2012 India GP: We are racing against Newey!

[zorro666]

I just saw Fernandos post qualy interview and it says it all.
We are racing not against Vettel but against Newey the great man said... And he is 100% correct.

Haven't seen Nando so down since the beginning of the year that we were as fast as HRT.
Poor body language and not great optimism which was clearly visible.

Shame for Felipes sun glasses too (just a bit of fun!).

Forza Ferrari

[Ste]

Felipe*

[zorro666]

Indeed!

[wacc]

Red Bull have had the advantage in the resources, the know how and the nerve to use parts that weren't probably within the regulation. Good for them.

[Tifoso84]

I've said the exact same thing like a million times, but nobody ever listens to me. Red Cow is so dominant only...and ONLY because of Adrian Newey. Everyone else in that team is just a very small part of it, including finger boy. Take away Newey from Red Cow and they would be back to being a two-bit NOTHING again. All those wins and titles are Newey's.

[Hornet]

My opinion is, firstly yes, Newey is a great designer, and I think his strength is in aerodynamics. He have the uncanny ability to make wacky aero stuff like exhaust blowing effect work.

But, unfortunately Formula 1 today is restricted to aero only, which IMO, contributes to the problem. If Ferrari had an advantage in engine, we can't show it because development is freeze, and not only that. Engines are so restricted now, you can't do this, you can't do that, your rev is limited. So how are Ferrari engine going to shine given all these restriction?

Its true that aero was always important, but it should not be the only factor, and I think this is a weakness in F1 right now. There's just no engine freedom anymore.

[Ken]

Red Bull have had the advantage in the resources, the know how and the nerve to use parts that weren't probably within the regulation. Good for them.

I have made this point many times everything they have done is within the regulations or else the car would not be on the track.

It is fair to say they have "interpreted" the regulations better than all the other teams.

We just need to be as smart

[Alessandra]

I haven't seen the interview with Fernando and I'm surprised he said what he said, but only because he's usually more diplomatic. He must be really choked at the moment.

I agree with eveything said above re. Newey & the WDC and have been yelling it at anyone who cares to listen for ages. Three consecutive WDCs won by an engineer/ designer is not on.

It's not the same as MSC between 2000 - 2004 since he already had 2 WDCs to his credit with another team to proved his worth in more than one car (as has Fernando) and frankly, until Alonso came along, there wasn't really another driver on the track, in those years, who could shift him from the top of the podium.

I hope LDM is at this moment on his way to India with the promise of striking a gold medal (where is LDM by the way?) to be presented to FA, the best driver in an ordinary car, at the end of the season! Perhaps it should be awarded annually in the future if this Red Bull/Newey fiasco is to continue for years ahead.

[Greig]

MS won all his titles with Byrne, shall we put them down to Rory only?

[wisepie]

My opinion is, firstly yes, Newey is a great designer, and I think his strength is in aerodynamics. He have the uncanny ability to make wacky aero stuff like exhaust blowing effect work.

But, unfortunately Formula 1 today is restricted to aero only, which IMO, contributes to the problem. If Ferrari had an advantage in engine, we can't show it because development is freeze, and not only that. Engines are so restricted now, you can't do this, you can't do that, your rev is limited. So how are Ferrari engine going to shine given all these restriction?

Its true that aero was always important, but it should not be the only factor, and I think this is a weakness in F1 right now. There's just no engine freedom anymore.

I agree about too much aero influence and have said as much on several occasions but I still can't believe that both Ferrari and Mclaren can be so comprehensively beaten in development by Newey's skills alone, if the rules are so tight it shouldn't really be possible to extract that amount of advantage. I'm no expert but I smell a rat somewhere within RB's aero/exhaust that shouldn't perhaps be there, supposedly legal or not.

[scuderia_nano]

True said. I SAW the interview. HE WAS Smiling and indicated at the Redbulls front row lock out in 3 races. HE SAID We will have a better sunday and all isnt lost yet.

[kiwifella]

Well, not trying to cause argument or be negative, looks like we'll be bridesmaids again this season. I honestly cannot see us coming back from this, as you could see with Fernando's body language post qualy.

We struggled because of a poor design in the first instance, we've lacked vision in terms of upgrades, and for the 2nd season in a row we've blamed the wind tunnel again.....

We've obviously not matched the work rate/vision/go forward that RB's have had this latter part of the season, and I get the feeling that if Finger Boy wins tomorrow, I'd say that will be the killer blow for us. We're now relying on something to go wrong during the races now, its frankly just not enough.

Shame really, Fernando should by now be 4 or 5 times World Champion.

