Raikkonen has faith Ferrari will deliver winning car in 2015

[Kiwi Nick]

The points table proves that Alonso can drive the F14T better than Kimi can. Might be next years car suits Kimi and Vettel (if he's our next driver) and they'll be quicker. I'm hoping a new direction in car design will make us more competitive.

+1

[Nova]

Reading threads that go off topic for 6 pages is like going to the dentist...

[Winter]

The points table proves that Alonso can drive the F14T better than Kimi can. Might be next years car suits Kimi and Vettel (if he's our next driver) and they'll be quicker. I'm hoping a new direction in car design will make us more competitive.

I agree, but at the moment it's not enough to make the car more suitable for Kimi. Even without his this seasons problems with front end/ understeer, he wouldn't be where he, us and Ferrari would like him to be. At best, he would be more or less where Alonso is I think.

The cap to Merc engines has to be smaller in next season.

[Alonsomaniac]

Well you just proved my point. One driver is willing to drive around a problem, the other is trying to fix it. I'm not trying to bash Alonso or protect Kimi, just stating that their may be some good coming out of this. If kimi can give the engineers a direction to fix the car, it will benefit BOTH drivers. What's so hard to understand?

No, BOTH drivers wanted it to be fixed ofcourse and BOTH gave their input. BOTH wanted a better car, no doubt about that. But as long is it was not fixed, Fernando managed to find a way to drive the car while Kimi had much less success in doing that. Do you really think Fernando was satisfied with a car he could only get to 5th or 6th place?
What's so hard to understand about that?

[AfterLife]

No, BOTH drivers wanted it to be fixed ofcourse and BOTH gave their input. BOTH wanted a better car, no doubt about that. But as long is it was not fixed, Fernando managed to find a way to drive the car while Kimi had much less success in doing that. Do you really think Fernando was satisfied with a car he could only get to 5th or 6th place?
What's so hard to understand about that?

Well said

[Winter]

No, BOTH drivers wanted it to be fixed ofcourse and BOTH gave their input. BOTH wanted a better car, no doubt about that. But as long is it was not fixed, Fernando managed to find a way to drive the car while Kimi had much less success in doing that. Do you really think Fernando was satisfied with a car he could only get to 5th or 6th place?
What's so hard to understand about that?

Off course the car has not been good enough for either of them, but Kimi has struggled with understeer almost whole season now.

I've not heard Alonso complaining about issues with front end. As far as I know he prefers little under steer. Most complains I've heard from Alonso has been about lack of power.

A good car would be balanced car, which could be made to be little under or over steering with a set up work. Unfortunately F14T is not a car like that. As Allison said, both drivers has been giving similar feedback, he has also said that Kimi has issues with front end/ under steering which can't be solved during this season.

The car is bad for both, but even worse for Kimi, just my thought don't ask sources

[ManFromMilan]

No, BOTH drivers wanted it to be fixed ofcourse and BOTH gave their input. BOTH wanted a better car, no doubt about that. But as long is it was not fixed, Fernando managed to find a way to drive the car while Kimi had much less success in doing that. Do you really think Fernando was satisfied with a car he could only get to 5th or 6th place?
What's so hard to understand about that?

[KimiBot]

Abu Dhabi GP Preview – Plenty to fight for
http://formula1.ferrari.com/video/ab...w-plenty-fight

[Katu]

Off course the car has not been good enough for either of them, but Kimi has struggled with understeer almost whole season now.

I've not heard Alonso complaining about issues with front end. As far as I know he prefers little under steer. Most complains I've heard from Alonso has been about lack of power.

maybe you haven't heard Fernando complaing so much, because every time he says something negative about the car, he gets crucified. oh and if you do not have sources, how you know Fernando prefers understeer?

[Ed Harley]

Drivers preferences regarding the handling of a car has been discussed and analyzed by several experts over the years and not one of them has come up with a comment which has "Alonso" and "oversteer" in same sentence, quite the opposite.

[Katu]

has Fernando himself ever stated that? i do not give a damn what somekind of experts say

[Ed Harley]

Indeed, what do experts know.

[FFFerrari]

has Fernando himself ever stated that? i do not give a damn what somekind of experts say

He has told it at least a few times in SKY TV interviews that he prefers understeer to oversteer, but ideally the car should be neutral.

[Katu]

Indeed, what do experts know.

you say experts, i'm (armchair) expert, does that mean my opinion counts really?

[Ed Harley]

I really don't know what your level of expertise about armchairs is.

[Kiwi Nick]

oh and if you do not have sources, how you know Fernando prefers understeer?

All you have to do is watch his in car video. He pushes the front end into corners in a style very different than 90% of the drivers in F1. Of course, you would need to be able to recognize what he is doing when you see it.

[Winter]

maybe you haven't heard Fernando complaing so much, because every time he says something negative about the car, he gets crucified. oh and if you do not have sources, how you know Fernando prefers understeer?

"The car is bad for both, but even worse for Kimi" That was the part without sources and only my opinion. And it also was the part you didn't bother to quote

[Nova]

I really don't know what your level of expertise about armchairs is.

Whats an "arm"chair?

[KimiBot]

[AfterLife]

http://www.oddee.com/_media/imgs/art...rari-chair.jpg

That is lounge.

[AfterLife]

Whats an "arm"chair?

