F14-T- Development & News

[bondilad]

I'm not sure how they are going to do that, unless they revisit the fuel limit as well as technical rules in order to encourage the engine running at high RPM again.

But anyway, I really don't think such changes will occur this year. We have the rules regarding 5 engines limit so it's difficult to allow sweeping changes. The engine freeze will still remain. They have agreed to allow some performance changes next year, so that's where it will start, if anything.

Ok. So that means we are basically stuck with this PU for at least another year. Watched my first grand prix last year in shanghai when alonso won. Best decision ever made

Bought tickets again this year.....

[Unbannable II]

Something positive...

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/112988

[tifosi1993]

Very lucky......

[Tony]

HubMar.18 (GMM) Bernie Ecclestone has vowed to get to work on making Formula One loud again.

The F1 chief executive said he is "horrified" by the purring tones of the new turbo V6 era, arguing it will drive race promoters and spectators away.

Ecclestone was critical of the new engine formula long before the first 1.6 litre 'power unit' was fired up, but his latest comments follow Melbourne race organisers' claim the low volume may even be a breach of contract.

"It's not what we paid for. It's going to change," Australian Grand Prix chairman Ron Walker told Melbourne's Age newspaper.

Walker said he has spoken to his friend Ecclestone already, while Ecclestone admitted he has been on the phone to FIA president Jean Todt.

"What I've said is that we need to see whether there is some way of making them sound like racing cars," the 83-year-old Briton told the Telegraph.

"I don't know whether it's possible but we should investigate.

"I think let's get the first few races out of the way and then maybe look to do something. We can't wait all season. It could be too late by then," said Ecclestone.


I was wondering if ferrari were to modify the sound produced by these engines, can we actually use this opportunity to claw back on some of the performance deficit to Merc engines?

Or it would be impossible since the engine development is frozen for this year?

That exerpt was in the context of breach of contract:

Andrew Westacott, CEO of the AGPC, told Fairfax Radio that the new, quieter sound was “a little bit duller than it’s ever been before,” and that given the premium a nation must pay to host F1 (Australia paid a reported $45 million for this year's race), the organization plans to study the contracts for any apparent breaches: “There has probably been some,” Westacott said.

AGPC chairman Ron Walker, who remains close friends with Ecclestone, was a little more outspoken, telling Melbourne newspaper The Age that F1’s leader was “horrified” by the quiet drone. “It's clearly in breach of our contract,” Walker said. “I was talking to him (Ecclestone) last night and it's not what we paid for. It's going to change.”

Fans, too, were distressed by the lack of noise. And what little noise there was sounded more like a herd of elephants with bad flatulence.

For the AGPC, tackling Ecclestone on the noise issues will likely be a tough task, even if it discovers legitimate grounds. It’s more likely that the AGPC is going public on its issues as a way to negotiate a lower promoter’s fee for 2015; earlier this month both Ecclestone and Walker claimed to be in the final stages of negotiation, and if a contract hasn’t already been signed, making a stink now may offer some much-needed leverage over F1's supremo.

Walker thinks other promoters will be as upset as he is regarding the neutered sound, and given Ecclestone’s apparent dismay on the matter, as well as the angry fans, a change is likely to be in the works – although it won't come quickly.

This might give Ferrari and Renault an "excuse" to play around with the engines....

http://ca.autos.yahoo.com/blogs/moto...175238816.html

[WS6TransAm01]

That exerpt was in the context of breach of contract:

Andrew Westacott, CEO of the AGPC, told Fairfax Radio that the new, quieter sound was “a little bit duller than it’s ever been before,” and that given the premium a nation must pay to host F1 (Australia paid a reported $45 million for this year's race), the organization plans to study the contracts for any apparent breaches: “There has probably been some,” Westacott said.

AGPC chairman Ron Walker, who remains close friends with Ecclestone, was a little more outspoken, telling Melbourne newspaper The Age that F1’s leader was “horrified” by the quiet drone. “It's clearly in breach of our contract,” Walker said. “I was talking to him (Ecclestone) last night and it's not what we paid for. It's going to change.”

Fans, too, were distressed by the lack of noise. And what little noise there was sounded more like a herd of elephants with bad flatulence.

For the AGPC, tackling Ecclestone on the noise issues will likely be a tough task, even if it discovers legitimate grounds. It’s more likely that the AGPC is going public on its issues as a way to negotiate a lower promoter’s fee for 2015; earlier this month both Ecclestone and Walker claimed to be in the final stages of negotiation, and if a contract hasn’t already been signed, making a stink now may offer some much-needed leverage over F1's supremo.

Walker thinks other promoters will be as upset as he is regarding the neutered sound, and given Ecclestone’s apparent dismay on the matter, as well as the angry fans, a change is likely to be in the works – although it won't come quickly.