All we can do is hope for the best and...........again..........see if we can pick up a podium to at least keep ourselves in touch.

[Ken]

My opinion is, firstly yes, Newey is a great designer, and I think his strength is in aerodynamics. He have the uncanny ability to make wacky aero stuff like exhaust blowing effect work.

But, unfortunately Formula 1 today is restricted to aero only, which IMO, contributes to the problem. If Ferrari had an advantage in engine, we can't show it because development is freeze, and not only that. Engines are so restricted now, you can't do this, you can't do that, your rev is limited. So how are Ferrari engine going to shine given all these restriction?

Its true that aero was always important, but it should not be the only factor, and I think this is a weakness in F1 right now. There's just no engine freedom anymore.

Totally agree

Change the regulations on the front wing to make it much smaller and limit the number of extra elements that can be added.

Open up the regulations to allow more use of Ground effects and rear diffusers. Then we could get rid of DRS zones and have real driver to driver racing again.

Another point of the front wing is the cost including research and wind tunnel time, contrary to the FIA's wish to reduce costs.

[Hermann]

The RB is an aerodynamic beast, they have enough gimmicks to play around with to adept to the tracks/rule regulations, they have good drivers, and for Ferrari it would need a total miracle to beat them. I have said that months ago, and i see no reason to say something different now.

Of course its not all about Newey, but he seems to be the one with the visions; visions that get sorted, put into work, and realized on the car by a team of highly capable engineers working with a close to perfect equipment.

They had setbacks too, not everything they tried on the cars worked. But they were minor, and the car has such a good basis that is was always just a question of time to get it sorted.

What do we have? The best driver, well thats a plus but its doesn't count too much if we believe 80% of the success is the car. A team that had dominant times himself, the team with the longest tradition in F1, and a team pricipal who says 'nowadays the cars depend too much on aerodynamics' as in 'we don't have the right people for aerodynamics so we are not up to the challenge'.

For me this is not exactly a receipe for success. Of course Fernando is already receiving heavy critisism for those words, but he is right.

[wacc]

I have made this point many times everything they have done is within the regulations or else the car would not be on the track.

No, FIA has found too many things that were not legal, but only forced RB to change it for the next GPs.

[Nick Singer]

Red Bull have had the advantage in the resources, the know how and the nerve to use parts that weren't probably within the regulation. Good for them.

Ferrari are lacking an inspirational figure, a real genius of a designer, a visionary like Brawn. RB have Newey. We do not have anyone similar.

The whole aero/ wind tunnel/ CFD affair has been an absolute total and utter fiasco!

[bonzo]

If we lacked aero talent for 3 years, we should have hired it! If we had outdated windtunnel for 3 years we should have long repaired/updated it. Whose job is this? The team boss? Did we have a team boss for the past 4years? Was he doing his job? Obvoiusly NO. Did he live up to his promisses from end of 2011? NO. Then sack him for God's sake! How many more seasons Ferrari will have to "limit damages"? Isn't it better to eradicate the source of the damages rather than just limit them?

[Nova]

I think everyone should send their suggestions over to Ferrari. Im sure they havent thought of some of these.

[LightAmaterasu]

MS won all his titles with Byrne, shall we put them down to Rory only?

Just my opinion, but I think it's a bit different to now. Michael was a great driver, but he had a great team behind him that gave him the best car on the grid. I think with ferrari then the credit was to the team and not just to Rory or michael or any one person.

With RBR the same thing is happening now, but unlike ferrari i don't think they have a 'great' team, but they have a good enough one and as Newey plays a bigger role in everything i think that's all Newey needs. He's excellent and they have a good enough aero department. But take away Newey from the equation and the aero team won't be as good as they are. That's the point basically. Without newey they'd still be a good team, but not as good as they are. And that extra bit of performance they have is what's making everything so difficult, because without it they'd be on the same level of competitiveness and because they have this they're set apart from the rest of the top teams, no competition, always having some reserve speed to count on.. vettel needs a dominant car to win. Alonso just needs a car that's competitive enough with the one at the top, because he is the better driver.

And so i think alonso is right, this is sort of a war against newey.

[Nova]

What I havent seen this year from Ferrari is that huge jump that vaults
the team up there as Ive seen from Mac and RB..They both would be up there, then have a few bad races, but then be up there
again with their new parts working. We've sort of simply been hanging around 3rd to 6th places thruout the year with no parts introduced
thatve enabled us to jump the other other teams.

Whatever, RB is smokin right now, their car working to the max.

Id like to also add, Felipe is doing a great job..when they get his car setup right.

