Ferrari president says Formula 1 simulators are a joke

[vcs316]

Ferrari president Luca di Montezemolo has slammed Formula 1's reliance on simulators as a 'joke'.

With F1's recent strict in-season testing ban having forced teams to rely on ever more complicated simulator technology, di Montezemolo thinks the time has come for a rethink.

He believes that the expense of simulators is now such that serious consideration should be given to a wholesale return to testing as it would be better for teams - and cheaper.

"It is a joke," said di Montezemolo during a lunch with media at Fiorano. "We have been forced to invest a huge amount of money in these terrible machines, artificial, instead of testing here [at Fiorano] and Mugello.

"If somebody has no money to do tests, it is better to race in GP2, in go karts or go and play basketball. I want to do testing to first of all give new drivers the possibility to drive cars and get experience.

"But I also want to give more opportunities to the public because from one race weekend to another it is silent in F1. There is nothing, nothing.

"Testing is also a good opportunity for the sponsors, to call the public. And tests are less expensive than building and developing every month the terrible simulator. This is something we have to discuss for the future."

Although di Montezemolo is aware that F1 costs are too high, he believes restricted testing dumbs F1 down - something he is vehemently against.

"I think in soccer if you want to compete in the Champions' League, you have to buy good players, you have to train sometimes even five times in a day. This is competition," he said.

"I think that it is ridiculous that in F1, from one side, we are not allowed to test, and from the other side we are forced to spend a huge amount of money in the windtunnel in which we develop aerodynamics that I cannot transfer any of to my [road] cars.

"I don't want it to seem that I am a conservative old fan of F1. I think if we were allowed to do more testing, the scandal of the tyres [in 2013] would not have happened because even for Pirelli it is very difficult as they cannot do too many tests."

F1's testing ban has been relaxed for 2014, allowing a number of in-season tests to take place following grands prix during the year.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/111960?

[Umbria]

Bravo Luca! Perfectly said, F1 should not be dumbing itself down because some teams can't afford to test.

[OSS EL BOSS]

"If somebody has no money to do tests, it is better to race in GP2, in go karts or go and play basketball."

[WS6TransAm01]

If Ferrari had the proper sized apendeges, they would just run the car at the track day and night. When the other teams protest or the FIA try and say something, simply answer "if you sanction us, we will leave F1"

I doubt the FIA or Bernie will call their bluff.

There is no F1 without Ferrari.

[Rob]

If Ferrari had the proper sized apendeges, they would just run the car at the track day and night. When the other teams protest or the FIA try and say something, simply answer "if you sanction us, we will leave F1"

I doubt the FIA or Bernie will call their bluff.

There is no F1 without Ferrari.

[Petronius]

Bravo Luca! Perfectly said, F1 should not be dumbing itself down because some teams can't afford to test.

FIA should provide a test track for formula teams where testing could take place whenever needed. This should be a part off participation fee in F1.

Ferrari has the track in Fiorano off its own, where Ferrari can do the same thing. Where is the problem?

The real deal is done on track, where the ultimate development off equipment futures is done, not the simulator. Mr LdM is once again right on spot. Question is how to organize test possibility for the rest off the teams. Ferrari has already everything needed.

[Greig]

Anyone tell me how many young drivers we let test for us when there was unlimited testing?

[ManFromMilan]

Anyone tell me how many young drivers we let test for us when there was unlimited testing?

Good question, but...

...with regards to saying the right thing, finally Luca is coming around and showing true leadership with comments that can only start the new season off in a good mindset and positive outcome.

[stefa]

Those joke simulator has cost Ferrari 4 titles in a row for Red Bull....

[Greig]

Those joke simulator has cost Ferrari 4 titles in a row for Red Bull....

I thought it was the wind tunnels fault?

[racingbradley]

Simulators, wind tunnels, DRS, KERS ban the lot.:xmascool:
Let's get back to testing, testing......
Let the other teams give young drivers plenty of experience so that there is a decent crop for Ferrari to take their pick!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HE HE :xmasbiggrin:
As for the red cars, race drivers want to drive them and test like Michael did...........................

Ho Ho well said Luca :xmaswink::xmaswink::xmaswink:

[stefa]

I thought it was the wind tunnels fault?

Yes, that also. But my thought was that because Ferrari didn't invest at right time in this aria, they later payed huge price for it...

[Nero Horse]

Simulators, wind tunnels, DRS, KERS ban the lot.:xmascool:
Let's get back to testing, testing......
Let the other teams give young drivers plenty of experience so that there is a decent crop for Ferrari to take their pick!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HE HE :xmasbiggrin:
As for the red cars, race drivers want to drive them and test like Michael did...........................

Ho Ho well said Luca :xmaswink::xmaswink::xmaswink:

Well said you too mate!

