F1 Engine & Component Freeze 2020 and 2021

[ferrari1.8t]

Is this Ferrari acceptance of having a compromised engine part of the deal with FIA? Did FIA say big fine and 2019 championship exclusion or you have to go along with any upcoming decisions we make on PU developments? 2 years of pain or officially disgraced with a fine. May not have been great for share price so took lesser of 2 evils.

We look disgraced anyway, might as well have took it on the chin and been able to develop our engine in season.

[ferrari1.8t]

Another abysmal failure by Ferrari.

1. They should have never agreed to an engine freeze.
2. They should have not shut down the factory, clearly the others didn't and used the time to overhaul the design.

1. It was probably forced as part of the secret settlement. Which is why Merc backed out of the protest because they were guaranteed at least 2 more championships with the engine feeeze.
2. It has been said before, but I will remind you of how hard Italy was hit with Covid; especially the North. Opening the factory was not feasible.

[JPZ]

Is this Ferrari acceptance of having a compromised engine part of the deal with FIA? Did FIA say big fine and 2019 championship exclusion or you have to go along with any upcoming decisions we make on PU developments? 2 years of pain or officially disgraced with a fine. May not have been great for share price so took lesser of 2 evils.

Good points, that could be the reason.

[330 p4]

We look disgraced anyway, might as well have took it on the chin and been able to develop our engine in season.

Yes but as not officially punished by a governing body it's just social media, fans having a go. Officially being called out on cheats affects share price, Ferrari has more to it than just F1 so share price is very important. Also why the top brass went over Wolffs head to Merc boss to shut Wolf down in the Ferrari protest he organised and subsequently pulled out. Probably why he is so peeved. I still am hoping engine has been dragged into line with others and the draggy concept was made with the 2019 engine in mind. If so great gains can be made with sero alone.

[Red is Best]

Is this Ferrari acceptance of having a compromised engine part of the deal with FIA? Did FIA say big fine and 2019 championship exclusion or you have to go along with any upcoming decisions we make on PU developments? 2 years of pain or officially disgraced with a fine. May not have been great for share price so took lesser of 2 evils.

We can only speculate at this point but it seems plausible. Two years in the midfield is a pretty harsh punishment, FIA must have been pretty ****** by what they uncovered.

[WS6TransAm01]

1. It was probably forced as part of the secret settlement. Which is why Merc backed out of the protest because they were guaranteed at least 2 more championships with the engine feeeze.
2. It has been said before, but I will remind you of how hard Italy was hit with Covid; especially the North. Opening the factory was not feasible.

1. We don’t know that for sure. It’s conjecture. Even if that is the case, stand your ground and don’t fold. Did their balls drop off?

2. So what? More than 80% of the deaths in Italy were people older than 70. How many 70 year olds work at the Ferrari F1
Factory?

[Brembo]

Todt the legend clearly worked for Michael full time , at the time, not Ferrari. I believe he will do anything to keep Ferrari out of WCC. Michael retired with Merc, so will Todt. Wheel to wheel combat , not with teamate , will be the way Ferrari comes back as long as they can get near the front. Ignoring Binotto's interviews is also very important. Seb seems to be trying hard to win. Charles is doing his job regardless of all the bad reports on the Ferrari car itself. Drivers do count.

[Tony]

1. It was probably forced as part of the secret settlement. Which is why Merc backed out of the protest because they were guaranteed at least 2 more championships with the engine feeeze.
2. It has been said before, but I will remind you of how hard Italy was hit with Covid; especially the North. Opening the factory was not feasible.

It's an interesting theory, but wasn't the agreement reached before COVID happened? F1 Management would have had to have predicted a shortened season... I think Ferrari just couldn't get back to work safely and it cost them...

[Greig]

1. We don’t know that for sure. It’s conjecture. Even if that is the case, stand your ground and don’t fold. Did their balls drop off?

2. So what? More than 80% of the deaths in Italy were people older than 70. How many 70 year olds work at the Ferrari F1
Factory?

Shut up already, the factory was closed to protect staff and their families.

[Tony79]

Shut up already, the factory was closed to protect staff and their families.

Mate I wouldn’t waste your time - his signature explains it all...

[Vittorio]

Mate I wouldn’t waste your time - his signature explains it all...

How very true.