I am not sure if you really want the meaning but:

armchair experts are some people who talks about something from their home cozy armchair without worrying if they are right or wrong.

[Silent Bob]

No, BOTH drivers wanted it to be fixed ofcourse and BOTH gave their input. BOTH wanted a better car, no doubt about that. But as long is it was not fixed, Fernando managed to find a way to drive the car while Kimi had much less success in doing that. Do you really think Fernando was satisfied with a car he could only get to 5th or 6th place?
What's so hard to understand about that?

It's hard to understand that you're so blinded for your love of your favourite driver that you don't get what people are saying. Maybe following Kimi's recommendations will make the car faster.. is this bad? Maybe if Kimi gives the engineers a new development path BOTH drivers will be quicker.
Maybe it's time to step back and understand what you're reading... not every post is a hit against your idol. A quicker car will benefit the whole team.

[Silent Bob]

maybe you haven't heard Fernando complaing so much, because every time he says something negative about the car, he gets crucified. oh and if you do not have sources, how you know Fernando prefers understeer?

I think it's pretty much common knowledge,. just like most know that Kimi prefers more oversteer, which means a very responsive front end (just in case).

has Fernando himself ever stated that? i do not give a damn what somekind of experts say

Well then maybe it's just senseless for anyone to post an opinion other than the one you believe in.

[Silent Bob]

I really don't know what your level of expertise about armchairs is.

Class. Got coffee all over my desk.

[Ed Harley]

Sorry about that.

[Katu]

I think it's pretty much common knowledge,. just like most know that Kimi prefers more oversteer, which means a very responsive front end (just in case).

common knowledge is also that one shouldn't try to go down the water drain, yet they still do it. common knowledge proves nothing
http://www.express.co.uk/news/weird/...etrieve-iPhone

[Alonsomaniac]

It's hard to understand that you're so blinded for your love of your favourite driver that you don't get what people are saying. Maybe following Kimi's recommendations will make the car faster.. is this bad? Maybe if Kimi gives the engineers a new development path BOTH drivers will be quicker.
Maybe it's time to step back and understand what you're reading... not every post is a hit against your idol. A quicker car will benefit the whole team.

First of all Alonso is not my idol. I am a Ferrarifan who haappens to have Fernando as a favourite driver. I get what people are saying but I prefer to listen to what Ferrari, Fernando and Kimi are saying.
You say following Kimi's recommendations might make the car quicker. Well, he has had a whole season to do that, but it did not happen. Neither did Fernando's, the car just was not good. So why would this suddenly change when Fernando leaves? Do you think Kimi then will suddenly see the light?

[Silent Bob]

First of all Alonso is not my idol. I am a Ferrarifan who haappens to have Fernando as a favourite driver. I get what people are saying but I prefer to listen to what Ferrari, Fernando and Kimi are saying.
You say following Kimi's recommendations might make the car quicker. Well, he has had a whole season to do that, but it did not happen. Neither did Fernando's, the car just was not good. So why would this suddenly change when Fernando leaves? Do you think Kimi then will suddenly see the light?

No. I don't think Kimi has finally seen the light, but he has worked with Allison before so maybe they can give us a decent car next year. Like I said, it's not a knock against Alonso if someone can give insight on how to make something better.
As a Ferrari fan first and foremost..why are you getting all defensive when I suggest that a new path might be a good thing. The last few years have shown us that staying with the current philosophy hasn't worked.

[Katu]

well current years' philosophy has been - sack everyone

[Alonsomaniac]

No. I don't think Kimi has finally seen the light, but he has worked with Allison before so maybe they can give us a decent car next year. Like I said, it's not a knock against Alonso if someone can give insight on how to make something better.
As a Ferrari fan first and foremost..why are you getting all defensive when I suggest that a new path might be a good thing. The last few years have shown us that staying with the current philosophy hasn't worked.

That the current philosophy hasn't worked is clear. Only I think it's not a drivers problem. I think the cause lies much deeper, in the whole developmentphilosophy within Ferrari. That is something drivers can't solve. We both know that Fernando and Kimi are great drivers, Fernando even considered the best of the grid by many. And still these two experienced drivers could not make the change....they pinpointed what the problems were, but Ferrari was not able to respond to that in an adequate way.
The only luck Ferrari had was that Fernando could more or less adapt himself to the car as it was, otherwise both drivers would have had a terrible season. That he is able to do that also meant the end of Massa with Ferrari, because they simply could not believe it was the car. Now Kimi has shown that it was not a problem with Massa, he has the same misery......so the problem is the car, not the drivers.
You can change the drivers line-up now, but as long as nothing basicly changes in the development area, the problem will not go away.
Besides that, ever since the testban, drivers influence on the development has become much smaller, there simply is no time. The car has to be good from the beginning.
What we saw this year were two unhappy drivers, one who found a way to drive the car and one who didn't. Does that mean Fernando is so much faster than Kimi? No, of course he isn't under normal circumstances, only in this car he is.
Now we think Vettel will come alongside Kimi. Will this change anything? I'm afraid it is again up to the developmentdepartment to build a driveable car, because otherwise next season could be even worse. Because we all know Vettel is, unlike Fernando, not a man who can drive a car that has fundamental problems.
So that's why I think Fernando and Ferrari parting ways is a very bad idea, at least for Ferrari.