Except that we would still need a wind tunnel, cause you can't really design a good race car without having a proper wind tunnel.

[Hornet]

From my understanding, designing any vehicle from aircraft to race car involves all stages from computer design, wind tunnel testing, to on track testing. Each stage contributes differently. Therefore it's important to find the right balance between simulation and real world testing. As far as in season testing is concern, there is almost no real world testing, which is wrong. That would be like coming up with a new aircraft design, testing it in the wind tunnel, and immediately sell them to your customer expecting it to work. We certainly need more in season testing.

If smaller teams like Torro Rosso doesn't want to test, then they probably should race elsewhere

[impactX]

Just Luca being Luca.

The rules are the same for everyone else. I doubt the things Redbull learned from the simulator can be transferred to their drinks either. With all the money or resources we have, we should have been able to adapt to rule changes faster than every one else.

[tifosi1993]

Its absolutely unreal to think that you are not allowed to test any parts of your car in real world because some other teams can't afford it. It's like saying clubs like ManU / Real Madrid shouldn't be allowed to buy new and expensive players because other clubs cant afford them. I hope we will the return of in-season testing but as always, It’s unusual to get a common sense decision in F1......

[Hornet]

Just Luca being Luca.

The rules are the same for everyone else. I doubt the things Redbull learned from the simulator can be transferred to their drinks either. With all the money or resources we have, we should have been able to adapt to rule changes faster than every one else.

Well Luca isn't blaming the rules for our struggle, but rather pointing out the flaw in the state of the sport today.

Real world testing is something you have to do regardless of whether you are building a race car or a space ship to the moon. Red Bull would test every bit they can too if the rules allow, this is something the top teams will do because they care about actual racing.

The only people who doesn't care about it are probably the smaller team who are more interested in attending more races instead of testing just for the extra money. You can't shape the entire sport around these people.

[impactX]

Agreed, but one does not have to look so far to see that manufacturers like BMW, Honda and Toyota pulled out of the sport because F1 costed too much.

We spent a huge amount of money in the windtunnel but we also get a bigger sum of money compared to the other teams because of the favorable terms in the Corcorde Agreement. Jean Todd, who capitalise on the amount of testing we could do that led to Ferrari's success, is not going to let things slide now that he is at the helm of the FIA.

[Winter]

It`s easy for Luca to say that teams with no money for testing should go to GP2 , since Ferrari get lots of money for just being Ferrari.

[Greig]

It`s easy for Luca to say that teams with no money for testing should go to GP2 , since Ferrari get lots of money for just being Ferrari.

Or by being a very profitable business?

The top teams have been hampered so we can have the likes of Caterham and Marussia, do they really add value to the sport?

[Hornet]

Agreed, but one does not have to look so far to see that manufacturers like BMW, Honda and Toyota pulled out of the sport because F1 costed too much.

We spent a huge amount of money in the windtunnel but we also get a bigger sum of money compared to the other teams because of the favorable terms in the Corcorde Agreement. Jean Todd, who capitalise on the amount of testing we could do that led to Ferrari's success, is not going to let things slide now that he is at the helm of the FIA.

Well I'm sure those companies have significantly larger budget than the current back end teams, yet we do not see them returning to Formula 1. These companies are actively involved in auto racing, I believe there are other factors that drove them away. Toyota was one of the big spenders, but their results were disappointing.

Luca does acknowledge that there is a need to keep cost in control though, he just doesn't think they are going about the right way.

And extreme cost cutting certainly isn't going to attract the right companies such as those you mentioned. We need to address why they are not interested in F1. I believe it goes beyond cost, might have something to do with large performance gap and they cannot justify spending all those money while still ended up mediocre.

It`s easy for Luca to say that teams with no money for testing should go to GP2 , since Ferrari get lots of money for just being Ferrari.

:xmasrolleyes:
In any auto racing, testing is important. If you have no money for testing, you probably shouldn't be involved in auto racing. Formula 1 needs serious companies with actual auto racing program, not just anyone looking to make money.

[Tifoso]

He's probably right. So man up and tell Bernie that he's using the test tracks. Enzo is probably rolling in his grave over the investment wasted.

[Nero Horse]

Agreed, but one does not have to look so far to see that manufacturers like BMW, Honda and Toyota pulled out of the sport because F1 costed too much.

BMW, Honda and Toyota pulled out because they didn't get the quick success and glory they were looking for. That's the problem with these big manufacturers, they expect to be on top immediately and then win titles every year and as soon as they realize that it's not going to be a walk in the park, they simply pull the plug. I'm sure that right now Merc is contemplating of doing the same thing soon, if they fail to win any titles in the next 2-3 years. Those big car companies have no patience whatsoever. They're like little kids who always only want to win every game and if they can't, then they throw a tantrum and go home crying. Ferrari is the only big car manufacturer who has admirably had the patience and sensibility to stay in F1 for so long, through good times and bad times. Ferrari understands that in order to be successful in F1 you need to be patient, build the team and wait for your moment, not quit as soon as things get tough.

