2018 Italian GP Monza: RACE

**FerrariFan** · 2nd September 2018, 15:19

Originally Posted by ManFromMilan

First of all Hamilton can only win when the car is the best and the team makes him #1, Alonso can win or come close in not the best equipment on the grid.

Alonso won't come back....so yes bring in Verstappen

He won today in a slower car. Nearly got pole in a slower car yesterday.

Again, you guys have very short memories from the red bull days.

Remember Canada when he spun it on the last lap and lost the race, remember brazil 2012 when he spun it on lap one in the final race of the season and then had to push his newey rocketship up the grid to get the title.

Not elite level

**Rishu** · 2nd September 2018, 15:20

Originally Posted by prancing horse

It is not just about being fast over 1 lap
It is about race management. Seb has that in abundance especially when in the lead.
Look at Kimi today. Yes he was faster over 1 lap but his race management is non existent

That’s the problem with Vettel, he wins only from first row & then take a lead. His race craft has been question mark

**nani_s23** · 2nd September 2018, 15:20

Originally Posted by Hornet

After seeing today's race, I just wished that Ferrari had used Kimi to give Vettel a slip stream in qualifying instead.

We can see today how Mercedes used team play, they are dead set to do anything to win the title.
It didn't matter if Bottas ended up behind Max, his objective was to force Kimi to ruin his tires, and were successfully.

This is who we are up against, and sometimes you need to fight fire with fire.

Not that I wish to see Ferrari making such huge sacrifice, but I think the team can improve when it comes to playing the team game. We've had several missed opportunity now.

They r missing the title too..!!

**Ferrarichamp** · 2nd September 2018, 15:21

so fake pit stops are allowed? I don't know anymore as the rules are constantly changed..

**mwk360** · 2nd September 2018, 15:21

Originally Posted by tifosi1993

You seem determined to make LeClerc no.2 driver. What makes you so sure that Vettel will beat him?

I dont , would love it if ferrari had two actual fast drivers to give mercs hell instead of merc only planning around vet . not even ham considers kimi a threat. maybe leclerc will wake seb up and push him otherwise he will be eaten by leclerc or viceversa, the same old formula is not working and having zero team orders makes it 2 v 1 in the championships

**abbottcostello** · 2nd September 2018, 15:21

+1
Surprised Lewis didn't give Bottas a big kiss right on the lips for all he did for him!

Originally Posted by Hornet

IMO we lost because Merc played a better strategy.

**DelMar** · 2nd September 2018, 15:21

Originally Posted by FerrariFan

Hamilton lost a championship on the final race of the season with a race win. Thats not getting smoked.

Vettel wasnt even close to riccardo.

I dont know why you lot are suprised, its like you forgot 2012 when alonso took him to the wire in a car that was almost 0.5 seconds a lap down at times.

He cannot race with hamilton, when are you going to smell the coffee.

The same Hamilton who had the best car in 2012 and finished 100 points behind both of them :)

Button achived P2 in WDC in 2011. The best Lewis achieved in WDC was P4 during his time with Button.

**ManFromMilan** · 2nd September 2018, 15:22

Originally Posted by FerrariFan

He won today in a slower car. Nearly got pole in a slower car yesterday.

Again, you guys have very short memories from the red bull days.

Remember Canada when he spun it on the last lap and lost the race, remember brazil 2012 when he spun it on lap one in the final race of the season and then had to push his newey rocketship up the grid to get the title.

Not elite level

Funny....his car did not look slower today at all, just in qually yesterday.

**FerrariFan** · 2nd September 2018, 15:22

Originally Posted by Rishu

That’s the problem with Vettel, he wins only from first row & then take a lead. His race craft has been question mark

Uys
Bingo. Hes a front runner, not a great racer, always vunerable when it comes times to race someone.

Imagine him vs someone like verstappen in equal cars, hed get murdered out there, cant race with those guys

**mizf1** · 2nd September 2018, 15:23

Originally Posted by nani_s23

I wonder why kimi didn’t give space to vettel ... when he had a big lock up in turn 1???
If vettel was in the lead, he would have built a gap to ham definetly.

Totally team fault.

Team too scared to impose team orders for some reason, Germany was a classic example. Kimi on different strategy but held up Vettel for numerous laps costing his valueable time even when threat of rain was coming.

When it did rain, Seb tried to claw the time back by pushing too hard and lost the win

**mwk360** · 2nd September 2018, 15:24

Originally Posted by Ferrarichamp

so fake pit stops are allowed? I don't know anymore as the rules are constantly changed..

the loophole is they can wait 3-4 laps outside before they pit and can use the excuse that "the problem seemed to go, data showing differently etc" and not even do a pitstop, ferrari havent done anything like this yet. we've seen mercs are also capable of screwing up strategy but ferrari never does anything surprising so they have it under control, chess game where they are 2 moves ahead

**ManFromMilan** · 2nd September 2018, 15:24

Originally Posted by abbottcostello

+1
Surprised Lewis didn't give Bottas a big kiss right on the lips for all he did for him!

