2012 Indian GP: Qualifying Thread

[Rob]

If would not support them, I would not be here. I would not join this forum after 2009 season but in "glory years"... I support them, but I will not celebrate results like this not when we are in this mess for so long and there is still no sign of light at the end of the tunnel.

And why it is out of date? Because it was not updated. And it will not update by itself. It's the people who taking care about things and when something is not performing, it is people's fault. My point is that blaming wind tunnel for so long is just wrong.

It flawed from the start, they had tight areas to design and and build it. At the time it was state of the art, but with RBR moving the goal posts so far apart in 2009-2010 with CFD and PIV simulation its hard to update that wind tunnel to that level, can only go so far before realising need a clean sheet of paper. Ferrari have been open about that and said it willl change and build a better 1 and state of the art 1, we just got to rely on Toyotas tunnel for now and for next year. The team nows the short comings of the F2012, and putting that right on the 2013 challenger, trust me

[Tifoso84]

If everybody at Ferrari would have the same kind of defeatist attitude as some of the so called "fans" here then Ferrari would be behind HRT right now. Fortunately all the people at Ferrari are fighters and they don't know the meaning of the word "give up".

Proud to be a fan of a team like Ferrari!

All you pessimistic people go see what's happening in Macca forum (if there even is such a thing)

[fronaldo]

Great racing?! What's to enjoy seeing one car never lose 1st place, Vettel will control from start to finish

so don't watch

[varun]

Please define the meaning of "disappointing season".

this is a FERRARI forum ..the oldest and most successful team in F1 and the as of now we have the best driver in F1 and still we are loosing races off track with development not on track.
Had alonso has a car like red bull....pheww..what all he could have done!
Some how even with all talk of being optimistic and everything...there is part of me telling that vettel will take it...i dont think many people here really still feel alonso can win the WDC.
Really sorry and sad for Alonso ..he is in peak of his career and years are passing with ferrari and he is loosing titles to bloody Cows!!
this is really FRUSTATING.................. :-&

[F2002]

new things? and what about the new things that didnt work?

what about front pull rod suspension?

so you knwo well all about development, you know about the reason why we arent fast as redbull , and we have the updates, and people dont like it just because we cant get 1 sec of improvement? oh please, why? the people working hard for the updates, and what? complaining? now let see if you work hard build smoething, and people doesnt like it, what are you gonna do? stop building it?

It's funny because I, like some others here I'm sure, have been in situations like that, when you really work hard and then you don't see the results you want. So your post evoked some memories, not necessarily good ones

I'll have to correct your phrase though: not "people doesnt like it", but "the track doesn't like it".

The track has its language, it speaks lap time.

[blaney1977]

this is a FERRARI forum ..the oldest and most successful team in F1 and the as of now we have the best driver in F1 and still we are loosing races off track with development not on track.
Had alonso has a car like red bull....pheww..what all he could have done!
Some how even with all talk of being optimistic and everything...there is part of me telling that vettel will take it...i dont think many people here really still feel alonso can win the WDC.
Really sorry and sad for Alonso ..he is in peak of his career and years are passing with ferrari and he is loosing titles to bloody Cows!!
this is really FRUSTATING.................. :-&

That's it in a nutshell he should be a 4/5 time world champion by now. The team have not produced for him

[Hornet]

Yep, Fernando was as bad as the car this qualifing

Meh, you just hate Alonso.

But fine if you want to criticize him. Just don't get defensive when people criticize Massa

[Rob]

this is a FERRARI forum ..the oldest and most successful team in F1 and the as of now we have the best driver in F1 and still we are loosing races off track with development not on track.
Had alonso has a car like red bull....pheww..what all he could have done!
Some how even with all talk of being optimistic and everything...there is part of me telling that vettel will take it...i dont think many people here really still feel alonso can win the WDC.
Really sorry and sad for Alonso ..he is in peak of his career and years are passing with ferrari and he is loosing titles to bloody Cows!!
this is really FRUSTATING.................. :-&

Fernando has signed to 2016-2017 so dont you think he can see something that will get him 1-2 more WDCs? All teams go through this, Williams. Mclaren, Ferrari. Our time will come again, plus we only 6 points behind, isnt over till last lap at Brazil. Anything can happen,...

