Drive thru & 10 sec stop 'n go penalties

[slak]

What happened to these rules? It is so frustrating to see incidents under investigation only to be notified it will be dealt with after the race. Enforcing these rules yesterday would have enabled Alonso to finish higher up, with Webber and Perez under investigation.

[Katu]

on one hand i can understand this - it's difficult to make a fair decision during race when there's many things happening, on the other hand - they should be able to do it right away, because correcting race results or giving penalties for next race is lame

[Tobes]

Agree, hate the post race penalties, especially if they change the result of the race, all the incidents under investigation during the race should be decided before the end of the race, there are enough cameras and replays for the investigation panel to make a decision there and then, no doubt the decisions will occasionally be wrong, but like in football the ref has the final decision and that's that, there are some poor decisions, but we all accept the score at the final whistle stands, it's ridiculous that in an age of instant replays etc the results of a race can change, when I go to a race and watch the podium presentation I don't want to find out Monday the result has changed...!
Don't know of another global sport where you can watch the event live and not be sure of the result after it ends...

[Hornet]

If I recalled correctly, the FIA said something like the drivers wanted incidents to be investigated, and so there was a time when we saw many drivers being penalize during the race. It's almost guarantee that if there's a contact, someone is in for the chopping block, and it didn't feel right. It kind of interfere with the race as we see penalty being handed out too often when many incidents are just racing incidents.

So I think this delayed investigation will give the stewards more time to analyze the data, AND more importantly interview the drivers involve. The interview is something that you cannot do during racing. The interview will allow a more detailed investigation.

Unless a driver do something like Grojsean's move on Lewis last year which ended in a carnage, the occasional wing clipping is nothing more than racing incidents and I don't think there should be any penalty.

[EL_NANDO]

What happened to these rules? It is so frustrating to see incidents under investigation only to be notified it will be dealt with after the race. Enforcing these rules yesterday would have enabled Alonso to finish higher up, with Webber and Perez under investigation.

I disagree with these sometimes. Remember Alonso vs. Kubica at Silverstone 2010. Alonso passed Kubica off the track, but then whilst Ferrari were clarifying with the stewards whether Alonso had to give the place back, Kubica retired from the race.

This meant Alonso couldn't give the place back, and was then given a drive through during a safety car period, completely ruining his race. At least if a 20 second penalty was applied after the race Ferrari could have properly appealed. Instant decisions can sometimes be a problem.

Contrast with Valencia that same year when Hamilton overtook the safety car and it took around 20 laps before he received a drive through, and practically lost nothing.

Also I don't think anyone deserved a penalty yesterday, however much it would have helped Fernando.

[scuderiafan]

I think the main reasons for this is to allow the drivers involved to present their case after the race, which they can't do when decisions are made while the race is being run.

[Mrs Alonso]

I just wish there would be consistency. Have a punishment and stick to it instead of them seemingly just being picked at random each time.

[Alessandra]

I agree with much of above.
A penalty is not just for punishment it's a correction of a situation that's arisen as a result of foul play, deliberate or accidental .
Admittedly f1 , as usual, has its particular issues; the Grosjean/Alonso incident as an example. Nothing was going to rectify the situation for Alonso or Grosjean. But, returning a place on track which was achieved by 'foul play', must be applied ASAP because the ramifications may be considerable to more than one person and affect the outcome of a race for a number of teams/ drivers.

[Suzie]

I'd rather have a driver I supported take a penalty there and then rather than having to be penalised at the next race. Get the penalty over and done with so you can start the following GP with a clean slate.

[killer]

Agree, hate the post race penalties, especially if they change the result of the race, all the incidents under investigation during the race should be decided before the end of the race, there are enough cameras and replays for the investigation panel to make a decision there and then, no doubt the decisions will occasionally be wrong, but like in football the ref has the final decision and that's that, there are some poor decisions, but we all accept the score at the final whistle stands, it's ridiculous that in an age of instant replays etc the results of a race can change, when I go to a race and watch the podium presentation I don't want to find out Monday the result has changed...!
Don't know of another global sport where you can watch the event live and not be sure of the result after it ends...

Agreed. As things currently go the race stewards simply collect information during races (and hand out penalties after)--cameras can do that.

[Hornet]

Agreed. As things currently go the race stewards simply collect information during races (and hand out penalties after)--cameras can do that.

They interview the drivers too. It's important to hear the viewpoint of the drivers. They are, after all, the one who's driving at the edge of what physics allow. A little dust or wind can easily send the car in the wrong direction.

Hence racing incidents penalty should not be the norm, it should be the exception. The FIA have to make sure they've thoroughly investigate it before handing out penalties.

We were unlucky last Sunday, Alonso did a lot to finish P8 and we can't ask for more. There's no point wanting to finish higher from penalties that shouldn't happen.

[mirafiori]

They interview the drivers too. It's important to hear the viewpoint of the drivers. They are, after all, the one who's driving at the edge of what physics allow. A little dust or wind can easily send the car in the wrong direction.

