Sweet and sour Victory

[Greig]

Someone should have had a chat with him before the race dude and told him the situation. That way, Massa could have aimed at Vettel instead of wasting his time taking the lead.

And that would not de-motivate him then? there was no easy way to do it, no way they could do it without annoying Felipe sadly.

[theodorus8864]

I love it when people lecture on what a Ferrari fan should be. It's so telling of the individual.

For sure, the lesson which is needed the most especially for 'those' who are too bias over one side and stop looking a bigger picture. This lecture definitely needs to get in 'their' heads.

[Tifosi]

And that would not de-motivate him then? there was no easy way to do it, no way they could do it without annoying Felipe sadly.

If they'd done it way before the race Greig, both Ferrari and Massa's reputation would still be intact.

[Greig]

If they'd done it way before the race Greig, both Ferrari and Massa's reputation would still be intact.

Don't see how this has affected Massa's reputation, enhanced it maybe but still would he be de-motivated to go for it if told before hand that he can't win if a 1-2?

[redb]

about the only possitive out of this is how the English press is frothing out of the mouth at this, as if Mclaren are such squeaky clean team....

Shows how scare they are of a resurgent Ferrari

[Tifosi]

Don't see how this has affected Massa's reputation, enhanced it maybe but still would he be de-motivated to go for it if told before hand that he can't win if a 1-2?

He's a pro, not a puppet.

See Brazilian press for details on his reputation.....

[Greig]

He's a pro, not a puppet.

See Brazilian press for details on his reputation.....

What have the Brazilian press said? All drivers are puppets somewhat

Why did he move if not a puppet?

[Tech_Skill]

about the only possitive out of this is how the English press is frothing out of the mouth at this, as if Mclaren are such squeaky clean team....

Shows how scare they are of a resurgent Ferrari

It really does, they are crapping it, i promise you, anyhow Alonso was to win in hungrary or close in on the championship lead, it would be full scale panic, i promise you they will be begging to WMC to dock him points.

It's just like the good old days when Schumacher took a sh!t on anyone who ever drove in Britain from 1994-2006

[racingbradley]

To recap the race I watched, Massa had a great start and put himself into 1st place, he then pulled out a 5.5 second lead over Alonso, struggled for a couple of laps on the new tyres and drove off into the lead again, Smedly told Massa earlier "come on you can win this" and Massa drove in a way we hadnt seen for a long time..

If we consider the fuel side, To achieve those gaps Massa was burning fuel to do everything he needed to win, and with a 1/3rd of the race to go was saving fuel to get to the finish. JOB DONE. Then that fatal descision to swap cars because Alonso was was closing the gap, Then the fatal message to Massa (badly delivered ) followed by an inept publicity guy on TV.

Ken I so agree with everything you have said.
No driver is bigger than the team but I think we should be grown up enough to accept our mistakes/bad decisions.
My heart went out to Massa yesterday----he believed he could do it and he would of have. Now he is totally demoralised. Later in the season if it is not mathematically possible he would have been the perfect team player but yesterday was too early and what a day to do it to him on the anniversary of the crash-------------------
I always believed that Ferrari were a "caring" team!!!!!!!
I am disappointed in Stefano---still think it was his job to relay the "message" not Rob.
Ken stay with us you write some great posts.

[Tifosi]

What have the Brazilian press said? All drivers are puppets somewhat

Why did he move if not a puppet?

I said he's pro, not a puppet. I didn't say Ferrari aren't treating him like one!

[Greig]

I said he's pro, not a puppet. I didn't say Ferrari aren't treating him like one!

He had no problem being a puppet in 2006 and 2007

[Stormsearcher]

Ken I so agree with everything you have said.
No driver is bigger than the team but I think we should be grown up enough to accept our mistakes/bad decisions.
My heart went out to Massa yesterday----he believed he could do it and he would of have. Now he is totally demoralised. Later in the season if it is not mathematically possible he would have been the perfect team player but yesterday was too early and what a day to do it to him on the anniversary of the crash-------------------
I always believed that Ferrari were a "caring" team!!!!!!!
I am disappointed in Stefano---still think it was his job to relay the "message" not Rob.
Ken stay with us you write some great posts.

We would have been in big trouble (if we arent already) if stefano had relayed the message. Then it would be more apparent than it already is.. that it was team orders.
Massas race engineer speaks to him all the time.. it was his job to do it.

[Stormsearcher]

He had no problem being a puppet in 2006 and 2007

Good point. He played second fiddle to schumacher very quietly.
Besides i dont think he is being a puppet here.. Hes been given as much chance as alonso before this race.

[Greig]

Good point. He played second fiddle to schumacher very quietly.
Besides i dont think he is being a puppet here.. Hes been given as much chance as alonso before this race.

