-2 in Aus.. then maybe

[Rob]

Not necessarily so. If RB can hide some sort of cheat for the start of the 2012 season, then, for the rest of the year, Horner would probably run the same line as this year - you can't enforce anything until the following year. Although I'd hope this time they wouldn't succeed.

They will not be able to hide any sort of exotic engine mapping or use it for the EBD. As, the exhausts got to exit top of body work away from the diffusser or even the rear beam wing. So, they cannt cheat or hide any sort of EBD or anything like that to give them an advantge by using the diffuser.

[NJB13]

They will not be able to hide any sort of exotic engine mapping or use it for the EBD. As, the exhausts got to exit top of body work away from the diffusser or even the rear beam wing. So, they cannt cheat or hide any sort of EBD or anything like that to give them an advantge by using the diffuser.

Well, I'd agree that right now the FiA is stating that's their intention, and, I hope they execute it. But I don't share your faith. They stated the intention to ban DDD's in '09 and EBD's were supposed to be ended this year.

I read what you say the new exhaust rules will be next year, but, as of now the specifics of how the new rules are not defined. And even when there are rules that appear to be specific, and even when the FiA comes out and states rules are being broken, we have seen that does not necessarily mean the FiA will take action. Remember this year the FiA have a rule that requires them to introduce further load and deflection tests on any part that appears to move or is even "suspected" of moving.

[Greig]

DDD's were all new in 2009 the FIA did not state to ban them for 2009 in fact Ferrari went to court and the FIA ruled them legal (but you will say others cheated), they did for 2010, again the facts seem lost when it comes to your allegations and bitterness. Again the FIA did not attempt to ban EBD's in the 2011 rule book until Silverstone, but nevermind carry on embarrassing yourself, sad to see really.

Off course you will ignore this as the truth does not fit in well with your FIA is evil and all the rest cheat paranoia, totally childish from a grown man

[Rob]

Well, I'd agree that right now the FiA is stating that's their intention, and, I hope they execute it. But I don't share your faith. They stated the intention to ban DDD's in '09 and EBD's were supposed to be ended this year.

I read what you say the new exhaust rules will be next year, but, as of now the specifics of how the new rules are not defined. And even when there are rules that appear to be specific, and even when the FiA comes out and states rules are being broken, we have seen that does not necessarily mean the FiA will take action. Remember this year the FiA have a rule that requires them to introduce further load and deflection tests on any part that appears to move or is even "suspected" of moving.

with the exhaust exiting the top of the body work, there will be no need for off throttle mappings, as they will not (allowed, banned) feeding the diffusser. Hence no more EBD and "cheating"

[Hornet]

To be fair to Red Bull, blown diffuser is nothing new. Teams used to use it before they were forced to use the higher exit exhaust due to reliability problem. Its interesting to note that Newey, then at McLaren, was among the last to stop using blown diffuser, only stopping at the request of the engine manufacturer for reliability concerns according to an article at Scarbs. You could say Newey is one of the veteren blown diffuser designer around.

Anyway the blown diffuser we see today is merely revisiting an old idea, an idea that was never illegal or ever an issue until recently. Its not even a gray area as far as I know.

[NJB13]

with the exhaust exiting the top of the body work, there will be no need for off throttle mappings, as they will not (allowed, banned) feeding the diffusser. Hence no more EBD and "cheating"

I do hope you are right, but it will be interesting to see what the rule actually says. As I mentioned earlier, they said they were ending EBD's this year and said they were closing the front of the diffuser where the exhaust is blown in, yet, when they unveiled the new rules for this year, the diffuser front was closed, but there was an inexplicable 5cm opening left on either side. I hope when the actual rules come out they don't leave another 5cm opening somewhere in the exhausts

there will be no need for off throttle mappings

Surely you couldn't possibly mean these exotic engine mappings are using the moving engine to create an aero effect? I thought they were needed for reliability

[Hermann]

I do hope you are right, but it will be interesting to see what the rule actually says. As I mentioned earlier, they said they were ending EBD's this year and said they were closing the front of the diffuser where the exhaust is blown in, yet, when they unveiled the new rules for this year, the diffuser front was closed, but there was an inexplicable 5cm opening left on either side. I hope when the actual rules come out they don't leave another 5cm opening somewhere in the exhausts


Surely you couldn't possibly mean these exotic engine mappings are using the moving engine to create an aero effect? I thought they were needed for reliability

Both, of course.