This might give Ferrari and Renault an "excuse" to play around with the engines....

http://ca.autos.yahoo.com/blogs/moto...175238816.html

If Bernie is going to loose money because fans turn away and the venues reduce the contract amounts he is going to be livid. Don't get between the troll and his bridge... I mean money.

This could be good! 2015, we are back to NA V12's and no fuel amount or flow regulations lol. Oh I wish!

F1 is a spectator sport, and if as a fan you can't hear the cars, whats the point. My parents were at Monza in 2012 and said the volume on the main strait was almost to the point of pain lol. That is awesome! That is what it should be!

There is no way to make today's engine louder, its already unruffled, the turbo baffles the exhaust and unless you remove the blockage in the exhaust, how will you ever make the exhaust note louder.

I an mot a Bernie fan, but I am glad someone else thinks the cars sound like turds.

[djmorin27]

i remember in the early eighties going to the canadian gp twin turbo v6 engines were alot better and louder than now or just remove the turbo altogether and force the teams to run the exhaust the same way as now side by side on top of the trani like ferrari did in 1982 i bet they would be a little screaming engine

[WS6TransAm01]

i remember in the early eighties going to the canadian gp twin turbo v6 engines were alot better and louder than now or just remove the turbo altogether and force the teams to run the exhaust the same way as now side by side on top of the trani like ferrari did in 1982 i bet they would be a little screaming engine

yes, but with 1/2 the power. Whats the point, the cars will be 20 seconds a lap slower. I don't see a way they can make 600ish hp from an NA 1/6ltr.

[icedeepan]

On the point about sound..I was at the Australian GP and got this video from the outside of turn 2. Quite a big difference from 2013 especially if you are trackside!

[alfaromeo]

Hello everyone, I am new to the forum from Slovenia and I'm passionate Ferrari fan for over 15 years . The Forum has read more than 5 years and I am very satisfied with the information they get from other online forum . Given the season and the previous especially with Alonso , I am disappointed especially with this year's poor start f14t in Australia . Why ? Ferrari is a company that is engaged in the manufacture of super sports cars and with that produced one of the best engines in the world. For this reason, I was a big 2014 season optimistic that Ferrari with the new 1.6 engine , allowing it to benefit themselves . Turns out it was just the opposite , because we have seen what the domination of the Mercedes team . But I think that Renault has also improved drive unit as Ferrari , despite the problems in this year's tests . Given what conversations sound of the 1.6 engine sucks because these engines remained as they were too expensive development . I do have one question why in the engine department at Ferrari no longer Paolo Martinelli , which has done excellent V10 and V8 engine at the time of Michael Schumacher .

[AfterLife]

On the point about sound..I was at the Australian GP and got this video from the outside of turn 2. Quite a big difference from 2013 especially if you are trackside!

Thanks for sharing. Lovely sounds. Better than V8 IMO.

[Ste]

On the point about sound..I was at the Australian GP and got this video from the outside of turn 2. Quite a big difference from 2013 especially if you are trackside!

Thanks for sharing.

I don't think there's anything wrong with the sound aside from the volume. They're nice to listen to but need the raw loudness we had before.

On another note, boy do these things seem to accelerate quickly, they're propelled like a rocket out of that corner.

[Tony]

On the point about sound..I was at the Australian GP and got this video from the outside of turn 2. Quite a big difference from 2013 especially if you are trackside!

In the link I posted above there is actually a link comparing the sounds taken from virtually the same spots.... the sounds are very different but ultimately it doesn't really bother me... I mean listening to a V12 was much different than the V8's the sport had last year...

[Kiwi Nick]

During the race, I noticed that, when it was deployed, you could easily hear the safety car over the sound of the F1 cars. It struck me as really odd.

[AfterLife]

The sound is not loud when tv shows cockpit cameras.

[hrc5555]

Dont't feed the troll.
They are attention xxxxxxs and they feed on others attention. That makes them feel important.
They are trolls due to low selfesteem.

[Kiwi Nick]

Television directors can pot up the ambient sounds so that the engines sound just as loud regardless of the actual sound. It is only when there is some sort of benchmark, like the sound of the big AMG engine in the Mercedes safety car.

[GrndLkNatv]

I don't understand, Stefano does not know what is he talking about or how do you explain his words?

Stefano is not technical and what I wrote is mathematically proven.. Please move on....

[Dino]

Thanks for sharing. Lovely sounds. Better than V8 IMO.

You must be joking no?????

[Kyss4k]

You must be joking no?????

Where can I sell my ticket

[AfterLife]

You must be joking no?????

I don't like the screaming sound of V8 to be honest. What i love about new power units is that they aren't screaming, instead they are roaring like lion

[GrndLkNatv]

I don't like the screaming sound of V8 to be honest. What i love about new power units is that they aren't screaming, instead they are roaring like lion

For me the V8 harmonics were beautiful and I miss the V10 and V12's even more. These Turbos sound like my Stihl weed wacker. The way F1 is going, I fully expect John Deere and Caterpillar to have entries here soon.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2_kZjoBP88

[GrndLkNatv]

Paolo is retired.. These days it's Luca Marmorini, Dave Salts, etc..