Hence racing incidents penalty should not be the norm, it should be the exception. The FIA have to make sure they've thoroughly investigate it before handing out penalties.

We were unlucky last Sunday, Alonso did a lot to finish P8 and we can't ask for more. There's no point wanting to finish higher from penalties that shouldn't happen.

We are all disappointed after Sundays race, and up to now I personally had no opinion on the racing incidents during the race, but I agree with you Hornet, well said.

[Sonic Feathers]

I'd rather have a driver I supported take a penalty there and then rather than having to be penalised at the next race. Get the penalty over and done with so you can start the following GP with a clean slate.

Yip! Clean & simple. Otherwise the driver sits in the next GP fuming & "oh, here comes the reason for my ruined race to pass me. I'll make it difficult for the ass now". I say finish a race, even e.g. Championship winner like Brazil there & then by telling folks the electronic signals were retarded & the Marshals flags take precedent, here is the final outcome... Not wait 3 days till answers are given.

PS. Think we were lucky that Nando wasn't penalised, 'cos commentators always speak & next thing FIA penalizes. The Sky team had said "wow, that is so dangerous as he's racing round corners with no down-force' or something to the effect. It is only Alonsos' great skill which kept his car with open DRS on the track. Sure it wasn't a part in danger of falling off. But it could have made the entire car fall off the track & endangered other drivers, would have been their argument.

[raylinds]

They interview the drivers too. It's important to hear the viewpoint of the drivers. They are, after all, the one who's driving at the edge of what physics allow. A little dust or wind can easily send the car in the wrong direction.

Hence racing incidents penalty should not be the norm, it should be the exception. The FIA have to make sure they've thoroughly investigate it before handing out penalties.

We were unlucky last Sunday, Alonso did a lot to finish P8 and we can't ask for more. There's no point wanting to finish higher from penalties that shouldn't happen.

It also gives the driver the opportunity to make up an excuse. It is better to judge by what can be seen on camera and the data than what someone says, that may or may not be the truth.

[killer]

They interview the drivers too. It's important to hear the viewpoint of the drivers. They are, after all, the one who's driving at the edge of what physics allow. A little dust or wind can easily send the car in the wrong direction.

Hence racing incidents penalty should not be the norm, it should be the exception. The FIA have to make sure they've thoroughly investigate it before handing out penalties.

We were unlucky last Sunday, Alonso did a lot to finish P8 and we can't ask for more. There's no point wanting to finish higher from penalties that shouldn't happen.

But that's why they pick former drivers as stewards: to get a driver's view point of things from experienced drivers.

BTW, I don't take this view somehow wanting more from the last GP.

[Tobes]

They interview the drivers too. It's important to hear the viewpoint of the drivers. They are, after all, the one who's driving at the edge of what physics allow. A little dust or wind can easily send the car in the wrong direction.

Hence racing incidents penalty should not be the norm, it should be the exception. The FIA have to make sure they've thoroughly investigate it before handing out penalties.

We were unlucky last Sunday, Alonso did a lot to finish P8 and we can't ask for more. There's no point wanting to finish higher from penalties that shouldn't happen.

I disagree and agree...

Not interested in hearing the drivers plead their undoubted innocence, no driver is going to admit fault if it means there is a possibility of a penalty of some sort, if there is dust or wind then take that into consideration, but apply the penalty during the race so when the race is over it's over, even last lap incidents can be dealt with by having a drive thru or stop-go on the last lap, but with the stop-go box at the start of the pit lane, when we all watch the podium that is the final result, no changes, if you feel hard done by for any reason, tough, get over it and move onto the next race, people would just accept (as we all do with football) that is that...

Now the bit I wholly agree with is that penalties should be exception, there are far too many incidents that are punished that I think are just racing incidents, this is racing, there are going to be incidents, if there's not then they're not trying hard enough, if they get punished for racing then the sport will become very sterile...

[SS454]

I dont like post race penalties, but they also need to stop the racing incident penalties. Either way how you slice it, I still feel the penalties have been inconsistent. Or maybe I am just thinking of the recent years, not only 2013

[killer]

Not interested in hearing the drivers plead their undoubted innocence, no driver is going to admit fault if it means there is a possibility of a penalty of some sort, if there is dust or wind then take that into consideration, but apply the penalty during the race so when the race is over it's over, even last lap incidents can be dealt with by having a drive thru or stop-go on the last lap, but with the stop-go box at the start of the pit lane, when we all watch the podium that is the final result, no changes, if you feel hard done by for any reason, tough, get over it and move onto the next race, people would just accept (as we all do with football) that is that...

Yes. It will essentially be "he should have left room" vs. "he turned into me" all the time. With all the data available to the stewards, they ought to be able to make a call (or a non-call) when it matters the most.

Now the bit I wholly agree with is that penalties should be exception, there are far too many incidents that are punished that I think are just racing incidents, this is racing, there are going to be incidents, if there's not then they're not trying hard enough, if they get punished for racing then the sport will become very sterile...

Hornet, I agree with you on this. Tobes just put it more eloquently than I ever could have. Thanks, Tobes.