[Hermann]

I think everyone should send their suggestions over to Ferrari. Im sure they havent thought of some of these.

I'm sure they have. But maybe its not so easy to first find someone with visions like Newey, and its also not so easy to get people on board who are able to bring those visions into reality. The question i ask myself as well is: how is the working attitude inside the factory? How much freedom of ideas do the leading engineers have? This is not only about getting the right people on board, its also about work flow.

And that is a question of the right management. As much as i dislike Horner, he certainly has been very successful these last years getting the right people in the right places. And as much as i like and support Ferrari, i have to say that they seem to be a bit too old- fashioned, still, and a bit sluggish in their reaction to changing demands. You might not agree with me, but thats the impression i have.

[LightAmaterasu]

What I havent seen this year from Ferrari is that huge jump that vaults
the team up there as Ive seen from Mac and RB..They both would be up there, then have a few bad races, but then be up there
again with their new parts working. We've sort of simply been hanging around 3rd to 6th places thruout the year with no parts introduced
thatve enabled us to jump the other other teams.

Whatever, RB is smokin right now, their car working to the max.

Id like to also add, Felipe is doing a great job..when they get his car setup right.

I agree We could argue that it's because we don't have a genius like RB, but Mclaren did it too. That's what makes it confusing really.

[Ken]

No, FIA has found too many things that were not legal, but only forced RB to change it for the next GPs.

If you think back on the events you are suggesting, I think you will find that changes were forced on RB by complaints from other teams through the FIA. In a couple of instances the rules were rewritten part way through the season to clear up "misunderstandings".

The effect of which has been to make the regulations tighter and further limit the freedom to innovate, that is my opinion on it.

[FA fan]

Well I think Ferrari are reading some suggestions,a lot of guys on this forum are shouting Newey!!Newey!! And now Alonso said it..

[Ken]

Well I think Ferrari are reading some suggestions,a lot of guys on this forum are shouting Newey!!Newey!! And now Alonso said it..

Newy to Ferrari next year ??????????????????????????

[Rob]

We tried to get him the other year, didnt want to come. His wife said some degrading things about Italy, so, you know where they can go. We dont need him. If Ferrari, wanted to, and i mean IF, then go and make Peter Prodromou an offer he cannt refuse. But the team we got is tip notch, just needs time to gel and get tunnel going. While using the Toyota tunnel.

[LightAmaterasu]

We tried to get him the other year, didnt want to come. His wife said some degrading things about Italy, so, you know where they can go. We dont need him. If Ferrari, wanted to, and i mean IF, then go and make Peter Prodromou an offer he cannt refuse. But the team we got is tip notch, just needs time to gel and get tunnel going. While using the Toyota tunnel.

Nicely said.

Exactly. It's not easy to build a no.1 car, esp with all the WT issues we've been facing and especially when a rival team has struck gold. Any team needs TIME and it's not going to be done in a year or two. It's difficult because we want our team on the top, but really they need time and space to work. I'm sure they'll have the best car on the grid soon, because our team and their efforts deserve that. We just need to be patient and keep up the faith and keep supporting

[Axelsson]

Sleep well...that tomorrow we have to give it all.
579318_440649962660866_22528857_n.jpg

[Silent Bob]

My opinion is, firstly yes, Newey is a great designer, and I think his strength is in aerodynamics. He have the uncanny ability to make wacky aero stuff like exhaust blowing effect work.

But, unfortunately Formula 1 today is restricted to aero only, which IMO, contributes to the problem. If Ferrari had an advantage in engine, we can't show it because development is freeze, and not only that. Engines are so restricted now, you can't do this, you can't do that, your rev is limited. So how are Ferrari engine going to shine given all these restriction?

Its true that aero was always important, but it should not be the only factor, and I think this is a weakness in F1 right now. There's just no engine freedom anymore.

I agree about the engine freeze.... utterly idiotic. They should at least allow the teams to have a set number of engine updates... say three for the season where the teams can introduce updated engines, and/or engine parts.

[Tifoso84]

We tried to get him the other year, didnt want to come. His wife said some degrading things about Italy, so, you know where they can go. We dont need him. If Ferrari, wanted to, and i mean IF, then go and make Peter Prodromou an offer he cannt refuse. But the team we got is tip notch, just needs time to gel and get tunnel going. While using the Toyota tunnel.

Now that you mention it, yea I vaguely remember that his wife said something bad about Italy indeed. If they don't want us, then we don't need them! She thinks that she's too good for Italy?! That little *****
I wonder if Newey shares her dumb views?