Indeed he was given equal chance for 10 races and the time came that a decision had to be made, but still some think he has had a title ripped away from him or something

[Ted]

SHAME SHAME FERRARI . I love Ferrari wether they win loose or draw. BUT NOT when they bring discredit to the sport I love . It's the world DRIVERS championship and I want to see the driver win who DESERVES to win. POOR Massa. He's NOT a paid actor . He's a PROFESSIONAL RACING DRIVER MORALLY CHARGED WITH THE DUTY TO DO HIS VERY VERY BEST IN DRIVING THE CAR. Anything less disqualifies him from the label RACING DRIVER and robs the fans and public of the TRUTH of COMPETITION. To expect Massa to be all love and light after that SHAMEFUL SHAM is asking waaaayyy tooo much. I believe that he should have driven for the win. As for Alonso. I really think that if he does win the championship that HE WON'T DESERVE IT and get NO CONGRATULATIONS FROM ME. He cried at McLaren when THEY would not LET him win. Of course he is a great driver. BUT Mr Alonso, IF you wish to win DRIVE FASTER

[Tifosi]

Indeed he was given equal chance for 10 races and the time came that a decision had to be made, but still some think he has had a title ripped away from him or something

Who thinks that? That would be silly.

He had the race ripped away from him and his status in the team publically announced in the most unprofessional way possible. The decision was made on the hoof and they did a prat fall. Massa & Smedley played their part in that too i'll agree but the fact that we let it happen is pretty daft. What's clearly oblivious to some is that we moved back in time to the non-fanatic with the biggest and most unnecessary PR mess up we could have imagined.

Still, we can proudly hug the points and go blah-blah-blah until it goes away again cos that's what we did last time.

[Effone]

SHAME SHAME FERRARI . I love Ferrari wether they win loose or draw. BUT NOT when they bring discredit to the sport I love . It's the world DRIVERS championship and I want to see the driver win who DESERVES to win. POOR Massa. He's NOT a paid actor . He's a PROFESSIONAL RACING DRIVER MORALLY CHARGED WITH THE DUTY TO DO HIS VERY VERY BEST IN DRIVING THE CAR. Anything less disqualifies him from the label RACING DRIVER and robs the fans and public of the TRUTH of COMPETITION. To expect Massa to be all love and light after that SHAMEFUL SHAM is asking waaaayyy tooo much. I believe that he should have driven for the win. As for Alonso. I really think that if he does win the championship that HE WON'T DESERVE IT and get NO CONGRATULATIONS FROM ME. He cried at McLaren when THEY would not LET him win. Of course he is a great driver. BUT Mr Alonso, IF you wish to win DRIVE FASTER

Agree 100% and thats the way a LOT of people see it..

[Hermann]

Agree 100% and thats the way a LOT of people see it..

Has it been seen the same way when Heikki had to move over for Hamilton (race fixing), Button to let Hamilton in front (race fixing), Massa to move over for Kimi (race fixing and championship winning)? I'm sure there are many more examples. How have those things been seen? Just wondering....

[Tech_Skill]

Has it been seen the same way when Heikki had to move over for Hamilton (race fixing), Button to let Hamilton in front (race fixing), Massa to move over for Kimi (race fixing and championship winning)? I'm sure there are many more examples. How have those things been seen? Just wondering....

Those dont involve Alonso, so it doesnt count.

This is how it works, They say Alonso cant handle a fast team mate and that when Massa starts outqualifying him, Alonso will cry and start turning on Ferrari.

Alonso handed Massa his ass in race and Quali for 90% of the season, then its ''Massa hasnt recovered from the accident''

Massa has 1 good race where he was leading Alonso, the team made right call to favour the driver most capable of winning the WDC for them and that = ''Alonso cant beat Massa fair and square, the team are favouring him, the contracts say he has to win"

The British media are hysterical where Alonso is concerned for obvious reasons.

[alonsonum1]

i have just sat and read the 7 pages of this thread ... i just can not believe some of the comments on here. yes we are all upset with the result from yday and i can appreciate the reasons why but guys this is a team sport and sometimes decisions need to be made for the best interest of our team. i just think if i was fernando, felipe or infact anyone who works at Ferrari, if they were to log onto this site and see their so called FANS i think they would be appauled.... the thing is u r all f1 ferrari fans and like it or lump it u can not change the decisions that have been made.

[Tech_Skill]

i have just sat and read the 7 pages of this thread ... i just can not believe some of the comments on here. yes we are all upset with the result from yday and i can appreciate the reasons why but guys this is a team sport and sometimes decisions need to be made for the best interest of our team. i just think if i was fernando, felipe or infact anyone who works at Ferrari, if they were to log onto this site and see their so called FANS i think they would be appauled.... the thing is u r all f1 ferrari fans and like it or lump it u can not change the decisions that have been made.

cool. as long as you know if next season Alonso is too far behind massa, he is playing number 2 right?