[anuragiyer8989]

P5 clean side.....i say we can be P3 after turn 1 and then take out Hamster on the long straight!
We can do this!!! Also Felipe will block Button and Webber hopefully

[Kyss4k]

It flawed from the start, they had tight areas to design and and build it. At the time it was state of the art, but with RBR moving the goal posts so far apart in 2009-2010 with CFD and PIV simulation its hard to update that wind tunnel to that level, can only go so far before realising need a clean sheet of paper. Ferrari have been open about that and said it willl change and build a better 1 and state of the art 1, we just got to rely on Toyotas tunnel for now and for next year. The team nows the short comings of the F2012, and putting that right on the 2013 challenger, trust me

But if we knew that it is no go to update the old one, why did we keep using it? It just doesn't make any sense. We should be using Toyota's WT since the end of 2010 or start of 2011. 2 seasons are lost because of that.

[qb_marukochan]

It's funny because I, like some others here I'm sure, have been in situations like that, when you really work hard and then you don't see the results you want. So your post evoked some memories, not necessarily good ones

I'll have to correct your phrase though: not "people doesnt like it", but "the track doesn't like it".

The track has its language, it speaks lap time.

i m agreed with you, thanks for the correction.

yeas it speaks lap time, and then when our laptimes doesnt good at all, is it neccessary to throw up everything?

in case yo didnt read the edited (added) post

i dont want to makes argument what is a real fan, but please before you all guys say something, please think twice, as i said before, did our drivers get out of the car ? they still fighting with that car. but if you suggest tou our drivers to just sit and watch the race, and you know what it is. simple

if they dont want the championship, why did they develope the car? just racing with car that has been launch in OZ, i just dont like the word "ok its over"

[scuderia_nano]

Oh god we have been Red Bulls for a few weeks especially after a good mid season run. But to be honest.. Sibce Alonso came on board.. ID TAKE this year over any 2010 2011. . Hope Vettel blows up somethung or Hamilton crashing into him cz car wise they are all finishinf almost similar to one another as per Quali line up. Hoping 2010 repeats in reversed order :p

[NanoTheQuickest]

To keep things just short, I'm disappointed. Poor performance from the "all" team this weekend so far, car performance is the same, nothing has improved , drivers not on it (patience seems to be lost). I just hope tomorrow turns out to be a better GP weekend for us. (it usually better on Sunday anyhow > race pace looks up there)

Forza Ferrari.

[MP081984]

To all you here accusing people of glory hunting, false support, betrayal etc, let me tell you something... To truly support a team does not mean to just blindly follow them without being critical when they are not delivering the form they are expected to deliver (for 3 consecutive years). And for Ferrari the only expectation to every fan IMO should be to have a car that is capable of taking poles and winning races!
If you consider this to be to much, then what's the point of routing for Ferrari.
You would rather believe that all is just rosy and wait for miracles??? You might as well switch to Force India or Sauber...

High expectation and objective criticism!!! The only way to go...

[varun]

Fernando has signed to 2016-2017 so dont you think he can see something that will get him 1-2 more WDCs? All teams go through this, Williams. Mclaren, Ferrari. Our time will come again, plus we only 6 points behind, isnt over till last lap at Brazil. Anything can happen,...

Fine we can wait till 25th Nov also if you say so..but as u said about alonso getting 1-2 more WDC's--thats possible but ALONSO is in peak now and ferrari are in their slumber!!
and why is it always we are waiting for "Anything can happen"
Why cant we make things happen??
Just as red bull have done in last 3-4 races??

[wacc]

this is a FERRARI forum ..the oldest and most successful team in F1 and the as of now we have the best driver in F1 and still we are loosing races off track with development not on track.
Had alonso has a car like red bull....pheww..what all he could have done!
Some how even with all talk of being optimistic and everything...there is part of me telling that vettel will take it...i dont think many people here really still feel alonso can win the WDC.
Really sorry and sad for Alonso ..he is in peak of his career and years are passing with ferrari and he is loosing titles to bloody Cows!!
this is really FRUSTATING.................. :-&

Fighting for the title till this point in season that is not a disappointing season for me. By your definition the whole 2008 season would be disappointing too. I too would love to see the team and its drivers winning the titles, but disappointing season is rather something like 2009 or 2005.

[Hornet]

To all you here accusing people of glory hunting, false support, betrayal etc, let me tell you something... To truly support a team does not mean to just blindly follow them without being critical when they are not delivering the form they are expected to deliver (for 3 consecutive years). And for Ferrari the only expectation to every fan IMO should be to have a car that is capable of taking poles and winning races!
If you consider this to be to much, then what's the point of routing for Ferrari.
You would rather believe that all is just rosy and wait for miracles??? You might as well switch to Force India or Sauber...

High expectation and objective criticism!!! The only way to go...

