Felipe 40 & Raikkonen 39

[Ferrarichamp]

Kimi wasn't great in 2008, sorry.

[Greig]

Ferrari won the constructors' title in 2008 in case you forgot, and that was with Kimi having a poor season, Massa throwing away points in Malaysia, etc.

Like how you totally ignore Heikki not performing....wonder why.

[Greig]

Kimi wasn't great in 2008, sorry.

Maybe you need to rewind, Kimi performed pretty well until the team backed Massa, if Kimi has not been hit by Lewis in Canada, exhaust go in France and a spin when leading at Spa then he would have won the title...

[Ferrarichamp]

Like how you totally ignore Heikki not performing....wonder why.

Heikki was an average driver in the 2nd best car, of course he didn't perform well.

[Greig]

Heikki was an average driver in the 2nd best car, of course he didn't perform well.

Well that explains why we won the WCC. Not because we had the best car.

What on earth makes you think the McLaren was 2nd best?

[Ferrarichamp]

Maybe you need to rewind, Kimi performed pretty well until the team backed Massa, if Kimi has not been hit by Lewis in Canada, exhaust go in France and a spin when leading at Spa then he would have won the title...

Makes you wonder why Ferrari wanted end his contract 1 year early then. Usually you're the first to say Kimi is an overrated driver, maybe you should rewind and read some of your posts on the matter.

[Greig]

Makes you wonder why Ferrari wanted end his contract 1 year early then. Usually you're the first to say Kimi is an overrated driver, maybe you should rewind and read some of your posts on the matter.

Erm 2009 happened after 2008 last time I checked, and that's when Ferrari decided to end his contract not in 2008 duh. Not sure where I have said Kimi is not over rated in these posts either, oh yeah cause I never.

[Ferrarichamp]

Not sure where I have said Kimi is not over rated in these posts either, oh yeah cause I never.

[Greig]

Maturity clearly not a strong point then.

[Ferrarichamp]

Maturity clearly not a strong point then.

Memory is clearly not yours.

[Greig]

Memory is clearly not yours.

Let's just deal with what you said as that is what we are debating, let's not debate things I have NOT said as that would just be stupid.

For clarification not once in any post in this debate did I mention if I think Kimi is over rated or not, you have simply ran out of points and are trying to divert from your errors. My opinion on Kimi does not change the fact that he did perform in 2008.

[Ferrarichamp]

quoting Greig, 8th March 2011:

http://www.thescuderia.net/forums/sh...t-return-to-F1

'Pedro still made Kimi look very over rated never mind points = facts, we all seen the races, and Kimi was never a dominant driver over anyone. Pressure is always on Ferrari win or lose, Kimi did nothing to change that IMO. And what did it matter he is the first one after MS? like MS was the beginning? I don't see how that means much in the grand scheme of things to Ferrari. Massa would have won the title in 2007 had we thrown our weight behind him instead of Kimi.'

I could probably dig out many more, no point though.

[Greig]

quoting Greig, 8th March 2011:

http://www.thescuderia.net/forums/sh...t-return-to-F1

'Pedro still made Kimi look very over rated never mind points = facts, we all seen the races, and Kimi was never a dominant driver over anyone. Pressure is always on Ferrari win or lose, Kimi did nothing to change that IMO. And what did it matter he is the first one after MS? like MS was the beginning? I don't see how that means much in the grand scheme of things to Ferrari. Massa would have won the title in 2007 had we thrown our weight behind him instead of Kimi.'

I could probably dig out many more, no point though.

Not quite sure what you are trying to achieve? I still think Kimi is over rated and that has nothing to do with you saying he did not perform in 2008. It would be easier for you just to admit he did perform in 2008 rather than seeking to look for things I never said.

Again my opinion on Kimi does not change the fact he did perform in 2008. I could say he is a loser a waster or whatever and it would still not change the fact he did perform in 2008.

[Ferrarichamp]

It would be easier for you just to admit he did perform in 2008 rather than seeking to look for things I never said.

So what period were you talking about when you said he only had 1 good drive in 18 months?

[Greig]

So what period were you talking about when you said he only had 1 good drive in 18 months?

eh?

[Ferrarichamp]

eh?

'1 good drive in 18 months does not make him anything close to being a top driver in his era. He was overated and we found out the hard way '

post #70
http://www.thescuderia.net/forums/sh...-a-farce/page3

[Greig]

'1 good drive in 18 months does not make him anything close to being a top driver in his era. He was overated and we found out the hard way '

post #70
http://www.thescuderia.net/forums/sh...-a-farce/page3

Again eh?

Love you searching around looking for things I said like it changes what you said LOL it's a bit flattering. I will still tell you he is over rated if you want?

[Ferrarichamp]

It doesn't change anything I said, it does point out your contradictions though.

[Greig]

It doesn't change anything I said, it does point out your contradictions though.

So Kimi did perform in 2008.

[ManFromMilan]

if Kimi has not been hit by Lewis in Canada

If i remember correctly, he did quite well in the championship until the infamous kamikaze incident in the pits.

[Ferrarichamp]

So Kimi did perform in 2008.

But only half the season right?

[ManFromMilan]

But only half the season right?

Compared to Heikki not performing at all in 2008. It takes two scoring drivers to win a WCC.

[Greig]

But only half the season right?

But you just said I am contradicting myself? make your mind up......

[Ferrarichamp]

Compared to Heikki not performing at all in 2008. It takes two scoring drivers to win a WCC.

and above all it takes a fast car.

[Ferrarichamp]

But you just said I am contradicting myself? make your mind up......

You said in this thread he performed in 2008, which suggests the whole season. Yet in the past you said he only had 1 good drive in 18 months, I assume that's 18 months over two seasons, 2008 and 2009? If so, you have contradicted yourself have you not?

[ManFromMilan]

and above all it takes a fast car.

Agreed, like the one Heikki had, but could not utilize to it's fullest potential.

[Greig]

You said in this thread he performed in 2008, which suggests the whole season. Yet in the past you said he only had 1 good drive in 18 months, I assume that's 18 months over two seasons, 2008 and 2009? If so, you have contradicted yourself have you not?

Yes I have, I like you forgot he did perform in 2008 and that is why now I realise I was wrong in the past, now you can admit the same because he did perform in 2008.

[Ferrarichamp]

Agreed, like the one Heikki had, but could not utilize to it's fullest potential.

Well Heikki ended up 7th in the championship that year with the fastest car according to you. I would call him average but he must have been awful if the car was that good.

[Greig]

Well Heikki ended up 7th in the championship that year with the fastest car according to you. I would call him average but he must have been awful if the car was that good.

He was awful, did you even watch the 2008 season?