The roggering will come later, we all know who the bitch is at Merc

**FerrariFan** · 2nd September 2018, 15:24

Originally Posted by DelMar

The same Hamilton who had the best car in 2012 and finished 100 points behind both of them :)

Button achived P2 in WDC in 2011. The best Lewis achieved in WDC was P4 during his time with Button.

He had massive reliability problems. I actually watched the entire season. Mclaren were a mess, absolutely nothing to do with his driving and infact he left them the next season.

**nani_s23** · 2nd September 2018, 15:24

Originally Posted by mizf1

Team too scared to impose team orders for some reason

Don’t know why they r scared

**mwk360** · 2nd September 2018, 15:25

Originally Posted by ManFromMilan

Funny....his car did not look slower today at all, just in qually yesterday.

yup

**mwk360** · 2nd September 2018, 15:25

Originally Posted by nani_s23

I wonder why kimi didn’t give space to vettel ... when he had a big lock up in turn 1???
If vettel was in the lead, he would have built a gap to ham definetly.

Totally team fault.

yup

**Schumiklub** · 2nd September 2018, 15:25

Any comments from Seb?

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

**DelMar** · 2nd September 2018, 15:25

Originally Posted by FerrariFan

He had massive reliability problems. I actually watched the entire season. Mclaren were a mess, absolutely nothing to do with his driving and infact he left them the next season.

He had the same reliability as Vettel, both had 2 mechanical DNFs and finished 100 points down with a faster car. They even both had one start from back due to quali fuel infringement.

**Otakukim** · 2nd September 2018, 15:26

Originally Posted by Rishu

That’s the problem with Vettel, he wins only from first row & then take a lead. His race craft has been question mark

The problem with vettel is not race craft, speed. His problem is he tAkes these huge risks. Look at hamilton when in a sticky situation he backs off because he knows that damage or a dnf is bad for his chances. He thinks the long term. Vettel makes these great overtakes but they do bite him. He needs to know that finishing second or third is better than getting a dnf. Live to fight another day. Thats how chanpionships are won

**abbottcostello** · 2nd September 2018, 15:26

Originally Posted by Ferrarichamp

so fake pit stops are allowed? I don't know anymore as the rules are constantly changed..

When Sky even points out what merc team did, well, I'm surprised they keep getting away with this?

**tifosi1993** · 2nd September 2018, 15:26

Originally Posted by mwk360

I dont , would love it if ferrari had two actual fast drivers to give mercs hell instead of merc only planning around vet . not even ham considers kimi a threat. maybe leclerc will wake seb up and push him otherwise he will be eaten by leclerc or viceversa, the same old formula is not working and having zero team orders makes it 2 v 1 in the championships

The heck are you talking about. Vettel is our no.1 driver since the start of the season. Did you forget Ferrari gave Vettel the engine upgrade first?

Kimi's job is to beat Bottas and he is doing it just fine.

**FerrariFan** · 2nd September 2018, 15:27

So, just to confirm.

You guys actually think vettel would beat hamilton, verstappen, alonso and Riccardo in todays ferrari??

WOW.

The problem is the driver, the car is fine.

**flam147** · 2nd September 2018, 15:28

Originally Posted by zike

Keep Kimi replace Seb, this will be the second title he lost because he's just stupid

saying sitting on a sofa , with zero split second desisions to make

**DelMar** · 2nd September 2018, 15:28

Originally Posted by FerrariFan

So, just to confirm.

You guys actually think vettel would beat hamilton, verstappen, alonso and Riccardo in todays ferrari??

WOW.

The problem is the driver, the car is fine.

Absolutely, even a driver like Button can beat and outscore Hamilton, Vettel can easily do it.

**doublesixes** · 2nd September 2018, 15:29

Somehow I knew yesterday that by Seb not grabbing pole would be a bad thing for the team. And it was.

**tifosi1993** · 2nd September 2018, 15:29

Originally Posted by FerrariFan

So, just to confirm.

You guys actually think vettel would beat hamilton, verstappen, alonso and Riccardo in todays ferrari??

WOW.

The problem is the driver, the car is fine.

Some guys here think that and most of them are Vettel fans pretending to be Ferrari fan.

Easy to win titles in Newey EBD rocketships.

**Rishu** · 2nd September 2018, 15:30

Originally Posted by Otakukim

The problem with vettel is not race craft, speed. His problem is he tAkes these huge risks. Look at hamilton when in a sticky situation he backs off because he knows that damage or a dnf is bad for his chances. He thinks the long term. Vettel makes these great overtakes but they do bite him. He needs to know that finishing second or third is better than getting a dnf. Live to fight another day. Thats how chanpionships are won

That is what is race craft my friend, choosing your battles to win a war. Blasting past a car which is 1 second slower is not race craft

**mwk360** · 2nd September 2018, 15:30

Originally Posted by tifosi1993

The heck are you talking about. Vettel is our no.1 driver since the start of the season. Did you forget Ferrari gave Vettel the engine upgrade first?

Kimi's job is to beat Bottas and he is doing it just fine.

did you forget kimi having a dnf? there absolutely no reason to sabotage one driver when they are trying to win the WCC, they are trying to make kimi's allocation last till the end without having a penalty. they still racing each other evidenced here in monza