SF23 Discussion Thread

[The Architect]

What a turd of a car this one turned out to be. 4th best, behind RB, AM and Merc. After the previous race, I thought it might end up like the SF16 - not the best, but second best at the beginning while creeping down the order over the course of the year. That turned out to be too generous.

Is the concept rescuable? I don't think so given the recent departures. Even Merc were better on race pace. Would I trust the current technical department to replicate RB and even AM? No. I just don't see any positives. Those pre-season notes of optimism are up in smoke once again.

[Schumiklub]

Fred said the car has potential but not enough to catch RB, so basically the concept is a bust and we need something completely new. This direction is not the right one, obviously. I really hoped they would adopt the RB style over the winter.

[JPZ]

If Ferrari cannot iron out the issues with the SF-23 concept they will have to imitate the Red Bull design.

We will see how it goes, perhaps Ferrari are able to develop the car to be competitive.

Last year's car was super fast over one lap, so there surely is some potential in the concept.

[brucewayne]

At the end of the day, we are not able to run our floor as low as RB.

[JacKy]

This is 2018-2019 s*it period all over again.

We had a good car in 2018 and fail to keep up with Mercedes. Binotto screwed the good areas of the 2018’s car and made it worse in 2019.

We are having exactly same scenario right now.

[brucewayne]

There are already rumours that we will switch to the RB concept for 2024…

[FerrariF60]

There are already rumours that we will switch to the RB concept for 2024…

personally i think that it is a NO brainer to switch to that concept as lots of teams have and they are more competitive compared to last year, whereas WE seem to have ONLY made baby steps if not worse than last year's 175

so that means another WRITE OFF year for Ferrari this year

be interesting if these rumors are INDEED true and weather we will also implement pullrod front suspension like red bull has on their car..

[ferrari1.8t]

So Mercedes can create B spec cars in season, but Ferrari can’t under the budget cap? No creativity at Ferrari, no urgency. There’s always next year in their minds instead of this year.

https://twitter.com/vetteleclerc/sta...S8vB9StqkETAsA

[FerrariF60]

So Mercedes can create B spec cars in season, but Ferrari can’t under the budget cap? No creativity at Ferrari, no urgency. There’s always next year in their minds instead of this year.

https://twitter.com/vetteleclerc/sta...S8vB9StqkETAsA

yup, Ferrari want to play it by the book and NOT overspend during the existing year, while Merc shoes the FIA the finger and does what it takes to fight at teh front obviously not giving a crap about the current budget cap

Ferrari on the other hand, we'll try next year...........that's a mentality of a winning team.....hmmmm i mean LOSER team

[drax]

Might as well use last years car

“ This was a disastrous race, given the pre-race expectation, with an SF-23 about 7-tenths slower than last year’s F1-75.”

https://www.formu1a.uno/en/ferrari-s...-or-just-slow/

[brucewayne]

Might as well use last years car

“ This was a disastrous race, given the pre-race expectation, with an SF-23 about 7-tenths slower than last year’s F1-75.”

https://www.formu1a.uno/en/ferrari-s...-or-just-slow/

Not comparable, as we had to change our car after TD039.

[brucewayne]

yup, Ferrari want to play it by the book and NOT overspend during the existing year, while Merc shoes the FIA the finger and does what it takes to fight at teh front obviously not giving a crap about the current budget cap

Ferrari on the other hand, we'll try next year...........that's a mentality of a winning team.....hmmmm i mean LOSER team

We won’t be competitive until late of 2024, earliest.

[ferrari1.8t]

yup, Ferrari want to play it by the book and NOT overspend during the existing year, while Merc shoes the FIA the finger and does what it takes to fight at teh front obviously not giving a crap about the current budget cap

Ferrari on the other hand, we'll try next year...........that's a mentality of a winning team.....hmmmm i mean LOSER team

Merc has the luxury of the FIA in their back pocket to back any changes or expenditures needed. They also have the Sky crew who will use non-stop propaganda to help the cause. They have already started complaining and siding with Hamilton that Verstappen’s RedBull is the most dominant car of all time. These guys are all begging for a rule change or something to get their crybaby winning again.