[Poltergeistes]

1, Yes it easier for Luca to call for more tests, since he runs Ferrari, a never ending money making machine. Having said that, this doesn't make it less of a point.

Toyota, Honda etc... they have that huge chunck of money, but F1 racing is not to them what it is to ferrari, the only reason we have road ferraris at all, is because it helps finance the main goal the company (religion) always had and has, which is racing, and racing at the top motorsport racing.

2, If you don't agree with luca's statement, wether it's because of budget, or an unfair fight with smaller teams.

Here is the main reason why testing should come back:

Sebastian Buemi "tests" his new front suspension, during a race weekend in China, with all that comes with the F1 circus right there present. When I saw that footage all I thought was "this is why they used to test new components during their private TRACK tests during the season". Because luckly the Chinese circuit is new, well designed, and extremely safe, now imagine if that same thing happened during the free practice for Monaco for example, realistic it could end up injuring not only drivers but stewarts, rescue crew that is onsight, but also the spectators.

Exploding tyres, I can't use an example on this one, because it happened too many times, in too many places with too many different drivers, it's ok to get puncture, it would even be ok if one or another tyre did that, but it was many, in a single race, with shreds of tyres flying everywhere, from the front wheels towards the driver's head, then towards the driver that is behind, which by the way, had they not have instincs of wild cats, would have hit them and cause some serious trouble. the tyres were getting destroyed in such a wild fashion, it even posed danger to the stewarts on the tracksides.

This is how engineering and invention works, you think it up, than you simulate such piece, to see if it has the potential to go to the next and most important part which is have that machinery do in real life what they designed it to do.

The space race between the USSR and USA might have started with pencils on papers, but it certainly didn't end in one astronaut in Russia and then another in America sitting on a chair with a joystick on their hands and a screen in front of them, this was just an important part like in simulation and such, the last checks, BEFORE the real deal happened, which was ultimately rockets being launched to space with men inside.

I absolutely loved Luca comparing the F1 racing world to that of the champions league of football, there are huge teams, but there are also small teams, with tight money, if would be ridiculous if UEFA decided to call a meeting with every team from the champions, and saying " Ok the financial gap is too big, lets deflate the balls of the biggest teams, so the underdogs will have a chance of winning". they don't do that, because they understand that, some are there to win it, some are there just to be there (and that is by itself a great achievement) everyone has to play with the hand they are dealt with.

I'm not saying let's go back to the first 5 years of the milenium, when I'm pretty sure ferrari must have track tested every day, but can't we really find something in between?

If they do a reasonable amount of testing, everybody wins as Luca pointed out, sponsors, fans, teams, the simulators will still play a role, nobody is saying it shouldn't, so why real track testing shouldn't play an equally important role?

It's upsetting to see how many drivers have done well in gp2, F3 and so on, but because of the lack of testing we don't even get to watch them get their chance in f1, they can only bet all their chips to grab a place on the starting grid, which obviously don't have space for too many drivers, they don't get the chance to drive around performing tasks for the cars and teams so they can evaluate the new drivers abilities, and not their sponsors pocketbooks.

As for the young guns out there, not every driver comes winning right off the bet, for instance, wether you liked Massa or not, we would never see what he could become had Ferrari not taken a chance on him as a test driver after his less than clean rookie season in F1.

There is one word that is used to describe the top racers always, it's like one of the ten commandments of the drivers which is : "adaptation".

So how can you adapt yourself to a situation when that situation never presents itself?

[RedRebel40]

I think Luca is 6 years too late to make these comments.

[aroutis]

Just Luca being Luca.

The rules are the same for everyone else. I doubt the things Redbull learned from the simulator can be transferred to their drinks either. With all the money or resources we have, we should have been able to adapt to rule changes faster than every one else.

Luca being Luca , being right.
Let's put it this way, Real Madrid cannot be the same with say the smallest team in CL.
Real has unlimited resources whereas that smallest team may (or may not) even have an owned field to play in.

So right now, perhaps we should demand Real not to use their own field (and all other teams too) because the underdogs should have a chance for 'the good of the sport" and all that.

I am sorry but I never agreed with these rules and I am not about to start now, and even if I agree that RBR does a better job, it proves absolutely nothing.

Ferrari sould not be stripped the right to use its own resources, resources it heavily invested on with its own money. These rules are stupid and I am not saying this because I support the team, but because they target the big teams and yes, Ferrari - probably most of everyone else.

LcDM said it right. I wish he also did something to force things.

[impactX]

If Ferrari did not agree, we could have veto'ed it rather than whining about it after the fact.