I'm quite sure Newey is already working on a solution around this little 'handicap'.

[Greig]

As I mentioned earlier, they said they were ending EBD's this year

More lies, ignore ignore ignore LOL

[NJB13]

To be fair to Red Bull, blown diffuser is nothing new. Teams used to use it before they were forced to use the higher exit exhaust due to reliability problem. Its interesting to note that Newey, then at McLaren, was among the last to stop using blown diffuser, only stopping at the request of the engine manufacturer for reliability concerns according to an article at Scarbs. You could say Newey is one of the veteren blown diffuser designer around.

Anyway the blown diffuser we see today is merely revisiting an old idea, an idea that was never illegal or ever an issue until recently. Its not even a gray area as far as I know.

As you say the blown diffuser has been around for a long time, and wasn't illegal. I think the issue with it has been best put in LCdM's general argument that aeros form too much of F1. And I tend to agree on that point.

On the other hand, I tend to agree with the position Charlie Whiting took on the extreme overruns.

[NJB13]

Both, of course.

I'm quite sure Newey is already working on a solution around this little 'handicap'.

That's what I fear. saying your going to end something and doing it are different things. I remember reading an article on Scarbs that specifically mentioned the rule changes implemented at the start of this year to end EBD's. Found the article and here's the quote:-
Although the rules were revised for 2011 to try to prevent double diffuser and openings to allow the exhaust to blow inside the diffuser.

[Greig]

So you will take back your earlier comments with said quote nowhere did the FIA ban EBD's as they are doing this year, thanks

[kazi]

That's what I fear. saying your going to end something and doing it are different things. I remember reading an article on Scarbs that specifically mentioned the rule changes implemented at the start of this year to end EBD's. Found the article and here's the quote:-
Although the rules were revised for 2011 to try to prevent double diffuser and openings to allow the exhaust to blow inside the diffuser.

OH CMON!
Why on earth are you qouting another mans opinion as the truth? EBD's where NEVER banned. What was banned where the open fronted diffusers. Get your facts straight.

Read here for the difference of open and closed EBDs:
http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2010/1...lown-diffuser/

Read here for what is legal and what is not for 2011:
http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2011/0...and-diffusers/

Bonus read since you seem to believe only RBR used EBD at the start of this season:
http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2011/0...lown-diffuser/

[NJB13]

OH CMON!
Why on earth are you qouting another mans opinion as the truth?

Because I respect Scarbs knowledge.

EBD's where NEVER banned. What was banned where the open fronted diffusers. Get your facts straight.

I was bemoaning that they weren't banned. When they stated they were closing the front of the diffuser. Had they actually done that it would have ended blowing through the diffuser. But instead they left those 5cms on each side.

Read here for the difference of open and closed EBDs:
http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2010/1...lown-diffuser/

Read here for what is legal and what is not for 2011:
http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2011/0...and-diffusers/

Bonus read since you seem to believe only RBR used EBD at the start of this season:
http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2011/0...lown-diffuser/

Good articles, enjoyed them the first time round. I think that fire for Felipe was the only serious problem we had during the pre-season, back when things looked so much more promising for us

[Greig]

OH CMON!
Why on earth are you qouting another mans opinion as the truth? EBD's where NEVER banned. What was banned where the open fronted diffusers. Get your facts straight.

Read here for the difference of open and closed EBDs:
http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2010/1...lown-diffuser/

Read here for what is legal and what is not for 2011:
http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2011/0...and-diffusers/

Bonus read since you seem to believe only RBR used EBD at the start of this season:
http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2011/0...lown-diffuser/

Indeed but be as well talking to a brick wall