Hello everyone, I am new to the forum from Slovenia and I'm passionate Ferrari fan for over 15 years . The Forum has read more than 5 years and I am very satisfied with the information they get from other online forum . Given the season and the previous especially with Alonso , I am disappointed especially with this year's poor start f14t in Australia . Why ? Ferrari is a company that is engaged in the manufacture of super sports cars and with that produced one of the best engines in the world. For this reason, I was a big 2014 season optimistic that Ferrari with the new 1.6 engine , allowing it to benefit themselves . Turns out it was just the opposite , because we have seen what the domination of the Mercedes team . But I think that Renault has also improved drive unit as Ferrari , despite the problems in this year's tests . Given what conversations sound of the 1.6 engine sucks because these engines remained as they were too expensive development . I do have one question why in the engine department at Ferrari no longer Paolo Martinelli , which has done excellent V10 and V8 engine at the time of Michael Schumacher .

[Jas]

Im glad Charlie whiting is sticking to his guns atleast SO FAR, it reminds me of red bull at spa few years ago going against the camber advice of Pirelli...and then complaining on race day under safety grounds!

[The Architect]

I like the way the announcer begins the 2014 part with "What a disaster". It really lacks any of the drama of the V8s, where you could hear the cars a long time before they appeared.

[Kiwi Nick]

I like the way the announcer begins the 2014 part with "What a disaster". It really lacks any of the drama of the V8s, where you could hear the cars a long time before they appeared.

The new car just aren't loud enough. There may be some good tone there, though that's debatable. But with the turbo acting as a muffler and the little 1.6 engines barely pushing any exhaust air, it is really pretty pathetic. Then add in all those sick whizzing and whining MGU noises and it is downright AWFUL!

The 2014 race didn't sound much louder than a typical motorway at high traffic.

[NickEice]

Back on topic of development, I think the fixed gear ratios are going to have a big part in circuit to circuit competitiveness. I forget what team I saw but they had quite long gears and were still in 7th at the end of the pit straight. Williams however was close to the limiter in 8th. Could this explain their ability to pass in the race with the shorter gearing but will be a detriment on the higher speed circuits? Perhaps we struggled to pass Hulkenberg because our gearing was too long for Melbourne? Just a thought.

[schuy]

When you can have a conversation with someone that's standing a few meters away with no ear plugs and the cars and going past, there is something wrong there. The sound is horrendous, especially if the safety car is louder. They also had the car comparison between the f1, v8 supercar and a Mercedes road car, and the sound of the f1 v8 just makes u stand up and take notice it just puts these 2014 cars to shame. A lot of people in the crowd were laughing at just how crap these cars sound. I fear we are going to loose a lot of supporters if this continues.

[FF1]

Hi,
I am a big ferrari and formula 1 fan but i hardly post anything.. This question is for GrndLkNatv as it seems that you have some great knowledge,plus u r an engineer and it seems that u know people in ferrari who r working on this seasons formula.. my question is or rather hope is, why Ferrari dint release any pictures of their 2014 engine. Is there really an advantage over mercedes, are Ferrari still confident about their engine or performance or has it all changed after pre season practice and teh first race. Was it a guess from Ferrari that their engine is superior or do they still believe it is the best. I have this gut feeling that our PU is the best and we will be champions this year n in the future.. just need some hope.. Thanks

[windwaves]

Have found this in the Autosport forum:

Bla bla bla bla

[bondilad]

ferrari engine overweight by 13k !!!

Mar.19 (GMM) One of Ferrari's main problems is that its all-new 2014 engine is overweight.

That is the claim of the German magazine Auto Motor und Sport, who said customers Sauber and Marussia are also struggling with a 'power unit' that weights 13 kilograms too much.

Correspondent Michael Schmidt said the overweight Ferrari caught even the Maranello based team by surprise, having successfully argued against a further increase in the minimum car-plus-driver weight of 691 kilos for 2014.

Fernando Alonso finished just fifth in Melbourne.

"I have 12 points more than Vettel and Hamilton, which is a positive," the Spaniard said, "but I was missing 35 seconds to Rosberg.

"That must give us pause," added Alonso.

Indeed, technical boss James Allison admits: "Our competitiveness was not acceptable in Melbourne."

Slimming-down the Ferrari engine might prove difficult, as in the wake of the end-February 'freeze' deadline, changes can only now be made for safety, cost or reliability reasons.

The FIA's Charlie Whiting revealed that all three F1 engine makers, including the troubled Renault but also dominant Mercedes, have already applied to the FIA to make changes.

"Ultimately, it's for us to decide," he said.


How could this be possible? I thought we were the lightest. Again that was a rumor and so is this.