I guess Hamilton already forgot about the 8 years of Merc dominance when they had so much in the tank they could lap the field. They also had the benefit of tokens and locked in regulations among other things. We tifosi and F1 fans had to endure it. Sky was quiet then…now that Hamilton isn’t winning it’s a problem? What hypocrites!

https://www.skysports.com/amp/f1/new...max-verstappen

Did kraptiz forget about 2021 when Merc was slapping a new PU every weekend into Hamilton’s car and he was breezing past the field from the back? Of course he did. Then it was all driver, and now it’s all car.

https://www.planetf1.com/news/david-...attle-f1-v-f2/

The same goes for the presidents of the hamilton-Merc fan club crofty and brundle. These guys are all a joke.

Rant over./



Whatever happens, I hope ferrari has plans to make gains this year. Give us some hope.

[brucewayne]

Merc has the luxury of the FIA in their back pocket to back any changes or expenditures needed. They also have the Sky crew who will use non-stop propaganda to help the cause. They have already started complaining and siding with Hamilton that Verstappen’s RedBull is the most dominant car of all time. These guys are all begging for a rule change or something to get their crybaby winning again.

I guess Hamilton already forgot about the 8 years of Merc dominance when they had so much in the tank they could lap the field. They also had the benefit of tokens and locked in regulations among other things. We tifosi and F1 fans had to endure it. Sky was quiet then…now that Hamilton isn’t winning it’s a problem? What hypocrites!

https://www.skysports.com/amp/f1/new...max-verstappen

Did kraptiz forget about 2021 when Merc was slapping a new PU every weekend into Hamilton’s car and he was breezing past the field from the back? Of course he did. Then it was all driver, and now it’s all car.

https://www.planetf1.com/news/david-...attle-f1-v-f2/

The same goes for the presidents of the hamilton-Merc fan club crofty and brundle. These guys are all a joke.

Rant over./



Whatever happens, I hope ferrari has plans to make gains this year. Give us some hope.

Different times. There is a budget cap to make sure that no team is so much faster like Mercedes was in the past. In addition, it seems that every decision regarding rule changes seem to benefit RB. 2021s floor changes, development freeze of the PU, TD039. We suffer from weak management from 2019-2022.

[paolo lalli]

Its very hard for ferrari to copy a concept of another team it goes against the DNA of ferrari.They will perservere with there own concept no matter the results this is the way the organisation operates ferrari will not copy or adopt they design and innovate if works fantastic if it doesn't persist.Ferrari has the resources to do a lance stroll many times over and clone a redbull Aston Martin ******* ,big deal and it won't win the championship.Remember f1 teams secrets are good for about 1 season then what? Aston landed a redbull employee with knowledge.Next year they will be scratching there balls because redbull would have evolved further ferrari will have there car right and mercedes will be all over it again,Aston will feel the pain there will be no poaching of staff they will be locked in contractually and stroll will be watching how copying and poaching has only a limited life span in f1.

[tpe]

Car is awful.
Glimpses of relative speed, but it's 1sec behind RB.
I watched a lot of on boards with Leclerc.
The car porpoises a lot. Not as violent as last year, but it does.

[brucewayne]

Car is awful.
Glimpses of relative speed, but it's 1sec behind RB.
I watched a lot of on boards with Leclerc.
The car porpoises a lot. Not as violent as last year, but it does.

I actually think that this is still our main problem. Porpoising isn’t really solved, so we can’t run the car as low as needed, too stiff suspension etc. Yesterday we couldn’t fire the hards up.

[Brembo]

I remember when Russell and Lewis were almost flying out of there car during races where porpoising was a problem ;not able to get out of their car! Their doing OK now . How can Ferrari still be that far behind on the issue?

[Tifoso]

i am usually a very optimistic guy and will continue to be for a few more races.
Just out of curiosity, and I've asked this a billion times, is there a one spec series that has Ferrari's racing other manufacturers, and airs in the USA?

[TTRSMAD]

Its very hard for ferrari to copy a concept of another team it goes against the DNA of ferrari.They will perservere with there own concept no matter the results this is the way the organisation operates ferrari will not copy or adopt they design and innovate if works fantastic if it doesn't persist.Ferrari has the resources to do a lance stroll many times over and clone a redbull Aston Martin ******* ,big deal and it won't win the championship.Remember f1 teams secrets are good for about 1 season then what? Aston landed a redbull employee with knowledge.Next year they will be scratching there balls because redbull would have evolved further ferrari will have there car right and mercedes will be all over it again,Aston will feel the pain there will be no poaching of staff they will be locked in contractually and stroll will be watching how copying and poaching has only a limited life span in f1.