[S1000RR]

1. We don’t know that for sure. It’s conjecture. Even if that is the case, stand your ground and don’t fold. Did their balls drop off?

2. So what? More than 80% of the deaths in Italy were people older than 70. How many 70 year olds work at the Ferrari F1
Factory?

Holy *****

[tifosi1993]

Engines are just like human heart, doesn't matter how much light and fit you are, if the heart can't pump enough blood you are going to fall.

Aero upgrade alone can't make up 7 tenths deficit on the straights, they can reduce the drag a bit, but it's not gonna make up for the lack of engine power. And it also doesn't matter how much downforce they are gonna add, if the car is going to lose 7-8 tenths because of the lack of power.

[tifosi1993]

Shut up already, the factory was closed to protect staff and their families.

Don't waste your precious time arguing with a MAGA nuts.

[WS6TransAm01]

Awe... triggered much?

Merc kept working and brought upgrades. If you want to win, you do what it takes.

[S1000RR]

Awe... triggered much?

Merc kept working and brought upgrades. If you want to win, you do what it takes.

At what cost? So you are saying more 70+ (grand)fathers, (grand)mothers should have died in order to deliver a better engine, just for entertainment? This is a case of force majeure due to COVID-19, nobody likes it but we all have to deal with it.

[Ferrarichamp]

strange thing is, I have relatives in northern Italy. Not one of them was affected by the virus, nor do they know anyone who was.

[S1000RR]

strange thing is, I have relatives in northern Italy. Not one of them was affected by the virus, nor do they know anyone who was.

wow, they should consider themselves lucky then. In Bergamo northern Italy 60% of the residents have developed antibodies as one of the first cities beeing heavily hit by the outbreak. italian researchers linked the fast spread of the virus with the bad air quality/polution in industrial hart of Italy. At that time, with limited knowledge about the virus and beeing located in the outbreak area I think it was the right call to shut the factories. Anyway, my 2 cents on the current form, we can only hope we get the Aero working and sit it out.

[330 p4]

Engines are just like human heart, doesn't matter how much light and fit you are, if the heart can't pump enough blood you are going to fall.

Aero upgrade alone can't make up 7 tenths deficit on the straights, they can reduce the drag a bit, but it's not gonna make up for the lack of engine power. And it also doesn't matter how much downforce they are gonna add, if the car is going to lose 7-8 tenths because of the lack of power.

Ferrari had a second a lap on the straights v Merc last year but Merc still won. It is possible.

[WS6TransAm01]

At what cost? So you are saying more 70+ (grand)fathers, (grand)mothers should have died in order to deliver a better engine, just for entertainment? This is a case of force majeure due to COVID-19, nobody likes it but we all have to deal with it.

Again, grandma and grandpa aren't working in the engineering department or the factory. They can stay at home, wear masks and so forth. If you are a healthy adult, you'll be fine.

Plus if masks work, why shut down the factory, right?

[tifosi1993]

https://youtu.be/jWkZm7rkVB0

Speed difference:

Straight 1: before the 100 meter board, SF90 330 kph, SF1000 312 kph

Straight 2: before the 100 meter board, SF90 329 kph, SF1000 313 kph

Straight 3: before the 50 mete board. SF90 329 kph, SF1000 314 kph

So combining the speed-gap, We have lost 1.4-1.6 seconds on the straights, but gained around 0.5-0.7 seconds through corners.

[S1000RR]

Again, grandma and grandpa aren't working in the engineering department or the factory. They can stay at home, wear masks and so forth. If you are a healthy adult, you'll be fine.

Plus if masks work, why shut down the factory, right?

The big question is, was it known (back then, almost 4 months ago when these decisions was made) if non-surgical would have helped stop spreading the virus. Is it now? Are elderly people really save when wearing a face mask? I personally don't think so, hence it doesn't eliminate the risk of beeing infected, it only reduces the risk.

Even today there are still questions about the use of these non-surgical face masks in the whole EU.

[WS6TransAm01]

The big question is, was it known (back then, almost 4 months ago when these decisions was made) if non-surgical would have helped stop spreading the virus. Is it now? Are elderly people really save when wearing a face mask? I personally don't think so, hence it doesn't eliminate the risk of beeing infected, it only reduces the risk.

Even today there are still questions about the use of these non-surgical face masks in the whole EU.