Or he goes and drives for Mercedes GP.

[Effone]

cool. as long as you know if next season Alonso is too far behind massa, he is playing number 2 right?

Or he goes and drives for Mercedes GP.

Satan will skate to work before that happens..

[Greig]

Who thinks that? That would be silly.

He had the race ripped away from him and his status in the team publically announced in the most unprofessional way possible. The decision was made on the hoof and they did a prat fall. Massa & Smedley played their part in that too i'll agree but the fact that we let it happen is pretty daft. What's clearly oblivious to some is that we moved back in time to the non-fanatic with the biggest and most unnecessary PR mess up we could have imagined.

Still, we can proudly hug the points and go blah-blah-blah until it goes away again cos that's what we did last time.

Ok this is a never ending circle, let us know when you are no longer ashamed of your team

[Tech_Skill]

Satan will skate to work before that happens..

obviously, no way is massa gonna get that far ahead of alonso.

[Nova]

SHAME SHAME FERRARI . I love Ferrari wether they win loose or draw. BUT NOT when they bring discredit to the sport I love . It's the world DRIVERS championship and I want to see the driver win who DESERVES to win. POOR Massa. He's NOT a paid actor . He's a PROFESSIONAL RACING DRIVER MORALLY CHARGED WITH THE DUTY TO DO HIS VERY VERY BEST IN DRIVING THE CAR. Anything less disqualifies him from the label RACING DRIVER and robs the fans and public of the TRUTH of COMPETITION. To expect Massa to be all love and light after that SHAMEFUL SHAM is asking waaaayyy tooo much. I believe that he should have driven for the win. As for Alonso. I really think that if he does win the championship that HE WON'T DESERVE IT and get NO CONGRATULATIONS FROM ME. He cried at McLaren when THEY would not LET him win. Of course he is a great driver. BUT Mr Alonso, IF you wish to win DRIVE FASTER

Who are you? Shame Ferrari? Ferrari won dude, you have 2 posts..where'd u come from??? I hate it when Mac fans show up just to diss Ferrari....

[straycat]

after valencia and s'stone, who cares what the brit media thinks. their team is not keeping the pace and everyone knows they have "never" used team order tactics. expect more attacks before the season ends. filipe let the team down by his lack of discretion, sorry but that is how i see it.

[Tech_Skill]

Who are you? Shame Ferrari? Ferrari won dude, you have 2 posts..where'd u come from??? I hate it when Mac fans show up just to diss Ferrari....

They are proper rattled, cant remember the last time I saw so many Suicidal Mclaren fans, The FIA should take our 100k and set up a help line for them, I dont wanna see them do anything silly.

[Tifosi]

Ok this is a never ending circle, let us know when you are no longer ashamed of your team

That's the kind of comment that serves only to antagonise and not to debate

I have seen you criticise Ferrari yet you support them. Am I not allowed to do the same?

Is criticism only appropriate when it loses us points?

I support my team yes...... and yes i was ashamed of yesterday and will continue to be, despite knowing why they did it. The two aren't mutually exclusive - tidy though that might be!

[Hermann]

after valencia and s'stone, who cares what the brit media thinks. their team is not keeping the pace and everyone knows they have "never" used team order tactics. expect more attacks before the season ends. filipe let the team down by his lack of discretion, sorry but that is how i see it.

The FIA cares what the british media thinks. Thats my oppinion. If not, why there was absolutely no fuss about McLaren doing exactly the same (including the radio message) with Heikki in german GP 2008?

Maybe because Hamilton was on their 'list' to win the title in that year? And maybe Fernando is not on their 'list' for this year? Or maybe i am just being 'paranoid'. Who knows.

As for Felipe, come to think about it, yes it looks like this. For some, he even did the right thing, for others, he turned his back to the team with that. Depends on your point of view, i suppose.

[Fiondella]

Who thinks that? That would be silly.

He had the race ripped away from him and his status in the team publically announced in the most unprofessional way possible. The decision was made on the hoof and they did a prat fall. Massa & Smedley played their part in that too i'll agree but the fact that we let it happen is pretty daft. What's clearly oblivious to some is that we moved back in time to the non-fanatic with the biggest and most unnecessary PR mess up we could have imagined.

Still, we can proudly hug the points and go blah-blah-blah until it goes away again cos that's what we did last time.

Does your avatar suggest that it was black day for you? PR mess give it a rest, schumacher, Brundle and even DC were very objective in their views. Only looney tunes Eddie Jordon lauched a vitriolic attack cue the normal anti-ferrari uk press reaction. I say fantastic job by everyone at Ferrari including Stefano in handling that idiot on live TV