Ferrari have missed a trick with the floor. Ferrari never recovered from TD39. What changes between qualifying trim and race trim: the weight of 100kg of fuel. How can Red Bull achieve that top speed without unloading the rear wing.

They probably adapted their high rake vehicle dynamics concepts to the new regulation. Whatever it is, Newey is the master of floor dynamics and until Ferrari get themselves one that excels in the field we wont be able to compete.

This is the exhaust blown diffusor saga 2.0. It is sad but it's the reality. Look at Aston Martin how they are performing, they poached Dan Fallows from Red Bull who knows the magic of the RB18.

Did you guys see how Verstappen was flying with DRS, it was crazy how fast he was in the slip stream.

[paolo lalli]

Yes a magnificent f1 car can do that.

[JPZ]

The F310-B was heavily inspired by the FW18 Williams, so I think they would go that approach of 'inspiration' if necessary.

However, I think they will stick to the current concept and maybe incorporate some ideas from the Red Bull design, especially the floor.

As mentioned, seems like it's more something related to the floor, and not necessarily the side-pod design.

[tpe]

People focus one concept, aka sodepoods, while the magic is in the floor, and the suspension (probably equally important).

I don't think they are able to recover, for many years. Actually, even after 2026 they will struggle if they continue like this. They need new ideas, aka, new hires. Not necessarily big names, directors etc. They usually can't contribute that much. But senior engineers or even inspired juniors. And they have to be left to work without any interraction with the existing design team, just because they need new ideas. They didn't need anyone over their shoulders to scream "it's not working".

[tpe]

One more thing. The only 2 teams that manage the tires well, are RB and AM. Provided that AM uses the same suspension as Mercedes, one can speculate that the aero concept is responsible for the vast differences between the teams. But I think it's more than that. Suspension settings are what makes the difference between the cars. So, there is something that Ferrari is (and the rest 8 teams are) missing.

[wisepie]

Something about the TD39 which appeared to scupper any hope we had in 2022, along with reliability and not being able to use full power, completely undid the good points on the F1-75 and we are struggling to get that performance back with the SF23. We have to accept that Red Bull is likely to run away with the championship this year unless there is something about their car which is outside the rules and it gets penailsed the same way that Ferrari have been penalised in every recent season, when they have been in the same position and able to win! I smell many rats!

[FerrariF60]

Something about the TD39 which appeared to scupper any hope we had in 2022, along with reliability and not being able to use full power, has completely undone the good points on the F1-75 and we are struggling to get that performance back. We have to accept that Red Bull is likely to run away with the championship this year unless there is something about their car which is outside the rules and it gets penailsed the same way that Ferrari have been penalised in every recent season, when they have been in the same position and able to win! I smell many rats!

for that to happen, someone HAS to have teh balls to say anything....someone like Toto or Fred??? maybe....Fred is still new to the team so that prolly won't happen.

[FerrariF60]

Something about the TD39 which appeared to scupper any hope we had in 2022, along with reliability and not being able to use full power, has completely undone the good points on the F1-75 and we are struggling to get that performance back. We have to accept that Red Bull is likely to run away with the championship this year unless there is something about their car which is outside the rules and it gets penailsed the same way that Ferrari have been penalised in every recent season, when they have been in the same position and able to win! I smell many rats!

for that to happen, someone HAS to have teh balls to say anything....someone like Toto or Fred??? maybe....Fred is still new to the team so that prolly won't happen.

[patrese86]

We basically let Toto accuse our TP and others of purposely endangering the safety of our drivers for a performance gain which was complete BS. Our car wasn't dangerous and we would never put success before safety, it was an outrageous claim.

[JChan]

We basically let Toto accuse our TP and others of purposely endangering the safety of our drivers for a performance gain which was complete BS. Our car wasn't dangerous and we would never put success before safety, it was an outrageous claim.

there's no turning back

[subfire91]

i said it before and im saying it again. the enforcement of TD039 midseason was a scandal. FIA cancelled our car's concept overnight. you should not be able to intervene and cancel a team's concept when 2 years of development and tenths of millions were poured into it. especially when it was not illegal. we were managing porpoising and the drivers could get along with it. our car was designed to run as lower to the ground as possible and they destroyed it. at least they should do what they did with DAS, let the season end and then enforce it.