So if masks don't work, why are people wearing them?

Ever heard of doublethink?
1- we need masks to protect us from the virus so everyone needs to wear a mark
2- masks are not effective in protecting us so we need to distance and keep things shut down

The virus is real enough, the reaction to it was the biggest fraud ever perpetrated.

Others worked and brought updates during the "shut down", Ferrari was left holding the bag. A car that was already sub-par remained so while those ahead kept improving.

[Ferrarichamp]

some say that wearing a mask all day long weakens your immune system.
I'm no doctor, I wonder if there's a medical doctor among the members here who would have an opinion.

[Cavallino]

[video]https://youtu.be/jWkZm7rkVB0[/url]

Speed difference:

Straight 1: before the 100 meter board, SF90 330 kph, SF1000 312 kph

Straight 2: before the 100 meter board, SF90 329 kph, SF1000 313 kph

Straight 3: before the 50 mete board. SF90 329 kph, SF1000 314 kph

So combining the speed-gap, We have lost 1.4-1.6 seconds on the straights, but gained around 0.5-0.7 seconds through corners.

So last year's engine innovation was worth .5-1 seconds a lap. So I estimate the bspec can bring AT MOST .5 seconds. So in my opinion best case, and this is what I'm hoping for, we can put up a fight with Red Bull in Hungary.

It would be great if we could replicate Alfa's top speed (which is in line with the SF90) without sacrificing cornering speed (downforce). We'd be in line with Merc if we pulled that off. But I wouldn't hold my breath.

Nice work on the numbers btw.

[FerrariF60]

So last year's engine innovation was worth .5-1 seconds a lap. So I estimate the bspec can bring AT MOST .5 seconds. So in my opinion best case, and this is what I'm hoping for, we can put up a fight with Red Bull in Hungary.

It would be great if we could replicate Alfa's top speed (which is in line with the SF90) without sacrificing cornering speed (downforce). We'd be in line with Merc if we pulled that off. But I wouldn't hold my breath.

Nice work on the numbers btw.

I’m sure we can get the speed that Alfa has, but then we’ll be fighting with them and Williams and NOT making it to Q2.....

We have a half decent aero....what’s hurting us is the donkey of this year compared to the stallion we had last year

[WS6TransAm01]

some say that wearing a mask all day long weakens your immune system.
I'm no doctor, I wonder if there's a medical doctor among the members here who would have an opinion.

Any time you prevent your body's immune system from doing what it's designed to do, it becomes weaker. It works through being constantly bombarded by pathogens, it develops antibodies by fighting them off. Think of it this way, what happened to native people in the New World when Europeans arrived with pathogens their immune systems were not prepared to work with?

Plus, wearing a mask reduces O2 levels below the 19.5 OSHA standard and prolonged wearing of masks reduces origination levels in the blood. http://scielo.isciii.es/pdf/neuro/v19n2/3.pdf There are a bunch of videos showing how O2 levels in the blood don't drop by wearing a mask, the funny part is that none of them take time into account. Yes after 10 minutes it's okay, what about 6 hours?

[Cavallino]

I’m sure we can get the speed that Alfa has, but then we’ll be fighting with them and Williams and NOT making it to Q2.....

We have a half decent aero....what’s hurting us is the donkey of this year compared to the stallion we had last year

Right, the key is EFFICIENT downforce.

I somewhat disagree that our aero is half decent. I think we put on a bunch of dirty downforce thinking we'd have a stallion in our car, while we only have a donkey.

[Kyss4k]

Right, the key is EFFICIENT downforce.

I somewhat disagree that our aero is half decent. I think we put on a bunch of dirty downforce thinking we'd have a stallion in our car, while we only have a donkey.

It's freaking difficult to find the "clean" downforce these days. Floor is heavily regulated, which is the main part to create a cheap downforce. You can't use exhaust fumes, no flexi bodywork is allowed... We would have to come up with something revolutionary to gain cheap downforce, as every other thing you can do with the car is just creating a dirty downforce and finding the ballance. You can see, when looking at the bodyshape, that all of the top teams have similar shapes. They are all on the limit and there are just tiny differences. Matter of tenths. And to gain a full second... wow, that would have to be huge.

[Warp]

I can't really understand the Token system. So we spend 2 tokens to improve the engine?