In fact, I'd go as far as to say, I dare bet that no one here have any higher expectation of Ferrari that is higher than what Luca DM himself have. Luca DM is the man who was willing to pay Kimi million of dollars just to make room for Alonso 1 single year earlier. He wants to see Ferrari winning more than any of us here.

[Rob]

But if we knew that it is no go to update the old one, why did we keep using it? It just doesn't make any sense. We should be using Toyota's WT since the end of 2010 or start of 2011. 2 seasons are lost because of that.

Because at the time it wasnt known entirely the problems. Just be gratefull Ferrari have been open and expressed the problems, and starting to fix them.

[wacc]

Meh, you just hate Alonso.

But fine if you want to criticize him. Just don't get defensive when people criticize Massa

lol, I had wished Fernando could have join Ferrari as early as 2006 and I am more than happy that he is driving for SF. I just dont like his fans that are no real Ferrari fans saying bad things about Ferrari. The day Fernando is driving for other team I dont support him anymore.

[Hornet]

lol, I wished Fernando could join Ferrari as early as 2006 and I am more than happy that he is driving for SF. I just dont like his fans that are no real Ferrari fans saying bad things about Ferrari. The day Fernando is driving for other team I dont support him anymore.

I agree that its not right to constantly criticize Ferrari, but its important to note that both Alonso and Massa IS part of Ferrari, so while I can understand your dislike for people who divide the team and Alonso (I don't like it either), criticizing Alonso isn't making any sense because you will be criticizing Ferrari too, and you will be doing what these people are doing, dividing the team and the driver.

The same goes for other members in the team. I see people defending Stefano Domenicali while criticizing Alonso as if Stefano is more of a Ferrari than Alonso or Massa are. They are all the same, they are part of Ferrari.

[MP081984]

In fact, I'd go as far as to say, I dare bet that no one here have any higher expectation of Ferrari that is higher than what Luca DM himself have. Luca DM is the man who was willing to pay Kimi million of dollars just to make room for Alonso 1 single year earlier. He wants to see Ferrari winning more than any of us here.

So what's your point?? He is the team boss, its only logical...

[Greig]

What a bunch of spoilt brats we have in here at times, embarrassing.

[Ste]

What a bunch of spoilt brats we have in here at times, embarrassing.

[varun]

Fighting for the title till this point in season that is not a disappointing season for me. By your definition the whole 2008 season would be disappointing too. I too would love to see the team and its drivers winning the titles, but disappointing season is rather something like 2009 or 2005.

Yes we are fighting for the title courtesy ALONSO's superhuman efforts but also due circumstances(that favored us more) in each race--
Malaysia===WEATHER, alonso's great skills in rain, winning in pit lane(Vettel DNF)
Spain====Poor Q3 session for red bull and lewis getting a penalty!
Valencia===Vettel DNF else he would have win.
Silverstone===qualifying 1st(but in Wet)
Germany===qualifying 1st(but in Wet)
all other races were average or poor except MONZA...(where we could have won!!)

So i am just pointing that we were leading and fighting for WDC due to the circumstances even Alonso said that is was a "suprise" coming with a lead in WDC before Singapore Gp
And its just that our car is not good.
Note:with these points i am not expressing that what alonso did was a fluke but just it was all by chance bcoz of a poor car. I respect the man a lot ..
even more than schumacher!

[Hornet]

So what's your point?? He is the team boss, its only logical...

My point is nothing wrong about the fans having high expectation.

[fronaldo]

good luck for alonso and massa tomorrow

[Tifoso84]

lol, I had wished Fernando could have join Ferrari as early as 2006 and I am more than happy that he is driving for SF. I just dont like his fans that are no real Ferrari fans saying bad things about Ferrari. The day Fernando is driving for other team I dont support him anymore.

Yea, I feel the same way. As long as Fernando is a Ferrari driver, I love and adore him, but if he ever should go to any other team then my support for him stops right there. And it's true that some of his fanboys say horrible things about Ferrari and give all the credit only to Fernando. I seriously hate those Fernando fans.

[Kyss4k]

Yea, I feel the same way. As long as Fernando is a Ferrari driver, I love and adore him, but if he ever should go to any other team then my support for him stops right there. And it's true that some of his fanboys say horrible things about Ferrari and give all the credit only to Fernando. I seriously hate those Fernando fans.

Well, I am not Alonso fan (I hated him since 2006) but he deserves ALL the credit for this year. That's not about them being Alonso fans, that is just a fact. The car was (is) crap for 80% of the season and without him, we would be nowhere.

[M.K]

It ain't over till it's over. We have race tomorrow and three more races ahead.

[bonzo]

2012: Damage limitation
2013: Domenicali limitation